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  #41  
Old 15.05.2020, 20:33
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Re: Do you expect to wfh more often in future?

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  #42  
Old 15.05.2020, 20:43
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Re: Do you expect to wfh more often in future?

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Most of Europe is in the same time-zone. Most of IT people will for example speak rather good English (much more understandable to me than most of those from India).

So even though not all jobs should suddenly disappear, the trend may be going in that direction. Maybe world-wide wage equalisation is not a bad thing. It may also lead to less crowded city-centres as less need to not be far away from your workplace. Sure, you may still want to be close to restaurants, to your kid's school, etc. but the pressure should ease.
The other effect of course being the reverse: we can now apply for jobs anywhere in the world and work from here. Yes Switzerland is expensive but if you are now looking at work in London financial district or San Francisco for example then more work is now potentially available.
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  #43  
Old 15.05.2020, 21:37
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Re: Do you expect to wfh more often in future?

Alas, I need a medium sized room to correctly work at home, I keep excess stuff in the garage on an as needed basis.

Each time I need to go between office and home, I need to move a carload of stuff, and spend half a day re-configuring IP addresses and such.

100% one way or the other is all that can work, but long term I would need a larger home, not enough space.

Tom
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  #44  
Old 16.05.2020, 01:04
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Re: Do you expect to wfh more often in future?

Well there are one or two other aspects to a job and to whoever holds the job than just "salary level". Of course it's the perfect playing ground for one of those fun popular short-term cost-saving exercises, but we know how those tend to go and how sustainable they tend to be.

Our company mostly allows people to work wherever they want anyway, and I've always worked at home for a day or two a week plus often only went to the office for half a day, and occasionally did WFH for a few weeks in a row. I don't expect to have a fundamentally different approach going forward.

The only reason these ridiculous 10+-hour-video-conferencing-days sort of worked out was because everyone was at home and employees had little choice. That will change once some people start going back. WFH is not the same and never will be - certainly not if you operate within a larger company. Many of my colleagues are now starting to struggle with the fact that all informal and even many formal communications routes have essentially been eliminated and that it takes much more effort to find out anything about anything. For me it's the fact that any form of work that require some element of creative (group) thinking is impossible to do, or at best significantly less efficient. I also find it increasingly difficult to manage up. I also know plenty of people who generally hate to work from home and under normal circumstances never do, so they went back or will go back as soon as they can.

Beyond that, human beings are both social creatures and creatures of habit. Companies aren't just a physical place to work, but social constructs and remote work will not entirely replace F2F for a very long time, if ever.

Some people will likely choose to WFH a little more than before. Of course some jobs will be temporarily sent to whatever is the current flavour du jour. But by and large, virtual working is not going to stick around at the scale it did in the last two months.
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  #45  
Old 16.05.2020, 04:15
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Re: Do you expect to wfh more often in future?

I'm sure my employer will start to look more at WFH once it is shown that you successfully can work out of the office... Work From Hyderabad that is...
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  #46  
Old 16.05.2020, 11:48
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Re: Do you expect to wfh more often in future?

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So even though not all jobs should suddenly disappear, the trend may be going in that direction. Maybe world-wide wage equalisation is not a bad thing. It may also lead to less crowded city-centres as less need to not be far away from your workplace. Sure, you may still want to be close to restaurants, to your kid's school, etc. but the pressure should ease.
The problem is, they will tend to equalize in the direction of Indian wage, not Swiss/Valley. Ready to live on 400$/month in CH?
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  #47  
Old 16.05.2020, 12:07
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Re: Do you expect to wfh more often in future?

Our office previously accommodated 700 staff a day, plus consultants and service providers, visitors, business travellers etc.

We've begun a phased reopening and can allow 15% of them to return, and from June will allow up to 30% of staff to reenter the office, if they need to.

By our assessments, without a complete redesign of every part of the site, it will never be possible to allow more than a third of our staff to return to the office and keep a physical distance.

And even if people want to come to the office, schools and public transport may make that impossible for many.

Remote working, flexible working and working from home are no longer nice to haves.
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  #48  
Old 17.05.2020, 15:51
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Re: Do you expect to wfh more often in future?

Would some of big companies, e.g. Novartis, publish quarterly stats on new hires? We could see if they slowed down hiring locally or not.
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  #49  
Old 17.05.2020, 16:23
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Re: Do you expect to wfh more often in future?

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The problem is, they will tend to equalize in the direction of Indian wage, not Swiss/Valley. Ready to live on 400$/month in CH?
If companies wouldn't need clients, then that's a realistic option.
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  #50  
Old 17.05.2020, 18:01
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Re: Do you expect to wfh more often in future?

I have never been a fan of working from home, but I have to admit that it has been a much better experience than I was expecting. I am one of the lucky ones though: dedicated workspace in a room that already doubled as spare bedroom and occasional office, big screen, no children running around, very good internet connection, and so on.

