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  #81  
Old 10.07.2020, 16:52
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Re: Smoking cigars in the bathing area ( on the lake )

To be clear, I completely respect everyone's personal beliefs and their rights to live and share those beliefs, whatever they may be. I do not believe anyone has the right to enforce those beliefs on others. Hence my aversion to the word "ban". I hope you all have a great weekend by the way
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  #82  
Old 10.07.2020, 16:59
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Re: Smoking cigars in the bathing area ( on the lake )

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Dont smoke myself, but love the smell of cigars. Once discretely followed a cigar smoker all the way down 5th avenue in NY, just to enjoy the smell of his cigar.

When Im 70 and its too late to get cancer from it, Ill start with cigars myself...
Stalking cigar smokers can be dangerous! Sounds very kinky to me

Last edited by omtatsat; 10.07.2020 at 17:20.
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  #83  
Old 10.07.2020, 17:03
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Re: Smoking cigars in the bathing area ( on the lake )

Good on you aussies!

"Smoking is illegal in enclosed public places, workplaces, outdoor areas at underage events, and covered areas of public transport stops or stations. However, smoking is permitted in outdoor dining and drinking areas in Victoria, including rooftops, balconies, verandas, courtyards, marquees and the footpath/street."
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  #84  
Old 10.07.2020, 17:17
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Re: Smoking cigars in the bathing area ( on the lake )

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Feel free to look the introduction of the current rules.

Very funny. By that logic everybody who's affected by the question at hand should have to abstain - which oftentimes is the entire population.

It's very clear that you're among those people who strongly disagree with democracy whenever you have a strong opinion on the topic and the voters decided against you.
One example please, just one.
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  #85  
Old 10.07.2020, 17:21
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Re: Smoking cigars in the bathing area ( on the lake )

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I'm pretty sure you're intentionally misrepresenting what I posted.
What exactly do you mean then? Obviously you were not very clear the first time.
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  #86  
Old 10.07.2020, 17:22
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Re: Smoking cigars in the bathing area ( on the lake )

Or perhaps a reminder that Geneva voters overwhelmingly sought the banning of smoking indoors THREE times. Some local politician (who was a smoker) managed to tie implementation up in council and the courts. The will of the people frustrated by a nicotine addict. Each of the three votes passed with a 70%+ majority.
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  #87  
Old 10.07.2020, 17:27
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Re: Smoking cigars in the bathing area ( on the lake )

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To be clear, I completely respect everyone's personal beliefs and their rights to live and share those beliefs, whatever they may be. I do not believe anyone has the right to enforce those beliefs on others. Hence my aversion to the word "ban". I hope you all have a great weekend by the way
Except we're not talking about beliefs. This isn't a discussion about Gods.

Tobacco has been shown to be harmful to health when taking directly, indirectly. It also remains toxic when left in residue on surfaces such as tables.

It's also been shown that de-normalising it reduces the number of younger people taking up the addictive habit.

We're not talking about bans (well I'm not, anyway). I'm talking about moral duty, commonsense and social responsibility and not a selfish, self-centred attitude - just because something is allowed by law.

Have a good weekend too!
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Old 10.07.2020, 17:33
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Re: Smoking cigars in the bathing area ( on the lake )

I accidentally sat on someone who was smoking at the pool.

Close butt, no cigar.
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  #89  
Old 10.07.2020, 17:34
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Re: Smoking cigars in the bathing area ( on the lake )

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That's a little whataboutism, as THAT particular ruling was about banning smoker's lounges, and had nothing to do with smoking in public, open spaces. But in any case, that was nearly 10 years ago. Societies evolve, and I remain hopeful and expect a slow albeit gradual mindset change towards healthier habits.
People who have started smoking in their teens and never stopped really dont know anymore what its like to not smoke and what a difference it makes to life quality. One should I guess feel a ( little ) bit sad for smokers
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  #90  
Old 10.07.2020, 17:59
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Re: Smoking cigars in the bathing area ( on the lake )

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People who have started smoking in their teens and never stopped really dont know anymore what its like to not smoke and what a difference it makes to life quality. One should I guess feel a ( little ) bit sad for smokers
I feel incredibly sad for any addict, and hope they realise that help is available.
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  #91  
Old 10.07.2020, 18:19
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Re: Smoking cigars in the bathing area ( on the lake )

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I feel incredibly sad for any addict, and hope they realise that help is available.
i think many smokers don't see themselves as addicts
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  #92  
Old 10.07.2020, 20:03
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Re: Smoking cigars in the bathing area ( on the lake )

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i think many smokers don't see themselves as addicts
Oh, right. They can stop anytime but donít because they enjoy it.

And if you believe that, can I interest you in a bridge over the Rade in Geneva?
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Old 10.07.2020, 21:22
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Re: Smoking cigars in the bathing area ( on the lake )

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One example please, just one.
That *is* an example.

