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  #8401  
Old 27.04.2020, 17:36
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Re: Coronavirus

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main difference is the Swiss health system is better able to cope (and I would hope so given how much it costs us!). Also seems Switzerland has done a better job of keeping it out of care homes (therefore actually a less good job amongst the general public)

Italy's lockdown might be over-strict by Swiss standards - but the less rule abiding nature of Italian society probably made that necessary.
.
Well now that's finally a step forward in this discussion.

It means that lockdowns (no matter what form) are not an appropriate default measure everywhere and targeted approaches would be the far better solution - at least now and going forward - probably would have been all along, but let's not go there as the massive non-health-related damage has been done already anyway. It's been crystal clear for weeks that other factors outside of "lock people in" play a huge role, yet any claim to be more nuanced and adaptive was simply ignored, both in the public and many private arenas.

On Italy in particular: even the occasional unusually heavy flu season in the past brought their healthcare system near collapse or led at least to substantial strains, in some areas anyway. Same in parts of the US, mind you. There's plenty of info on that from reputable sources. We just didn't know, forgot or didn't care.

And also as a general reminder: there is zero intention (or possibility) to eradicate the virus, it will not go anywhere, not now, not ever and it won't even disappear with a vaccine. It will, however, simply stop to matter and exclusively dominate the whole world's every second of existence.

Last edited by Samaire13; 27.04.2020 at 17:49.
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  #8402  
Old 27.04.2020, 17:39
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Re: Coronavirus

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Fair enough, I think the measures were beneficial in order to slow the potential overload of the medical system. I'm still concerned about the future impact on the economy and my own selfish problem of my future employment status.

At this point it looks as though the parachute could be smaller rather than ditched altogether. We still have the reserve chute of re-implementing the measures.
You're far from the only one.

The parachute's downsizing is happening as we speak.
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Old 27.04.2020, 17:48
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Re: Coronavirus

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You're far from the only one.

The parachute's downsizing is happening as we speak.
The problem is that small parachutes don't work very well ...
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Old 27.04.2020, 18:11
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Re: Coronavirus

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.It means that lockdowns (no matter what form) are not an appropriate default measure everywhere.
Doesn't mean anything of the sort. Just means the strength of lockdown will vary from place to place.
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Old 27.04.2020, 18:19
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Re: Coronavirus

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What part of "flatten the curve" is in a language you don't understand?


No, I (for one) will give up replying to people who are obviously trolling or are honestly and irreparably stupid. Or ignorant.

Keep doing the good work, folks. I hope the internet won't become "theirs".
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Old 27.04.2020, 18:44
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Re: Coronavirus

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The problem is that small parachutes don't work very well ...
Did you try slimming down?
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Old 27.04.2020, 19:06
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Re: Coronavirus

Reports of children being affected by a rare syndrome associated with Coronavirus in the UK

An alert has been issued by NHS England that "a growing concern" of a
coronavirus-related inflammatory syndrome is emerging in children in the
UK or that there may be another, as yet unidentified, infection linked to
these cases.
These young patients of varying ages were extremely ill. They had similar
features to toxic shock syndrome, which can include a high temperature,
low blood pressure, a rash and difficulty breathing.
Some also had gastrointestinal symptoms - tummy pain, vomiting or
diarrhoea - and inflammation of the heart, as well as abnormal blood test results.

BBC News - Coronavirus alert, rare syndrome seen in UK children
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Surely the time has come for Boris to 'circle the wagons' for a bit of herd immunity ?
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Old 27.04.2020, 19:15
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Re: Coronavirus

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Reports of children being affected by a rare syndrome associated with Coronavirus in the UK

An alert has been issued by NHS England that "a growing concern" of a
coronavirus-related inflammatory syndrome is emerging in children in the
UK or that there may be another, as yet unidentified, infection linked to
these cases.
These young patients of varying ages were extremely ill. They had similar
features to toxic shock syndrome, which can include a high temperature,
low blood pressure, a rash and difficulty breathing.
Some also had gastrointestinal symptoms - tummy pain, vomiting or
diarrhoea - and inflammation of the heart, as well as abnormal blood test results.

BBC News - Coronavirus alert, rare syndrome seen in UK children
From the same article:

When to seek help

Whilst coronavirus is infectious to children, it is rarely serious. If your child is unwell it is likely to be a non-coronavirus illness, rather than coronavirus itself.

