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Old 28.06.2021, 17:55
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Re: Coronavirus

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I think there might be a little more evidence now (in support of that theory) than there was in the Spring of 2020. But there is no evidence that I've come across that actually proves it or is substantial enough for me to say or think that the virus definitely came from a leak at the Wuhan lab.

And that's part of my problem with the lab leak theory, as it now stands -- that I see too many people saying that it definitely came from a leak at the lab and refusing to acknowledge the possibility that it didn't.
What does "a little more evidence" mean? Either there is evidence or not; it is a black and white situation.
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Old 28.06.2021, 17:57
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Re: Coronavirus

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Donald Trump has said a lot of dumb things about Covid, though it is remarkable how on the key points he has been proven right. For example the IFM, he questioned the figure the 3.4% the WHO calculated early on saying it was likely to be “a fraction of 1 percent”. Turns out he was actually right (and was accused of spreading misinformation at the time )!

https://www.vox.com/2020/3/5/2116603...who-death-rate

Same goes for the drugs that he took to recover from Covid, dismissed as misinformation, also turns out he was right!

https://twitter.com/LBC/status/1405065114835881986

Looking like it only being a matter of time now before it's proven to have come from a lab too, just like Donald Trump said.
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On September 16 2019, an explosion occurred at the biosafety level 4 (BSL-4) State Research Centre of Virology and Biotechnology building (Vector) in Koltsovo, in the Novosiberisk region of Siberia, Russia (1). The explosion was allegedly caused by a gas cylinder, and was followed by a fire. The fire spread through the ventilation system and affected an area of 30 square meters. The explosion on the fifth floor of the six-storey building shattered all the glass in the building. An official statement by the Russian government indicated that no pathogens or risk was present, yet Vector contains the largest collection of security-sensitive pathogens known. A gas explosion can propagate a shock wave at speeds of 1500-2000 metres/second. The flame propagates at a much slower speed (typically 20-25 m/second and up to several 100 m/second) (1). Unburned gas is propagated ahead of the flame, therefore, if any pathogens were present, they may have been aerosolised well outside of the building at subsonic speeds, ahead of the fire and before the fire was widespread
then later on some guys from Novosibirsk visited Wuhan

then...you know what happens then..
  #26743  
Old 28.06.2021, 18:03
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Re: Coronavirus

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then later on some guys from Novosibirsk visited Wuhan

then...you know what happens then..
The big clue was these guys from Novosibirsk were delivered on bio-safe stretchers.
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Old 28.06.2021, 19:43
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Re: Coronavirus

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What does "a little more evidence" mean? Either there is evidence or not; it is a black and white situation.
Well, maybe it isn't a black and white situation in the sense that it seems to depend on what one does or does not consider possible evidence, particularly at this point -- that hazy gray area of human perception. So perhaps I should have included the word "possible" in my previous comment (i.e. "possible evidence"). Also not black-and-white in the sense that no one really seems to know for sure where or how the virus originated / was released into the human population. As it is now, there are only hypotheses.

Deleted coronavirus genome sequences trigger scientific intrigue
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-01731-3

New Info Continues to Feed Lab-Leak COVID-19 Theories, at Least Circumstantially
https://www.biospace.com/article/new...cumstantially/

But again, as I had stated earlier, I have no solid opinions on this. I cannot say for certain that the virus was accidentally leaked from the Wuhan lab, and I also cannot say for certain that it was not. I'm not entirely sure that anyone really has that ability, at this point.
  #26745  
Old 28.06.2021, 20:17
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Re: Coronavirus

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Well, maybe it isn't a black and white situation in the sense that it seems to depend on what one does or does not consider possible evidence, particularly at this point -- that hazy gray area of human perception. So perhaps I should have included the word "possible" in my previous comment (i.e. "possible evidence"). Also not black-and-white in the sense that no one really seems to know for sure where or how the virus originated / was released into the human population. As it is now, there are only hypotheses.

Deleted coronavirus genome sequences trigger scientific intrigue
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-01731-3

New Info Continues to Feed Lab-Leak COVID-19 Theories, at Least Circumstantially
https://www.biospace.com/article/new...cumstantially/

But again, as I had stated earlier, I have no solid opinions on this. I cannot say for certain that the virus was accidentally leaked from the Wuhan lab, and I also cannot say for certain that it was not. I'm not entirely sure that anyone really has that ability, at this point.
That is not evidence, that is speculation.

Those links are out of date, the "Deleted coronavirus genome sequences" have been recovered without an epiphany. It is very difficult to completely delete any information held in a database, there are always backups, multiple copies &&&.

In the second link, it states " the genome of that virus, RaTG13, has a genetic sequence that is 96.2% similar to SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19." To the unscientific, it sounds significant but that is actually quite a big difference!

Please note that Chimps, Humans 96 Percent the Same, Gene Study Finds
And surprisingly cats are 90% the same as us.

Despite the huge variations between us humans, we are all 99% the same.
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  #26746  
Old 28.06.2021, 20:23
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Re: Coronavirus

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That is not evidence, that is speculation.

Those links are out of date, the "Deleted coronavirus genome sequences" have been recovered without an epiphany. It is very difficult to completely delete any information held in a database, there are always backups, multiple copies &&&.

In the second link, it states " the genome of that virus, RaTG13, has a genetic sequence that is 96.2% similar to SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19." To the unscientific, it sounds significant but that is actually quite a big difference!

Please note that Chimps, Humans 96 Percent the Same, Gene Study Finds
And surprisingly cats are 90% the same as us.

Despite the huge variations between us humans, we are all 99% the same.
Like I said, I should have probably used the word "possible" before the word "evidence" in my first post -- the one you first replied to. Because what I feel like you're doing is taking what I said out of context or trying to exaggerate it into something other than what I was intending or actually implying.