It has even had some real benefits in work terms: things like virtual coffee breaks have definitely brought my (geographically dispersed) team closer together. I think I would still prefer to be in the office, but I will be less averse to working from home in the future.
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  #51  
Old 18.05.2020, 01:22
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Re: Do you expect to wfh more often in future?

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Would some of big companies, e.g. Novartis, publish quarterly stats on new hires? We could see if they slowed down hiring locally or not.
It's a 3 month lagging indicator. Don't expect a anything to change for at least a month.
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  #52  
Old 18.05.2020, 17:46
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Re: Do you expect to wfh more often in future?

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I cannot imagine the city centers with little shops, services, cafes and restos to survive without those who spend time and money there at lunch times. It will start to resemble residencies and suburbs with giant malls on the outskirts and nothing else.
I missed this reply earlier. It's a valid point. Any time a business closes or reduces staff (relocates in this case?) the local shops are hit hard. We've seen it time and again in the USA, with various manufacturing facilities and even military bases closing. People who work outside the home contribute a lot to local business.
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  #53  
Old 19.05.2020, 11:32
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Re: Do you expect to wfh more often in future?

Yes, I believe this is one good side effect of the Corona Virus for the long term. Here in Germany, and I understand the Swiss Market is even more strict about it, Home Office was not so much tolerated especially within big Companies. Now, they had no choice and realized that the Skies did not fall apart and Business can go on, with some adjustments. As far as I understand, the BIG ones like Microsoft, Google, Facebook have declared that they will continue WFH until 2021 and this has a Domino effect on the smaller ones. In my Company (Software) also we were just notified yesterday that with no connection to the Authorities guidelines, we will continue to work ALL the Employees from Home, at least until 2021. So, lets hope.
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  #54  
Old 19.05.2020, 14:35
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Re: Do you expect to wfh more often in future?

I hope so. Not 100% but certainly more than I had previously (max 20% covering a month period, 10-15% over 12M)
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  #55  
Old 24.05.2020, 11:20
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Re: Do you expect to wfh more often in future?

The Bundesgericht may have just thrown a spanner in the works for those who hope that WFH becomes the new norm.

From the 20 Minuten, who are reporting a Sonntagszeitung story:
https://www.20min.ch/comment/522608730661

Deepl translation:

Swiss companies must pay employees a share of the rent if they let them work in their home office. This is stated by the Federal Court in a recent case, the "Sonntagszeitung" reports. An employee of a Zurich company had claimed the compensation.

The company argued that it had never made a corresponding compensation agreement with the employee. But the judges did not allow this to apply. The company even had to pay the compensation retroactively.


---

The article goes on to quote Thomas Geiser, Professor of Labour Law at the University of St. Gallen, who emphasises that this ruling does not necessarily mean that everyone working from home is entitled to rent compensation from the employer. Geisser interprets the ruling that only if one works from home involuntarily could one claim compensation, those who work from home at their own request are not entitled.

And whether this applies to a limited situation like the Coronavirus WFH is not clear.

Nonetheless, that's a big ol' can o' worms just opened.


A few more details, from the NZZ (Might be behind a paywall)
https://www.nzz.ch/schweiz/arbeitgeb...ken-ld.1557921

Last edited by meloncollie; 24.05.2020 at 11:30.
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  #56  
Old 24.05.2020, 11:29
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Re: Do you expect to wfh more often in future?

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The Bundesgericht may have just thrown a spanner in the works for those who hope that WFH becomes the new norm.
Makes sense, as I would need to rent more space to do this long term.

Tom
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  #57  
Old 24.05.2020, 11:56
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Re: Do you expect to wfh more often in future?

I hope all extra costs will get covered, not just rent. A portion of hardware cost, internet, calls, printing, etc. It would make sense.
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  #58  
Old 24.05.2020, 18:33
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Re: Do you expect to wfh more often in future?

It only makes sense (and that's the argument accepted by the judge) if you have no other choice than to wfh, excluding special circumstances like these times. I believe that's clearly not the direction most companies would adopt if they were to make wfh a thing.

Personally I would see wfh as an alternative choice, never an obligation, and probably limited to something like 60-80% max for most employees (i.e. at least 1 day per week in the office). Coming to the office is still important for many reasons, beginning with socialization.
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Old 25.05.2020, 14:29
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Re: Do you expect to wfh more often in future?

I can see whf being abused. We will hire you. We will hire you if you can help us cut corners and work 2 days at home. 3, 4....It breeches the very fragile balance between private and professional life. Balance that most new comers came here for.
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  #60  
Old 27.05.2020, 20:24
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Re: Do you expect to wfh more often in future?

Btw does anyone know how it works in practice in regard to tax deductions?

I mean the tax administration can't possibly know how many days you worked from home, right? What if you still claim the maximum deductible amounts as if you were in the office while you were actually wfh at 60%?
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