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  #16001  
Old 03.11.2020, 06:42
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Re: Coronavirus

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Oh, so lockdowns work?

Well I never.
lol... I think some members views in this thread are going to age like sour milk by the time this pandemic is over. I'm looking forward to when all this is over and we can actually prove, beyond any reasonable doubt, the sheer depth of ridiculousness of some of the commenters in this thread.
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  #16002  
Old 03.11.2020, 08:12
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Re: Coronavirus

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Geneva will start closing down

This Monday, 7:00 p.m. The measures will be active until November 29, to be reassessed.

What measures?
Closure of non essential stores.
Please see link below for exact details.

Bars and restaurants will be closed. (Take-out may continue.)

Hairdressers, barbers and tattooists closed.

Cinemas, museums, concerts, ice rinks, etc. will also be closed.

Etc.

"Antonio Hodgers adds: "We note, however, that the progression of the epidemic is not significantly different among our neighbors." The latter suggests that the measures taken in Geneva could be effective in the canton of Vaud in the coming days"

https://www.ge.ch/document/lutte-con...rictes-geneve#
Won't everybody come to Vaud to do their non-essential shopping...
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  #16003  
Old 03.11.2020, 08:27
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Re: Coronavirus

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Won't everybody come to Vaud to do their non-essential shopping...
I doubt people will. People understand the risk, the time that is being bought by the current slowdown (no lockdown), plus Swiss have high civic conscience. And, everyone knows how expensive VD is, with parking and trains to add...
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Old 03.11.2020, 08:31
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Re: Coronavirus

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Won't everybody come to Vaud to do their non-essential shopping...
Of course they will, or at least a significant number of them will.
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  #16005  
Old 03.11.2020, 08:33
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Re: Coronavirus

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Going back to lying yet again? A couple of quotes from the links







Says exactly what I said.
I couldn't see a statement in your quotes about schools being hotspots.
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Old 03.11.2020, 08:42
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Re: Coronavirus

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I couldn't see a statement in your quotes about schools being hotspots.
Well, I think they are. But now it got to the point of when not if..So I think authorities are juggling the pace/time and population groups going through certain exposure. CZ teachers were the largest infected group after healthcare staff for a while. Nobody can surpass the positive healthcare staff in CZ - 16000 infected now (doctors, nurses..). Schools closed but it is expected to jump up there when they reopen, while having healthcare staff already temporarily immune and gotten used to the drill.

Last edited by MusicChick; 03.11.2020 at 11:40.
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  #16007  
Old 03.11.2020, 08:46
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Re: Coronavirus

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I doubt people will. People understand the risk, the time that is being bought by the current slowdown (no lockdown), plus Swiss have high civic conscience. And, everyone knows how expensive VD is, with parking and trains to add...
25-26% of the population are non-Swiss and there are plenty of Swiss who don't follow the rules either
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  #16008  
Old 03.11.2020, 08:51
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Re: Coronavirus

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Of course they will, or at least a significant number of them will.
I'm sure VD will follow suit tomorrow.. But today I imagine that the Chavanne centre will be rammed.. (just over the GE/VD border).

I notice the wait time for testing is now around 5 days at the GHOL Nyon.. Not so good for getting positive people into isolation. One friend of mine is still waiting for a result since Saturday, but being symptomatic they are isolating ..
Wonder how many are out there awaiting either a test or a result and not bothering.
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  #16009  
Old 03.11.2020, 08:55
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Re: Coronavirus

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Thank you.
No, no one at the school has contacted us (at least not yet). The only reason I even know about the boy being quarantined due to his parent having COVID is because my son's teacher had told the class today and explained that that's why he's not in school, and then my son came home and told me. At least today is Monday, though, which hopefully means that perhaps his mother just developed symptoms over the weekend and so hopefully her son would have been less likely to pass the virus on last week (though of course that could just be wishful thinking on my part).

But I wonder why that is or would be -- that smaller kids would be less likely to pass the virus on to adults. Does anyone know why exactly? One would think that the virus doesn't care and just wants to find another host. It seems odd to me that the virus would behave differently from other viruses in that it wouldn't be easily passed from a child to an adult.
Thanks, that's what I was afraid of - you wouldn't even know if the teacher doesn't tell anything to the class. But you're right, I remember we had the same discussion in spring. I guess I used to cling to the more optimistic version because during the first wave there were not so many infections in schools, as Melusine mentioned they are now. We might have been much more sheltered where we live, the school is relatively small, six classes in total, most parents could work from home, kids didn't really meet anyone outside their very narrow circle and walked to home and kita. The stats looked better back then, when I look at the graphs now I'm less optimistic. I think they'll close the schools for a while, or at least secondary level. Maybe they'll split classes, mix online teaching with live teaching who knows. Kids can't be left outside of school too much or for too long, I believe.
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  #16010  
Old 03.11.2020, 08:56
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Re: Coronavirus

Interesting open letter from leading Swiss economists who believe the government isn’t doing enough and is ultimately failing the economy:

https://sites.google.com/site/florin...wisseconomists

“There seems to be a pervasive misunderstanding regarding the economics of COVID-19: an argument is often made as to the economic costs of a lockdown, invoking a tradeoff between the economy and health. In our opinion, and especially in the kind of situation Switzerland is now epidemiologically, this is a false dichotomy: there is no such trade-off. The choice is between 1) a big recession, overwhelmed hospitals, and many excess deaths under current policies; and 2) a big recession with fewer deaths and a manageable health system under a second lockdown. An increasing number of scientific studies deliver this message, from various countries with different experiences, based on research written by some of the world’s best economists—often in collaboration with epidemiologists.”
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  #16011  
Old 03.11.2020, 09:34
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Re: Coronavirus

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I'm sure VD will follow suit tomorrow.. But today I imagine that the Chavanne centre will be rammed.. (just over the GE/VD border).