Anyways... I am extremely tired this evening and have a bruxism headache so I probably shouldn't even be having this conversation. It sucks when you come on to the EF and just end up in an ongoing debate with someone. I am too exhausted right now for that.
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  #26747  
Old 28.06.2021, 20:26
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Re: Coronavirus

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Anyways... I am extremely tired this evening and have a bruxism headache so I probably shouldn't even be having this conversation. It sucks when you come on to the EF and just end up in an ongoing debate with someone. I am too exhausted right now for that.
Hope you feel better soon! You have one of those ‚night guard‘ bite things to avoid grinding your teeth too much?
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  #26748  
Old 28.06.2021, 20:35
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Re: Coronavirus

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Hope you feel better soon! You have one of those ‚night guard‘ bite things to avoid grinding your teeth too much?
Thank you <3 Yeah, I have one that goes over my two front teeth but then I just clench on that, if I wear it. Magnesium supplements in the evening definitely seem to help (and just trying to keep my cortisol low, which sometimes requires avoiding the EF. lol). So now I'm just counting the minutes until it's my son's bed time so then I can take some magnesium and an epsom salt bath and get to bed.

Martin... If you see this, I admit, I've found all this lab leak stuff extremely confusing -- to a point where I feel like I can't seem to form any real solid opinions about any of it. So thanks for setting me straight, regarding those links.
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  #26749  
Old 28.06.2021, 20:42
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Re: Coronavirus

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Thank you <3 Yeah, I have one that goes over my two front teeth but then I just clench on that, if I wear it. Magnesium supplements in the evening definitely seem to help (and just trying to keep my cortisol low, which sometimes requires avoiding the EF. lol). So now I'm just counting the minutes until it's my son's bed time so then I can take some magnesium and an epsom salt bath and get to bed.

Martin... If you see this, I admit, I've found all this lab leak stuff extremely confusing -- to a point where I feel like I can't seem to form any real solid opinions about any of it. So thanks for setting me straight, regarding those links.
Its not confusing. There's just no smoking gun.
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  #26750  
Old 28.06.2021, 20:48
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Re: Coronavirus

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Thank you <3 Yeah, I have one that goes over my two front teeth but then I just clench on that, if I wear it. Magnesium supplements in the evening definitely seem to help (and just trying to keep my cortisol low, which sometimes requires avoiding the EF. lol). So now I'm just counting the minutes until it's my son's bed time so then I can take some magnesium and an epsom salt bath and get to bed.

Martin... If you see this, I admit, I've found all this lab leak stuff extremely confusing -- to a point where I feel like I can't seem to form any real solid opinions about any of it. So thanks for setting me straight, regarding those links.
No worries, I have no solid opinions either.

Get well soon; remember this is an internet forum full of 12-year-olds past their bedtimes.
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  #26751  
Old 28.06.2021, 21:21
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Re: Coronavirus

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Its not confusing. There's just no smoking gun.
Yeah, I guess that's essentially what I mean. But maybe I would find it less confusing if I had been following all of it more closely. I admit that the lab leak theory isn't at the top of my list of interests. And as Marton pointed out, the information in the links I had included in my post earlier is now outdated. It makes me wonder if outdated information that still lingers on the web might be part of the problem in terms of the spread of misinformation, etc.

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No worries, I have no solid opinions either.

Get well soon; remember this is an internet forum full of 12-year-olds past their bedtimes.
Ha haa!!! Thanks.
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  #26752  
Old 29.06.2021, 14:38
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Re: Coronavirus

Todays published numbers 129 out of 16 k tests

8 hospitalisations
2 death

https://www.20min.ch/story/das-ist-d...z-136662375229

Compared to last week tuesday 130 out of 17 k tests

13 hospitalisations
1 death
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  #26753  
Old 29.06.2021, 15:11
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Re: Coronavirus

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Todays published numbers 129 out of 16 k tests

8 hospitalisations
2 death

https://www.20min.ch/story/das-ist-d...z-136662375229

Compared to last week tuesday 130 out of 17 k tests

13 hospitalisations
1 death
And here comes delta...
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Old 29.06.2021, 15:13
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Re: Coronavirus

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And here comes delta...
What I was thinking, positivity ticking up.
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Old 29.06.2021, 15:25
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Re: Coronavirus

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What I was thinking, positivity ticking up.
Au contraire, reproductive number looking good.
Or to be safe TC, just keep your mask on
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  #26756  
Old 29.06.2021, 15:30
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Re: Coronavirus

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I’m sure you do Baldrick, I just hope it doesn’t involve cat vomit.
Or another English comedian
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Old 29.06.2021, 15:36
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Re: Coronavirus

The vaccination numbers are not cool. It looks like a big gap in uptake between urban and rural cantons emerging, not so much on "fully vaccinated" but on "at least dose". Mid 40% only in many areas.
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Old 29.06.2021, 15:48
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Re: Coronavirus

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Au contraire, reproductive number looking good.
Or to be safe TC, just keep your mask on
Attachment 142138
If I remember well, the R number is a rear view mirror. During the decrease from the 2nd wave, R number was above 1 while cases kept decreasing. There should be something in how the number is calculated that there's a 2 week delay.
  #26759  
Old 29.06.2021, 15:50
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Re: Coronavirus

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The vaccination numbers are not cool. It looks like a big gap in uptake between urban and rural cantons emerging, not so much on "fully vaccinated" but on "at least dose". Mid 40% only in many areas.
Of adults or full population?
  #26760  
Old 29.06.2021, 15:56
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Re: Coronavirus

Full population. ZH, GE, BS in the low/mid 50%. Lots of the rural cantons in low/mid 40%.

https://www.covid19.admin.ch/en/epid...?geoView=table
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