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  #13741  
Old 14.10.2020, 12:35
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Re: Coronavirus

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Les masques vendus en Suisse protègent (très) mal

The masks sold in Switzerland protect (very) poorly

Out of 16 masks tested only 4 provided adequate protection!
Even if they were to perform properly, the way people use them renders them mostly useless anyhow. Which is, ironically, the original reason they gave as to why masks were unnecessary at the beginning
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  #13742  
Old 14.10.2020, 12:42
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Re: Coronavirus

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Even if they were to perform properly, the way people use them renders them mostly useless anyhow. Which is, ironically, the original reason they gave as to why masks were unnecessary at the beginning
Well that was at a time when there was no surplus of masks. Now with 800M CHF worth of masks lying around in Switzerland only, somebody needs to keep buying them

And you are absolutely correct, the way most people use masks is counterproductive at best
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  #13743  
Old 14.10.2020, 12:53
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Re: Coronavirus

What times we live in, in the week that the WHO u-turns and announces that lockdowns should be avoided, many countries in Europe look set to go back into lockdown.

Vaccine trials are running into problems and there's reports of people being reinfected. So there's the very real possibility that a vaccine may not come, or that they may not be effective.

The Swiss federal council will meet with the cantons to discuss a way forward. Let's pray they'll stick with the current approach and realise we have to live with this virus.
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  #13744  
Old 14.10.2020, 12:54
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Re: Coronavirus

Yet another blow for herd immunity.
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In der Schweiz haben sich mehrere Personen erneut das Virus eingefangen.
(multiple people in Switzerland have been re-infected with the virus)

https://www.20min.ch/story/bag-besta...z-790448016417
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  #13745  
Old 14.10.2020, 12:57
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Re: Coronavirus

I am using the Lidl surgical masks luckily and I use them only once. People I know use them for up to 4 days. Some people on the bus seem to be using them for months as they look completely frayed.

- Allowing normal washable cotton masks was and is a big mistake.
- No serious fines for mask dodgers or real world policing another big mistake.
- People wearing cotton masks with those round plastic vents so air can nicely pass through, what a joke!
- Lot of people have masks with huge gaps all around anyway so those are completely pointless too. Air will take the route of the least resistance.

The only reason I am for mask wearing is due to the viral load getting decreased theory. Also, when someone sneezes it will travel less far, hopefully.

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Well that was at a time when there was no surplus of masks. Now with 800M CHF worth of masks lying around in Switzerland only, somebody needs to keep buying them
When there was mask shortage they said that masks don't work. Now we have masks they say they work? I want the real truth always!!!!

For example, if there is shortage of water in the future, will the government say that humans don't require water to live?
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  #13746  
Old 14.10.2020, 13:02
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Re: Coronavirus

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Genetic makeup differed but by how much? There are already many mutations of Coronavirus out there from what I understand. Would that genetic difference have been enough to re-infect a healthy individual who was not suffering from white blood cell cancer? Now that is the real question.
Didn't you read the articles? Different enough from the original detected virus to identify it as not being a continuation of the first infection, not different enough to be thought of as a new 'strain'.

Smaller and larger genetic differences are a normal part of cell division and sexual reproduction, respectively, just as with higher animals; no two generations of an animal/plant/virus will ever be 100% identical, but that doesn't mean they're not the same species.
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  #13747  
Old 14.10.2020, 13:05
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Re: Coronavirus

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Your population was off by nearly 100 000 people.

Malta's population: 514000
Malta's personal vehicle registration (cars+bikes) 85% of 387000 = 329000
329000/514000 = 64% (from your link)

Switzerland population: 8570000
Swiss personal vehicle registration (cars+bikes): 5344000
5344000/8570000= 62%

It's the same ownership in both countries.
In fairness FMF's statement is actually correct. 387,775 vehicles is above 0.9% of the population, whichever way you count it!

Although I've really no idea what the relevance of the number of cars he personally owned in Zürich is.
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Way higher in Malta 387,775 licensed vehicles (2019) with a population of 425,971. Thats over 0.9%, this includes children.

When I lived in ZH I had 4 vehicles registered 2 cars & 2 motorbikes, living in Malta, married we are a 2 car family.

https://www.maltachamber.org.mt/en/t...tinues-to-rise
https://countrymeters.info/en/Malta
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  #13748  
Old 14.10.2020, 13:09
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Re: Coronavirus

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What times we live in, in the week that the WHO u-turns and announces that lockdowns should be avoided, many countries in Europe look set to go back into lockdown.
Only small problem with that statement is that it is not actually true. What Nabarro actually said was
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We in the World Health Organization do not advocate lockdowns as the primary means of control of this virus.
Note the word "primary. Rather important in that sentence.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/brucele.../#483b09cf158c
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  #13749  
Old 14.10.2020, 13:11
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Re: Coronavirus

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If the virus has mutated that far there will never be herd immunity.
I think cross-immunity should help here
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  #13750  
Old 14.10.2020, 13:13
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Re: Coronavirus

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Les masques vendus en Suisse protègent (très) mal

The masks sold in Switzerland protect (very) poorly

Out of 16 masks tested only 4 provided adequate protection!
Reading the article (did you?) it's clear that the TV program they paraphrase was saying that the masks don't protect the wearer very much or at all. They were never intended to, so I'm not sure why you even mention it in this context. Just a victim of poor journalism, I suppose.

