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  #11701  
Old 17.08.2020, 10:28
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Re: Coronavirus

Boy am I glad I didn't get involved in this thread earlier. Last thing I need is more right-wing 20/20 hindsight saying "See? It wasn't so bad. All those actions taken early on were unnecessary *because* they were so effective!"

So bloody ignorant. If I wanted any of that I'd move back to the disaster currently unfolding in the US.
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  #11702  
Old 17.08.2020, 10:33
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Re: Coronavirus

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Boy am I glad I didn't get involved in this thread earlier. Last thing I need is more right-wing 20/20 hindsight saying "See? It wasn't so bad. All those actions taken early on were unnecessary *because* they were so effective!"

So bloody ignorant. If I wanted any of that I'd move back to the disaster currently unfolding in the US.
Probably good you didn't get involved if you believe this to be a left-right issue
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  #11703  
Old 17.08.2020, 10:51
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Re: Coronavirus

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Boy am I glad I didn't get involved in this thread earlier. Last thing I need is more right-wing 20/20 hindsight saying "See? It wasn't so bad. All those actions taken early on were unnecessary *because* they were so effective!"

So bloody ignorant. If I wanted any of that I'd move back to the disaster currently unfolding in the US.
In my social circle corona scepticism doesn't correlate with political stance. Does yours?
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  #11704  
Old 17.08.2020, 10:55
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Re: Coronavirus

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In my social circle corona scepticism doesn't correlate with political stance. Does yours?
You're joking, right? Absolutely. If you view the political spectrum as a circle rather than a line, the extremes wind up being indistinguishable from each other. But the whole 20/20 hindsight thing seems to be much more a right wing thing thanks to their media outlets shaping that narrative.
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  #11705  
Old 17.08.2020, 11:04
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Re: Coronavirus

More timely government advice as we become ever more accustomed to the 'new normal'

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  #11706  
Old 17.08.2020, 11:09
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More timely government advice as we become ever more accustomed to the 'new normal'

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It's the 'new normal'.
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  #11707  
Old 17.08.2020, 13:21
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Re: Coronavirus

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You're joking, right? Absolutely. If you view the political spectrum as a circle rather than a line, the extremes wind up being indistinguishable from each other. But the whole 20/20 hindsight thing seems to be much more a right wing thing thanks to their media outlets shaping that narrative.
No I wasn't joking, quite rude btw.
As you probably knew I was refering to a linear spectrum with my statement

However, even with a circular spectrum the whole "just a flu, sweden rules, hoax, whatever" stuff is spreaded out evenly in my work and social life.
I agree that right wing media are the most vocal though.
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Old 17.08.2020, 14:09
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Re: Coronavirus

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No I wasn't joking, quite rude btw.
As you probably knew I was refering to a linear spectrum with my statement

However, even with a circular spectrum the whole "just a flu, sweden rules, hoax, whatever" stuff is spreaded out evenly in my work and social life.
I agree that right wing media are the most vocal though.
Two things which I'm still struggling to understand about this pandemic is how some are trying to paint this as a left-right issue where it's clearly not, and how *some* people on the lockdowny side of the argument are so quick to become rude, insulting and aggressive when their side of the debate is challenged. Our dearly departed friend EdwinNL was one such example of this.

I think it all comes back to the the running theme throughout this pandemic which is maintaining control of the narrative. A few weeks ago there was a protest in Berlin involving thousands of marchers against the covid measures. This was depicted by some parts of the German press as some kind of far-right rally when to see videos of it, it was anything but! It would be hard to find a more eclectic mix of people!

It's not even hard to make a Left wing case against the lockdown: trust in scientific debate, lower income people suffering more from lockdown, the effect of lockdown on the economy and subsequently public services, measures against freedom and liberty, the young being disproportionately affected et cetera et cetera.
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  #11709  
Old 17.08.2020, 15:35
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Re: Coronavirus

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Two things which I'm still struggling to understand about this pandemic is how some are trying to paint this as a left-right issue where it's clearly not, and how *some* people on the lockdowny side of the argument are so quick to become rude, insulting and aggressive when their side of the debate is challenged. Our dearly departed friend EdwinNL was one such example of this.
Oh what happened to Edwin? Must have missed it, but was wondering why the amount of groans has decreased

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I think it all comes back to the the running theme throughout this pandemic which is maintaining control of the narrative. A few weeks ago there was a protest in Berlin involving thousands of marchers against the covid measures. This was depicted by some parts of the German press as some kind of far-right rally when to see videos of it, it was anything but! It would be hard to find a more eclectic mix of people!

It's not even hard to make a Left wing case against the lockdown: trust in scientific debate, lower income people suffering more from lockdown, the effect of lockdown on the economy and subsequently public services, measures against freedom and liberty, the young being disproportionately affected et cetera et cetera.
No, it's indeed not a matter of right and left, but more one of a number of different perspectives and few of us are either left or right on everything at all times. I'm liberal, very left socially, much much less left economically - which in some ways explains why I fundamentally disagree with e.g. marton on this topic from an economic-political perspective, but then fundamentally agree with him/her on all things Trump

And what people have seen here is nowhere near conspiracy yet. If it really was, then suggestions could include to google for Event 201, the military olympics, research into biological warfare, and many other things, and that's when it all gets enormously interesting. But all of that is in a whole other league and I'm sure is just tinfoil hat stuff.