I notice the wait time for testing is now around 5 days at the GHOL Nyon.. Not so good for getting positive people into isolation. One friend of mine is still waiting for a result since Saturday, but being symptomatic they are isolating ..
Wonder how many are out there awaiting either a test or a result and not bothering.
I agree. And when VD follows suit they’ll start moving to other cantons with fewer restrictions.

I’ve given up trying to follow the testing situation in NE, it’s a complete shambles.
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  #16012  
Old 03.11.2020, 10:13
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Re: Coronavirus

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You are absolutely wrong.
Not really. From your source

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Educational evidence
Data collected globally have previously shown that schools can reopen safely when community transmission is low.
Right now it seems that community transmission is not low.

See the post bellow

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We have roughly 40 classes in my school, and most of them have at least one kid who’s in quarantine because of an infected parent or because they’re sick themselves.

School is not allowed to communicate with the other parents for confidentiality reasons, and only the cantonal doctor can decide to close a classe or a whole school. They did it for a class where I work because 4 kids were tested positive a few weeks ago. All the students had to go get tested.

I guess they have to proceed very carefully and very fast, identify and quarantine the clusters.
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  #16013  
Old 03.11.2020, 10:38
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Re: Coronavirus

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.........

Nope. Science has discovered that an electricity current of 0.1 ampers passing through the body is enough to kill. Now whether somebody should try to put their fingers into the electric socket is just a question about how much they want to risk their life, and that's not a scientific question. I hope the analogy is clear.
Naturally one follows the science and does not put their finger into the electric socket unless suicide is the goal.

Weird analogy needs clarifying.
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  #16014  
Old 03.11.2020, 10:43
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Re: Coronavirus

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Nope. Science has discovered that an electricity current of 0.1 ampers passing through the body is enough to kill. Now whether somebody should try to put their fingers into the electric socket is just a question about how much they want to risk their life, and that's not a scientific question. I hope the analogy is clear.
Ummmm... Yeah, and the science-based knowledge that .1 ampers can kill is why most people don't put their fingers into an electrical socket.
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  #16015  
Old 03.11.2020, 10:52
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Re: Coronavirus

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Oh, so lockdowns work?

Well I never.
Well, I stopped reading posts regularly in this thread but iirc, no one has ever disputed that lockdowns work. They question was wheter or the detrimental effects of a (second) lockdown should be considered and to what degree.
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  #16016  
Old 03.11.2020, 11:24
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Re: Coronavirus

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Interesting open letter from leading Swiss economists who believe the government isn’t doing enough and is ultimately failing the economy:

https://sites.google.com/site/florin...wisseconomists

“There seems to be a pervasive misunderstanding regarding the economics of COVID-19: an argument is often made as to the economic costs of a lockdown, invoking a tradeoff between the economy and health. In our opinion, and especially in the kind of situation Switzerland is now epidemiologically, this is a false dichotomy: there is no such trade-off. The choice is between 1) a big recession, overwhelmed hospitals, and many excess deaths under current policies; and 2) a big recession with fewer deaths and a manageable health system under a second lockdown. An increasing number of scientific studies deliver this message, from various countries with different experiences, based on research written by some of the world’s best economists—often in collaboration with epidemiologists.”

Indeed, the big recession is here. The choice is about how many excess deaths and suffering.
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  #16017  
Old 03.11.2020, 11:36
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Re: Coronavirus

Fribourg: "We're on the edge of a health disaster."

An internal medicine doctor at Fribourg Hospital posted the video below on Monday evening.

"The situation here at the Fribourg Hospital is extremely serious. We already have more than 185 patients hospitalised with a Covid-19 infection. Just now, in front of the emergency room, ambulances were arriving every 15 minutes. And if it continues like this, we probably won't have any more room on Tuesday, Wednesday or Thursday".

"Switzerland, which is one of the most developed countries in Western Europe, has failed in its obligations."

https://youtu.be/ujQXujIEz0E
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Old 03.11.2020, 11:57
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Re: Coronavirus

People around me are really starting to get anxious from health and economic point of view. I mean literally physically panicking!
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Old 03.11.2020, 12:14
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Re: Coronavirus

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Fribourg: "We're on the edge of a health disaster."

An internal medicine doctor at Fribourg Hospital posted the video below on Monday evening.

"The situation here at the Fribourg Hospital is extremely serious. We already have more than 185 patients hospitalised with a Covid-19 infection. Just now, in front of the emergency room, ambulances were arriving every 15 minutes. And if it continues like this, we probably won't have any more room on Tuesday, Wednesday or Thursday".

"Switzerland, which is one of the most developed countries in Western Europe, has failed in its obligations."

https://youtu.be/ujQXujIEz0E
In Bern I remember during the first lockdown, and coming up to it we would hear more ambulance sirens. Maybe three or four times a day, compared to the BC (before corona) daily average of 0. Then it got quiet again in later April.

In recent weeks, we've started hearing it again, more ambulance sirens.
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Old 03.11.2020, 12:21
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Re: Coronavirus

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People around me are really starting to get anxious from health and economic point of view. I mean literally physically panicking!

Each canton on their own, different rules left & right. New videos and articles emerging daily that hospitals are becoming or already are saturated. Scary talks about triage, maybe not getting a bed if in need, long waiting times to get tested & a basically collapsing contact tracing system.
And in all of that the silence from the BAG is defening.

Summa summarum - I can understand ppl getting anxious
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