ETA:
There's also the "Schutz vor Passivrauchen" Volksinitiative that was rejected a few years after the current regulation came into force.

Last edited by Urs Max; 10.07.2020 at 22:09.
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  #94  
Old 10.07.2020, 21:57
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Re: Smoking cigars in the bathing area ( on the lake )

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People who have started smoking in their teens and never stopped really dont know anymore what its like to not smoke and what a difference it makes to life quality. One should I guess feel a ( little ) bit sad for smokers
About smoking since thier teens, I noticed many classmates started smoking when the final exams (and associated stress) of high school came around... i found this pathetic... bunch of weaklings

My dad started smoking at 13, got diagnosed with lungcancer at 56. They took out one lung and he is still around (now 75 yrs old). Worried about him with this covid thing though...
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Old 10.07.2020, 22:30
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Re: Smoking cigars in the bathing area ( on the lake )

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People who have started smoking in their teens and never stopped really dont know anymore what its like to not smoke and what a difference it makes to life quality. One should I guess feel a ( little ) bit sad for smokers
Wasn't it legal for children to buy cigarettes until very recently in multiple cantons? And teenagers can still buy cigarettes at 16, a full decade before the prefrontal lobe is fully developed. This is a societal-imposed problem. If the brain develops with nicotine, it's going to need nicotine for normal functioning. The best way to reduce smoking adults is to avoid that first cigarette until people are in their mid-twenties. At that point, cigarettes will be a choice and not an addiction, and we can tell people to exercise their choice away from non-smokers.
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Old 11.07.2020, 06:41
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Re: Smoking cigars in the bathing area ( on the lake )

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About smoking since thier teens, I noticed many classmates started smoking when the final exams (and associated stress) of high school came around... i found this pathetic... bunch of weaklings

My dad started smoking at 13, got diagnosed with lungcancer at 56. They took out one lung and he is still around (now 75 yrs old). Worried about him with this covid thing though...
My father smoked till he was 60 or so. Then in one day he gave it up. Strong will power runs in our family!
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Old 11.07.2020, 08:06
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Re: Smoking cigars in the bathing area ( on the lake )

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Wasn't it legal for children to buy cigarettes until very recently in multiple cantons? And teenagers can still buy cigarettes at 16, a full decade before the prefrontal lobe is fully developed. This is a societal-imposed problem. If the brain develops with nicotine, it's going to need nicotine for normal functioning. The best way to reduce smoking adults is to avoid that first cigarette until people are in their mid-twenties. At that point, cigarettes will be a choice and not an addiction, and we can tell people to exercise their choice away from non-smokers.
If you criminalize nicotin before 26 then, is it going to work as well as it did when the US put the age limit (21) on alcohol? Because it doesn't seem to work nor deter. USA has a big problem with secret alcoholism, in my opinion. Despite public smoking being so ostentatiously frowned upon there.
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Old 11.07.2020, 09:33
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Re: Smoking cigars in the bathing area ( on the lake )

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Wasn't it legal for children to buy cigarettes until very recently in multiple cantons? And teenagers can still buy cigarettes at 16, a full decade before the prefrontal lobe is fully developed. This is a societal-imposed problem. If the brain develops with nicotine, it's going to need nicotine for normal functioning. The best way to reduce smoking adults is to avoid that first cigarette until people are in their mid-twenties. At that point, cigarettes will be a choice and not an addiction, and we can tell people to exercise their choice away from non-smokers.
Teenagers can also buy beer (and I think wine too, but I'm not so sure about that?) at 16 here....so it is culturally accepted to start early.

I would push the age limit at least at 18 if not 21. Whatever people say, making some things less "easily available" and even culturally glorified (alcohol ads are still legal, no?) could and will reduce consumption, it's not a myth...
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Old 11.07.2020, 09:40
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Re: Smoking cigars in the bathing area ( on the lake )

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That *is* an example.
What is an example?

This forum has a quote function so you can quote the post to which you are replying.

You were going to tell me that, in your view, if the law states you can do something then stuff everyone else's health and comfort.

If your views are different, then what are they? You have enough time to criticise everyone else's views. What are yours?
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Old 11.07.2020, 09:41
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Re: Smoking cigars in the bathing area ( on the lake )

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Teenagers can also buy beer (and I think wine too, but I'm not so sure about that?) at 16 here....so it is culturally accepted to start early.

I would push the age limit at least at 18 if not 21. Whatever people say, making some things less "easily available" and even culturally glorified (alcohol ads are still legal, no?) could and will reduce consumption, it's not a myth...
Quite a few cantons have increased the minimum age for tobacco sales to 18 now.

Wine and beer etc is from 16 and strong alcohol from 18 although some places (coop for example) have a blanket rule of age 18 minimum for everything alcoholic.

Last edited by Belgianmum; 11.07.2020 at 11:19.
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