You're right on the narrative, whatever the reasons behind it all may be. I don't care if people think tinfoil - there is something enormously wrong in all this.
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  #11710  
Old 17.08.2020, 15:38
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Re: Coronavirus

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Two things which I'm still struggling to understand about this pandemic is how some are trying to paint this as a left-right issue where it's clearly not, and how *some* people on the lockdowny side of the argument are so quick to become rude, insulting and aggressive when their side of the debate is challenged. Our dearly departed friend EdwinNL was one such example of this.
One explanation is that those following and agreeing with lockdown procedure, encounter more or less severe hardships which they endure "for the greater good". Challenging their side of the debate diminishes their sacrifice in some way.
Others are scared (which is ok) for themselves or relatives, and others again are just submissive to authorities (which is ok here in switzerland i guess)

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I think it all comes back to the the running theme throughout this pandemic which is maintaining control of the narrative.
Which makes sense from the government or BAG's point of view. There is still a dangerous, even though not particularly lethal, viral pandemic going on.
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  #11711  
Old 17.08.2020, 15:47
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Re: Coronavirus

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  #11712  
Old 17.08.2020, 15:48
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Re: Coronavirus

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Is this prediction based on professional knowledge of immunology or just a wild guess?
Doesn't matter. We here folks on EF are subject matter experts. About everything (or nothing, you get what you pay for).

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how about we just be responsible for ourselves.... life is full of risks, and we each balance them as we see fit. If you don't want to catch a virus, then self isolate. The government could help support people who have a rational fear of a virus, i.e. those with health problems and old age persons. If you're a healthy adult then there is no sense in staying at home, losing jobs, causing stress and crashing the economies.
That's a great idea, but as I said way up-thread, it's over-simplified. Society simply can't "only" isolate people that are at risk. Those people have friends, family, doctors/nurses, and caretakers - all of whom are probably healthy(ish) and thus out in the population - but all of whom could also contract the virus and bring it back to the vulnerable person.

Just look at what happened in care homes across Europe. You can't totally isolate them because the people in them need care.

Other folks who are at-risk but otherwise healthy and simply scared? Isolate if you can and want to, but I also realize that is not practical in all instances.
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  #11713  
Old 17.08.2020, 16:01
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Re: Coronavirus

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how about we just be responsible for ourselves.... life is full of risks, and we each balance them as we see fit. If you don't want to catch a virus, then self isolate. The government could help support people who have a rational fear of a virus, i.e. those with health problems and old age persons. If you're a healthy adult then there is no sense in staying at home, losing jobs, causing stress and crashing the economies.
If you want to live in that kind of society you need to move elsewhere. Relying on self-responsibility where lack of it is likely to negatively affect others doesn't work, if everybody had their way a good many would do 100km/h in city streets, sod the children.
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Old 17.08.2020, 16:21
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Re: Coronavirus

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Two things which I'm still struggling to understand about this pandemic is how some are trying to paint this as a left-right issue where it's clearly not, and how *some* people on the lockdowny side of the argument are so quick to become rude, insulting and aggressive when their side of the debate is challenged.
A lot of the stuff you posted in this thread is simply nonsense. Not as a matter of opinion but factually, at the time you posted.
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Oh what happened to Edwin? Must have missed it, but was wondering why the amount of groans has decreased
Not sure if you're being sarcastic, but in case you're not:
He got himself deleted based on the right to be forgotten.
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Old 17.08.2020, 16:30
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Re: Coronavirus

The perfect example of the left/right divide with the right wing Sky Australia preaching to the converted and cherry-picking their data. We will see in the coming months how much, if any, herd immunity has been reached in Sweden.
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  #11716  
Old 17.08.2020, 16:40
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He got himself deleted based on the right to be forgotten.
Seems to have worked.
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  #11717  
Old 17.08.2020, 16:50
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Re: Coronavirus

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Two things which I'm still struggling to understand about this pandemic is how some are trying to paint this as a left-right issue where it's clearly not, and how *some* people on the lockdowny side of the argument are so quick to become rude, insulting and aggressive when their side of the debate is challenged. Our dearly departed friend EdwinNL was one such example of this.

I think it all comes back to the the running theme throughout this pandemic which is maintaining control of the narrative. A few weeks ago there was a protest in Berlin involving thousands of marchers against the covid measures. This was depicted by some parts of the German press as some kind of far-right rally when to see videos of it, it was anything but! It would be hard to find a more eclectic mix of people!

It's not even hard to make a Left wing case against the lockdown: trust in scientific debate, lower income people suffering more from lockdown, the effect of lockdown on the economy and subsequently public services, measures against freedom and liberty, the young being disproportionately affected et cetera et cetera.

Agreed.

Not only Berlin but also Quebec City and Montreal.
The descriptions in the media of all 3 events are similarly critical, mis-label the participants, and push the message that it's only a small group of radicals.
No idea about the Germans, but some vocal people in Québec also happen to be folks whom I would have placed solidly on the left before this all happened.
No longer a left-right question.
It's a control question.
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Old 17.08.2020, 17:09
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Not sure if you're being sarcastic, but in case you're not:
He got himself deleted based on the right to be forgotten.
No sarcasm, I really didn’t know he was gone or why
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  #11719  
Old 17.08.2020, 18:33
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No sarcasm, I really didn’t know he was gone or why
Probably he thought we would gloat.

But we would not gloat. He was not the only one taken by the mass media hysteria.
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  #11720  
Old 17.08.2020, 19:04
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Probably he thought we would gloat.

But we would not gloat. He was not the only one taken by the mass media hysteria.

Of course, a lot were taken by the mass media hysteria about the covid19 and the economy
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