The mandatory or voluntary wearing thereof has only ever been as a means of reducing the chance of an infected person projecting particles into the air, by wearing a mask to protect others. The tests performed by the TV show said absolutely nothing about whether the masks are effective for their intended purpose.
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  #13751  
Old 14.10.2020, 13:14
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Re: Coronavirus

So I guess that certain White House peeps are advocating for herd immunity. Except, a coronavirus, like the flu doesn’t usually lead to herd immunity. That’s why we get flu shots each year.
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  #13752  
Old 14.10.2020, 13:18
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Re: Coronavirus

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What about Sweden?
Its Saab
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  #13753  
Old 14.10.2020, 13:19
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Re: Coronavirus

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Didn't you read the articles? Different enough from the original detected virus to identify it as not being a continuation of the first infection, not different enough to be thought of as a new 'strain'.

Smaller and larger genetic differences are a normal part of cell division and sexual reproduction, respectively, just as with higher animals; no two generations of an animal/plant/virus will ever be 100% identical, but that doesn't mean they're not the same species.
Thanks for that, my point was, are healthy individuals without any comorbidities getting re-infected? And do they stay asymptomatic or fall severely ill?
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  #13754  
Old 14.10.2020, 13:19
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Re: Coronavirus

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Only small problem with that statement is that it is not actually true. What Nabarro actually said was

Note the word "primary. Rather important in that sentence.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/brucele.../#483b09cf158c
The problem with the WHO is that is has never had a clear position, various WHO employees have publicly expressed various positions which allows them to always be right at some point. But this is all irrelevant, we all know that the WHO credibility, never very high to begin with, has eroded even further, this is not the point. The point is that they are now desperately trying to catch-up with the reality on the ground, which is basically, lockdowns are detrimental and create more harm than good and we are all better off not doing them. Of course, this is what has been happening already anyway, so this is a bit like the WHO announcing at midday that the night is over.
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  #13755  
Old 14.10.2020, 13:24
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Re: Coronavirus

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The point here is that the patient was infected by a strain of covid sufficiently distinct from his first infection that his immunity could not stop it. If the virus has mutated that far there will never be herd immunity.
It wasn't suggesting that this was a distinct new strain of the virus, just that a different physical set of viruses had (re-)infected the patient, i.e. that she had not developed a lasting immunity to it after the first infection.
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  #13756  
Old 14.10.2020, 13:27
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Re: Coronavirus

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Except, a coronavirus, like the flu doesn’t usually lead to herd immunity. That’s why we get flu shots each year.
No, it's not. That's because there are new strains each year, so existing immunity is no longer effective against them.
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  #13757  
Old 14.10.2020, 13:38
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Re: Coronavirus

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Only small problem with that statement is that it is not actually true. What Nabarro actually said was

Note the word "primary. Rather important in that sentence.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/brucele.../#483b09cf158c
You can listen to what he said in its full context here:

https://twitter.com/spectator/status...73157827858434

Forbes are just playing semantics, and it's the reason why people don't trust the press anymore.
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Old 14.10.2020, 13:40
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Re: Coronavirus

How is the quality of the Actilife vitamins sold in Migros? Aspartam dangerous?

Example Vitamin C-
Inhaltsstoffe
Säuerungsmittel: Citronensäure, Säureregulator: Natriumhydrogencarbonat, L-Ascorbinsäure (Vitamin C), Inulin, Füllstoff: Sorbit, Orangenaroma, Randensaftpulver färbend, Süssungsmittel: Mannit, Aspartam und Acesulfam K, Farbstoff: Riboflavin.
Nährwerte
1Tablette
Energie 8.0kj (2.0kcal)
Fett 0 g
davon gesättigte Fettsäuren 0 g
Kohlenhydrate 0.5 g
davon Zucker 0.5 g
Ballaststoffe 0.5 g
Eiweiss 0 g
Salz 0.89 g
Vitamin C (Ascorbinsäure) 300 mg
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  #13759  
Old 14.10.2020, 13:43
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Re: Coronavirus

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No, it's not. That's because there are new strains each year, so existing immunity is no longer effective against them.
Sigh. That was implied.
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  #13760  
Old 14.10.2020, 13:47
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Re: Coronavirus

From the CDC.
Those who get sick with Covid19:
Wear a mask ALWAYS — 70.6%
NEVER wear a mask — 3.9%
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/...mm6936a5-H.pdf
page 4
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