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  #19681  
Old 16.01.2021, 18:44
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Re: Coronavirus

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Are you sure about that? It is said that the new strain can enter the cells more easily and thus creates higher viral load. Also, I'd imagine that if vaccines still work with this variant, why wouldn't people immune by having had the other version of covid be also at least somewhat immune to this one? Your explanation doesn't make sense to me.
The vaccines (at least the mRNA ones) cause a somewhat different immune response to a natural infection. Although the South African one is causing concern on both fronts.

For the other, listen to the last 2 editions of the Guardians science podcast. Explains nicely how that works.
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  #19682  
Old 16.01.2021, 18:45
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Re: Coronavirus

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because as soon as we start to see light at the end of the tunnel with vaccines, suddenly new mutations appears on horizon, suggesting that vaccines will be useless or less efficient
then, information that vaccine lasts 5 month only appears, meaning that every 5-6 month whole world should do revaccination (multiplying it on number deadly mutations)
<conspiracy theories mode on>I have a feeling that some drive this on purpose<conspiracy theories mode off>
Nobody knows how long immunity will last after vaccination, the vaccines have simply not been around long enough for good data to be available.
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  #19683  
Old 16.01.2021, 20:53
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Re: Coronavirus

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because as soon as we start to see light at the end of the tunnel with vaccines, suddenly new mutations appears on horizon, suggesting that vaccines will be useless or less efficient
then, information that vaccine lasts 5 month only appears, meaning that every 5-6 month whole world should do revaccination (multiplying it on number deadly mutations)
<conspiracy theories mode on>I have a feeling that some drive this on purpose<conspiracy theories mode off>
The good news is that I believe the mRNA are able to be (relatively) quickly updated in the case of any mutations.
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  #19684  
Old 16.01.2021, 21:55
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Re: Coronavirus

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Nobody knows how long immunity will last after vaccination, the vaccines have simply not been around long enough for good data to be available.
and same, but different, for those who have actually had Covid.
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  #19685  
Old 16.01.2021, 22:08
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Re: Coronavirus

Meanwhile in the UK- shocking news as revealed by a friend

''GPs setting up vaccine clinics at short notice who find they have several injection doses left have reportedly been warned by local authorities that they cannot use them on staff or any patients who have already received their first jab.

Medics claim the policy, which has been described as “bordering on criminal”, is hampering the effort to vaccinate over-80s, along with frontline health and care workers.

The instructions are being reported across the country, according to The Telegraph.

Dr Robert Morely, director of professional support at the Birmingham Local Medical Committee, told the publication that the orders are "extremely counterproductive, nonsensical and ludicrous".

He said: “This is ridiculous, bordering on the criminal, to actually be wasting vaccines when you have the worst global healthcare crisis for a century."

uk.yahoo.com/news/doctos-throw-out-leftover-vaccines-second-doses-nhs-england-154924350.html
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  #19686  
Old 16.01.2021, 22:59
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Re: Coronavirus

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The vaccines (at least the mRNA ones) cause a somewhat different immune response to a natural infection. Although the South African one is causing concern on both fronts.

For the other, listen to the last 2 editions of the Guardians science podcast. Explains nicely how that works.
I did. They say the opposite of what you said in the original post. Major mutations don't happen in a "normal" case, but in prolonged ones, and especially when the plasma-treatment is applied in critically ill people, who do not create enough own antibodies. So it has nothing to do with the level of herd immunity. He also says he doesn't believe that incomplete vaccination will affect the mutation rate for the same reason.

Also, here at 13:00 the expert says that the new UK variant doesn't spread faster by reinfecting more people. There is some ambiguity in what he meant by this, but as I understood, people who had the original covid, don't get reinfected with the new covid more often than with the old one.

https://www.theguardian.com/science/...r-them-podcast

P.S. Thanks for citing this anyway, very educational.

Last edited by LifeStrain; 16.01.2021 at 23:11.
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  #19687  
Old 16.01.2021, 23:17
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Re: Coronavirus

What the world needs now is SNG001 from Synairgen.

SNG001 is an inhaled formulation of interferon beta-1a, a naturally occuring protein which is believed to kickstart the body’s antiviral responses.

In phase 2 trials it improved the condition of patients with severe Covid in 80% of cases.

Fast track phase 3 underway now in 20 countries.

http://www.pharmatimes.com/news/syna...atment_1361172
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  #19688  
Old 16.01.2021, 23:33
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Re: Coronavirus

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The good news is that I believe the mRNA are able to be (relatively) quickly updated in the case of any mutations.
Testing to ensure safety is probably what takes the longest time.
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  #19689  
Old 17.01.2021, 01:25
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Re: Coronavirus

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I did. They say the opposite of what you said in the original post. Major mutations don't happen in a "normal" case, but in prolonged ones, and especially when the plasma-treatment is applied in critically ill people, who do not create enough own antibodies. So it has nothing to do with the level of herd immunity. He also says he doesn't believe that incomplete vaccination will affect the mutation rate for the same reason.

