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Old 31.03.2020, 10:55
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Re: Corona - The aftermath

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Ooo! Now that is a slippery slope to stand on. Would you want a society that is ready and will sacfrifice it´s citizens to uphold the shareholder value? Let people die because it´s not economically sensible for them to live?
That is social darwinism of the worst order. You know who else was a social darwinist? Pol Pot, Stalin, Hitler, that way of thinking is so 19th century, don´t you think we have moved on a tad?
"Oh, well sorry Mr. Slammer, your granddaughter is not eligibal for treatment because we don´t have enough beds. Tough, but it´s not personal, just economic sense!"
I would be shoving the barrel of my gun down any doctors throat who says that.
Pull yourself together man! You've extrapulated whatever you wanted to to come up with some hysterical, unimmaginable scenario.

Go and see your doctor and ask for a prescription for 2 testicles.
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  #122  
Old 31.03.2020, 10:58
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Re: Corona - The aftermath

Well of course that's the whole challenge here and a moral, ethical dilemma. Personally I didn't imply you should let people die (though I know what CodPeace was trying to say and didn't take offense in it). But what are the cost of these measures for which there's zero precedent or proof they even work? Making far-reaching economic and political decisions and taking away fundamental rights from people based on essentially no data whatsoever is extremely risky. Of course not doing anything would have (possibly) been equally risky - hence the dilemma. Bottom line is: either way we have no clue and most just did "something" because doing nothing didn't seem like a feasible alternative. Whether that will end up to be true or not we won't find out until after the fact.

What I'm willing to say though is that up until now, mitigation efforts were just about within the acceptable, for the most part anyway. They will quickly become unsustainable now though.

I'm not usually very patriotic, but have to say that I appreciate how Switzerland has handled this so far and from the looks of it, this was sufficient.
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  #123  
Old 31.03.2020, 11:18
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Re: Corona - The aftermath

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We should be much more concerned about the financial costs we are now burdening ourselves and younger generations with to try to save everyone.
Most of the people who die from coronavirus would be dead presently (5 years say) anyway.
While it is impossible to be anything but concerned for the future of the world, there is more than enough wealth on this planet that should ensure generations will NOT be affected by this crisis. Perhaps we will see a redistribution of this wealth and government spending on things that actually matter.

P.S. Why don't you go ahead and volunteer to sacrifice yourself or your loved ones for the economy?

Last edited by Susie-Q; 31.03.2020 at 11:48. Reason: typo
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  #124  
Old 31.03.2020, 11:34
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Re: Corona - The aftermath

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While it is impossible to be anything but concerned for the future of the world, there is more than enough wealth on this planet that should ensure generations will NOT be affected by this crisis. Perhaps we will see a redistribution of this wealth and government spending on things that actually mater.

P.S. Why don't you go ahead and volunteer to sacrifice yourself or your loved ones for the economy?
I have the feeling that those who want so badly everything to go back as usual are hidden in their villas with large provisions of food and an emergency medical station with ventilator and everything down in the bunker.

They are worried about the stock exchange and their wealth, that's all.
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  #125  
Old 31.03.2020, 11:39
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Re: Corona - The aftermath

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Pull yourself together man! You've extrapulated whatever you wanted to to come up with some hysterical, unimmaginable scenario.

Go and see your doctor and ask for a prescription for 2 testicles.

Oh, don´t worry both my testicles are where they belong and they are big enough to take you on anyday.
You on the other hand should think a bit further and see the bigger picture of what you are suggesting. It won´t just stop with choosing who lives and who dies, you need the infrastructure in law and in morals to be able to see such an atrocity through to it´s logical conclusion.
Do you want to be the doctor who decides on who lives or dies? Especially when the decision is not based on a terminal illness but on lack of money.
You also have to justify the 1.5 trillion shoveled over to WallStreet against a few thousand for ventilators.
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  #126  
Old 31.03.2020, 11:39
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Re: Corona - The aftermath

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While it is impossible to be anything but concerned for the future of the world, there is more than enough wealth on this planet that should ensure generations will NOT be affected by this crisis. Perhaps we will see a redistribution of this wealth and government spending on things that actually mater.

P.S. Why don't you go ahead and volunteer to sacrifice yourself or your loved ones for the economy?
The world you live in obviously has unicorns in it.
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  #127  
Old 31.03.2020, 11:40
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Re: Corona - The aftermath

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The world you live in obviously has unicorns in it.
How does your world look like? With masters and slaves, no?
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  #128  
Old 31.03.2020, 11:44
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Re: Corona - The aftermath

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How does your world look like? With masters and slaves, no?
Hysterical again.
Go and have a sit down.
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  #129  
Old 31.03.2020, 11:54
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Re: Corona - The aftermath

Anyone else noticing shifting family dynamics already? "Before", I was more of a mom, in the sidelines while my daughter and her friends hung out together and made TikTok videos. Now she's got me doing them with her, and even though she still calls me a boomer (for *gasp* watching a video twice ) we are having fun and we´re hanging out like we are friends rather than parent and child. I wonder how much of it will continue "after", or if it will become something of which "we shall not speak of this again" hah.