The RCPCH advises parents seek urgent help (call 999 or go to A&E) if their child is:

- Becoming pale, mottled and feeling abnormally cold to the touch

- Has pauses in their breathing (apnoeas), has an irregular breathing pattern or starts grunting

- Has severe difficulty in breathing becoming agitated or unresponsive

- Is going blue round the lips

- Has a fit/seizure

- Becomes extremely distressed (crying inconsolably despite distraction), confused, very lethargic (difficult to wake) or unresponsive

- Develops a rash that does not disappear with pressure (the 'Glass test')

- Has testicular pain, especially in teenage boys
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Old 27.04.2020, 19:18
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Re: Coronavirus

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Reports of children being affected by a rare syndrome associated with Coronavirus in the UK

An alert has been issued by NHS England that "a growing concern" of a
coronavirus-related inflammatory syndrome is emerging in children in the
UK or that there may be another, as yet unidentified, infection linked to
these cases.
These young patients of varying ages were extremely ill. They had similar
features to toxic shock syndrome, which can include a high temperature,
low blood pressure, a rash and difficulty breathing.
Some also had gastrointestinal symptoms - tummy pain, vomiting or
diarrhoea - and inflammation of the heart, as well as abnormal blood test results.

BBC News - Coronavirus alert, rare syndrome seen in UK children
such nonsense!!
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  #8410  
Old 27.04.2020, 20:27
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Re: Coronavirus

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It means that lockdowns (no matter what form) are not an appropriate default measure everywhere and targeted approaches would be the far better solution - at least now and going forward - probably would have been all along, but let's not go there as the massive non-health-related damage has been done already anyway. It's been crystal clear for weeks that other factors outside of "lock people in" play a huge role, yet any claim to be more nuanced and adaptive was simply ignored, both in the public and many private arenas.

It doesn't mean that at all - Baboon is right. I would, genuinely, like to understand why you are convinced the lockdown has had no positive impact in slowing down the progression of Covid-19. I understand your perspective from an economic POV (although I disagree) but not from a safeguarding angle. You and a few others are quite insistent that this has all been something of a storm in a teacup and I don't understand why/how you came to that conclusion? I know there are the annual flu death figures to contend with but this isn't the flu.

I really would like to know.


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Doesn't mean anything of the sort. Just means the strength of lockdown will vary from place to place.
Yep.

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No, I (for one) will give up replying to people who are obviously trolling or are honestly and irreparably stupid. Or ignorant.

Keep doing the good work, folks. I hope the internet won't become "theirs".
Double this. Although I don't believe Samaire 13 is trolling, hence my question above.
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Old 27.04.2020, 20:30
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Re: Coronavirus

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Reports of children being affected by a rare syndrome associated with Coronavirus in the UK...
Yet today Koch from the BAG said that children can visit grandparents and even hug them, that there is no risk. They should not stay overnight though.
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Old 27.04.2020, 20:33
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Re: Coronavirus

Now on BBC1- Panorama on the UK's Government response to Covid19.
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Old 27.04.2020, 22:57
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Re: Coronavirus

Parents be aware

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-52439005
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Old 27.04.2020, 22:59
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such nonsense!!
I reported this post and am very curious why it is still here?
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Old 28.04.2020, 00:46
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Re: Coronavirus

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Yet today Koch from the BAG said that children can visit grandparents and even hug them, that there is no risk. They should not stay overnight though.
Possibly because it's vanishingly rare that children are seriously affected. For grandparents sake I'm not sure I'd be hugging yet, or any time soon.
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Old 28.04.2020, 07:01
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Re: Coronavirus

More scare tactics. Blame it all on corona!!
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Old 28.04.2020, 07:09
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Re: Coronavirus

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Well now that's finally a step forward in this discussion.

It means that lockdowns (no matter what form) are not an appropriate default measure everywhere and targeted approaches would be the far better solution - at least now and going forward - probably would have been all along, but let's not go there as the massive non-health-related damage has been done already anyway. It's been crystal clear for weeks that other factors outside of "lock people in" play a huge role, yet any claim to be more nuanced and adaptive was simply ignored, both in the public and many private arenas.
Three points about a more nuanced approach:
This virus behaves differently to previous flu, Sars, MERS viruses.

It is difficult to make exceptions, even now there is considerable discussion about where and how should the opening up happen.

Thirdly, most of the complaints about the lockdown were and are politically motivated rather than being based on a rational discussion -the lack of reliable "facts" meaning that fake news and concepts such as herd immunity gained much more traction than they should have done.
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Old 28.04.2020, 07:20
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Re: Coronavirus

In the middle ages cities became centres of pestilence and disease and millions died. It seems to be repeating itself here with the advent of Covid 19
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Old 28.04.2020, 09:32
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Re: Coronavirus

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In the middle ages cities became centres of pestilence and disease and millions died. It seems to be repeating itself here with the advent of Covid 19
Yeah, nothing changes....except: (i) we know the killer, (ii) we don't sacrifice people/animals to calm god(s), (iii) cities are not centers or pestilence.

I may be wrong on number 2. The discourse on why health workers (docs, nurses, lab people) are heroes is a bit worrying. I've read too many hero epics to know heroes dieto save us all. I don't want nurses to die, I just want them to do their job, nothing more, no sacrifice
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Old 28.04.2020, 09:35
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Re: Coronavirus

It's no use guys we will have to give up our bikes - it's bad for your health.

The Metro - Kawasaki symptoms may be linked to Coronavirus, experts in UK & Italy warn


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