Also, here at 13:00 the expert says that the new UK variant doesn't spread faster by reinfecting more people. There is some ambiguity in what he meant by this, but as I understood, people who had the original covid, don't get reinfected with the new covid more often than with the old one.

https://www.theguardian.com/science/...r-them-podcast

P.S. Thanks for citing this anyway, very educational.
Listen to this from about 16½ minutes. He talks about vaccine escape in the context of the South African variant but the same applies to natural herd immunity.

There was an article somewhere on the Manaus ourbreak which did specifically mention the herd immunity question. I'll see if I can find that in the morning...
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  #19690  
Old 17.01.2021, 01:28
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Re: Coronavirus

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because as soon as we start to see light at the end of the tunnel with vaccines, suddenly new mutations appears on horizon, suggesting that vaccines will be useless or less efficient
then, information that vaccine lasts 5 month only appears, meaning that every 5-6 month whole world should do revaccination (multiplying it on number deadly mutations)
<conspiracy theories mode on>I have a feeling that some drive this on purpose<conspiracy theories mode off>
You seem to be saying that these problems should have been discovered earlier, before they actually manifested themselves.

And that vaccine effectiveness against strains that were unknonwn at that time because they hadn't developed yet should have been determined before vaccine testing has even begun.

That sounds like quite a bit of quackery.
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  #19691  
Old 17.01.2021, 02:02
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Re: Coronavirus

WITHOUT MOTIVE INFO...

I normally use

https://www.worldometers.info/corona...y/switzerland/

For statistics. Ive been using the (source) links below main charts..
Link now points to a strange url.

POSTING PART OF URL BUT NOT ALL AS SEEMS STRANGE.

INFO POSTED IN GOOD FAITH AND APLOGIES IF I’M DOUBTING CORRECT LINKS.

rsalzer github./COVID_19_CH/

Anyone else thinks this is strange.

His links says “ If you like this page buy me a coffee.”

???
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  #19692  
Old 17.01.2021, 02:23
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Re: Coronavirus

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WITHOUT MOTIVE INFO...

I normally use

https://www.worldometers.info/corona...y/switzerland/

For statistics. Ive been using the (source) links below main charts..
Link now points to a strange url.

POSTING PART OF URL BUT NOT ALL AS SEEMS STRANGE.

INFO POSTED IN GOOD FAITH AND APLOGIES IF I’M DOUBTING CORRECT LINKS.

rsalzer github./COVID_19_CH/

Anyone else thinks this is strange.

His links says “ If you like this page buy me a coffee.”

???
I’ve reported to the Worldometer tech support
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  #19693  
Old 17.01.2021, 02:49
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Re: Coronavirus

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rsalzer github./COVID_19_CH/

Anyone else thinks this is strange.

His links says “ If you like this page buy me a coffee.”
Still works fine for me (PC, Win10 with FF).
Are you sure you used the correct TLD? As it's a rather unusual one.
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  #19694  
Old 17.01.2021, 08:41
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Re: Coronavirus

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Still works fine for me (PC, Win10 with FF).
Are you sure you used the correct TLD? As it's a rather unusual one.
Well no problem you posted the full link.. as you wish.. Maybe worldometers is not the best source
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  #19695  
Old 17.01.2021, 09:03
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Re: Coronavirus

Besides worldometers, there's still https://corona-data.ch/. There, in particular, scroll down to "excess mortality data". And for all data sites, and especially that graph, please remember that some countries are probably reporting differently from or less than others.
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  #19696  
Old 17.01.2021, 10:12
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Re: Coronavirus

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Well no problem you posted the full link.. as you wish..
What is the problem with the source? This is the best statistics for corona cases so far, this site appeared in summer last year. You mean you have never seen this website before?
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  #19697  
Old 17.01.2021, 10:15
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Re: Coronavirus

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I’ve reported to the Worldometer tech support
What for??? This guy made a great job by doing what BAG is not capable of and is constantly improving and extending the page. Why cannot someone buy him a coffee as a thank you?
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  #19698  
Old 17.01.2021, 10:24
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Re: Coronavirus

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Besides worldometers, there's still https://corona-data.ch/. There, in particular, scroll down to "excess mortality data". And for all data sites, and especially that graph, please remember that some countries are probably reporting differently from or less than others.
I gave up on that one when he updated it a while back, it doesn’t even load on my tablet anymore. (Or if it does it takes so long to do so I don’t know because I’ve given up on it)
It loads on my phone but it’s too difficult to read it on that.
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  #19699  
Old 17.01.2021, 10:43
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Re: Coronavirus

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I’ve reported to the Worldometer tech support
I wouldn't worry in terms of it being malicious or anything .. GIThub is a source repository used by organisations big and small. Likely that the developers hold raw data there. We probably just don't normally see it.

Many of the developers and statisticians working on this data are probably volunteers, most of GIThub users are, hence the buy me a coffee link.
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Old 17.01.2021, 12:23
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Re: Coronavirus

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What for??? This guy made a great job by doing what BAG is not capable of and is constantly improving and extending the page. Why cannot someone buy him a coffee as a thank you?
My mistake and I have sent a follow up email noting my error.

I just hadn’t seen the new layout and the url and “buy me a coffee” just sounded odd.

Apologies.
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