I feel sorry for younger people, I'm feeling it enough that I can't go out and see my friends, but it must be so much harder for teenagers. I think they're coping with it remarkably well, I'm quite touched by their maturity tbh. I don't think I would have so readily socialised with my own parents at that age.
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  #130  
Old 31.03.2020, 12:10
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Re: Corona - The aftermath

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Hysterical again.
Go and have a sit down.
You keep banging on about people getting back to work.

Perhaps you ought to take a bit of your own advice and get on with something useful rather than spending the entire day making stupid comments on this forum?

HTH
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  #131  
Old 31.03.2020, 12:30
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Re: Corona - The aftermath

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Anyone else noticing shifting family dynamics already? "Before", I was more of a mom, in the sidelines while my daughter and her friends hung out together and made TikTok videos. Now she's got me doing them with her, and even though she still calls me a boomer (for *gasp* watching a video twice ) we are having fun and we´re hanging out like we are friends rather than parent and child. I wonder how much of it will continue "after", or if it will become something of which "we shall not speak of this again" hah.

I feel sorry for younger people, I'm feeling it enough that I can't go out and see my friends, but it must be so much harder for teenagers. I think they're coping with it remarkably well, I'm quite touched by their maturity tbh. I don't think I would have so readily socialised with my own parents at that age.
I've starred in TikTok videos before but am now helping my daughter much more than before with her school work.
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  #132  
Old 31.03.2020, 12:51
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Re: Corona - The aftermath

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You keep banging on about people getting back to work.

Perhaps you ought to take a bit of your own advice and get on with something useful rather than spending the entire day making stupid comments on this forum?

HTH
I'm one of the lucky ones who is working full time from home.
I'm drawn back here waiting for intelligent suggestions to unwind from this predicament we have placed ourselves in, because waiting for the anti-body test is not a viable option.

All there is is we must stay safe, when 99+% of us are safe anyway.
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  #133  
Old 31.03.2020, 13:11
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Re: Corona - The aftermath

What's your take on Sweden's chill approach?

“No gatherings of more than 50 people (revised down from 500 last Friday), avoid social contact if over 70 or ill, try to work from home, table service only in bars and restaurants”.

I’m curious to see that outcome. It surely depends a lot on the people behavior and culture, but the critical points are the health systems being overwhelmed (which they haven’t reached yet).


BTW here some potential timelines (US, but can be extended probably to others)
https://www.theatlantic.com/family/a...normal/608752/
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  #134  
Old 31.03.2020, 13:34
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Re: Corona - The aftermath

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One thing that is now evident is the fact that seasonal workers from eastern Europe are no longer coming to the west to work on the fields, no fruit pickers, no Spargelstecher, no cheap labour for farms, no flowerpickers for Holland, no vegetable pickers for France and Spain.
That is going to put a dent on the harvest for 2020, add to that these workers depend on the sesonal work for a living.
Well with a lot of people on partial work reduction/no work and itching to get out of the house I'd say they'll have a few takers for a couple of days work in the fields. I'm tempted at the moment!
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  #135  
Old 31.03.2020, 13:49
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Re: Corona - The aftermath

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What's your take on Sweden's chill approach?

“No gatherings of more than 50 people (revised down from 500 last Friday), avoid social contact if over 70 or ill, try to work from home, table service only in bars and restaurants”.

I’m curious to see that outcome. It surely depends a lot on the people behavior and culture, but the critical points are the health systems being overwhelmed (which they haven’t reached yet).
I read that 40% of households in Sweden are single occupancy, rising to 60% in Stockholm. Thats a pretty different situation to much of Southern Europe.
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Old 31.03.2020, 15:43
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Re: Corona - The aftermath

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What's your take on Sweden's chill approach?
I hope that their health system is all it's cracked up to be...
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  #137  
Old 31.03.2020, 22:41
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Re: Corona - The aftermath

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...Never has so much been spent of so few for so little.
What a horrible thing to say. This thing isn't over yet. Contrary to popular belief it's not just hitting the elderly who "would have died in 5 years anyway".

The mind boggles.
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Old 01.04.2020, 08:15
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Re: Corona - The aftermath

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What a horrible thing to say. This thing isn't over yet. Contrary to popular belief it's not just hitting the elderly who "would have died in 5 years anyway".

The mind boggles.
here is the situation in italy. most deaths from the elderly 80 to over 90 years old and probably all with other health problems so the cause of death was not just corona. italy has the most elderly people from all europe.

https://www.livescience.com/why-ital...s-so-high.html
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  #139  
Old 01.04.2020, 08:32
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Re: Corona - The aftermath

The elderly may be more likely to die from it, but everyone is vulnerable.

"A 13-year-old boy who tested positive for coronavirus has died, a London hospital trust has said."

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-52114476
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Old 01.04.2020, 08:45
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Re: Corona - The aftermath

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The elderly may be more likely to die from it, but everyone is vulnerable.

"A 13-year-old boy who tested positive for coronavirus has died, a London hospital trust has said."

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-52114476
Yes. We are vulnerable to diseases of all kinds. Nothing will prevent that-apart from living healthily and strenghthening the immune system. But unfortunately one has to battle with alot of other things like pollution and degredation of the environment
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