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  #41  
Old 11.09.2020, 12:50
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Re: Jehovah's Witnesses

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Neither do I. It's just Dawkin's polemic doesn't really contain much of either. But, you know, the faithful cling to their bibles, despite the obvious failings.

He should have kept out of philosophy and stuck to evolutionary biology. He's good at that.
I was even Ok with many of his earlier books in which he criticiszed society in general and showed how bad it is that people in positions of power don't understand science or listen to scientists. All very valid arguments. Except of course that the only people who were listening to him were scientists themselves and they already agreed with him. But you could have said he was heading in the right direction and doing something that many scientists are sadly very poor at, explaining what's going on in terms that ordinary people can follow but without actually dumbing it down. I liked that about him.

But then he had to go and spoil it all by getting into hare-brained arguments with Muslims over theological questions that he hadn't actually understood.
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  #42  
Old 11.09.2020, 14:23
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Re: Jehovah's Witnesses

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I was even Ok with many of his earlier books in which he criticiszed society in general and showed how bad it is that people in positions of power don't understand science or listen to scientists. All very valid arguments. Except of course that the only people who were listening to him were scientists themselves and they already agreed with him. But you could have said he was heading in the right direction and doing something that many scientists are sadly very poor at, explaining what's going on in terms that ordinary people can follow but without actually dumbing it down. I liked that about him.

But then he had to go and spoil it all by getting into hare-brained arguments with Muslims over theological questions that he hadn't actually understood.
His popular science books are very good. It's when he strays out of his area he begins to look a bit silly from people with knowledge of that area. It would be like a theologian critiquing evolutionary biology based on the understanding of the creationists... toe-curlingly embarrassing.

Dawkins does have the good grace to know that some of his fans are bit over fanatical, and treat his non-science writings almost as holy writ!
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  #43  
Old 11.09.2020, 14:38
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Re: Jehovah's Witnesses

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His popular science books are very good. It's when he strays out of his area he begins to look a bit silly from people with knowledge of that area. It would be like a theologian critiquing evolutionary biology based on the understanding of the creationists... toe-curlingly embarrassing.

Dawkins does have the good grace to know that some of his fans are bit over fanatical, and treat his non-science writings almost as holy writ!
Dawkins fell out of favor with me by constantly repeating the same old thrashed out and condescending arguments to the more wingnut fraction of the religious and not engaging in dialogue. That´s not going to change or even impress any god-diddler what so ever.
Aron Ra gives a good discussion against religion though.
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  #44  
Old 11.09.2020, 15:31
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Re: Jehovah's Witnesses

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His popular science books are very good. It's when he strays out of his area he begins to look a bit silly from people with knowledge of that area. It would be like a theologian critiquing evolutionary biology based on the understanding of the creationists... toe-curlingly embarrassing.
Hearing Dawkins debate religion is a bit like somebody who has read a kid's book about dinosaurs (even one that is properly researched scientifically) thinking they have understood enough to poke holes in Darwinian theory.

His general anti religion stuff eggs on the anti-religion folks.

His anti Muslim stuff eggs on the closet racists.

But none of it actually advances any meaningful debate.
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  #45  
Old 11.09.2020, 19:57
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Re: Jehovah's Witnesses

I read Pratchett's, Cohen's and Stewart's The Science of Roundworld, and realised that I (and most non-scientist, and probably a fair few scientists) don't really understand what evolution is about.
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  #46  
Old 12.09.2020, 08:35
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Re: Jehovah's Witnesses

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Have other wonderful members of this forum also been attacked by these ferocious, sweet-looking ladies? I'm starting to believe that the mail lady might be involved with them.
I have never been attacked by anyone (thankfully) even less so by JWs. However, I was "trapped" (a couple of times it was because I actually wanted to hear what they have to say) into conversing with some of them or other cults evangelists, but not even once, not even for the tinniest amount of time, did I feel "in danger". In danger of losing my patience yes, but that's another matter altogether.

Anyways, I learned to be less "encouraging" and firmer, but I decline politely all the invitations. I don't mind these people. I don't get why others do, because they don't force you to do anything you don't like. Not even to talk to them. If you're so peeved by their mere existence, it's your problem not theirs.
Tolerance goes a long way. Peace.
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  #47  
Old 12.09.2020, 10:59
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Re: Jehovah's Witnesses

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Hello beautiful groaners!

Yesterday my doorbell rang. Not once nor twice nor thrice, but 7 times total. Usually, I ignore it unless I know that something or someone is expected.

Seeing that this something or someone was rather persistent, I decided to open my door and see what the fork was going on. HUGE MISTAKE! Oh man, how I wish I'd just follow my gut and ignore it as usual.

Two ladies were standing in front of me:

Ladies: Hello Mr. Wrongster, do you speak Italian?
Wrongsty: Yes, I do!
Ladies: Do you have 20 minutes of your time to hear us out?
Wrongsty: Sure! What ya selling? (I guess listening to my mother tongue deactivated my anti-bs radar)
Ladies: 10 minutes monologue about society and how we've deviated from our path and the 13 reasons why I should convert and join them.
Wrongsty: Ah! You want me to join your sect?
Ladies**Infuriated**: IT IS NO SECT!
Wrongsty: Sorry, it sounds a lot like one.
Ladies ** Super saiyan God SS3 infuriated **: STOP INSULTING US!!!!!
Wrongsty: Sure, have a great day Bye

On their way out they left a pamphlet on my mailbox. I guess they do believe in second chances.

Have other wonderful members of this forum also been attacked by these ferocious, sweet-looking ladies? I'm starting to believe that the mail lady might be involved with them.



Right ,It is a " CULT"
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  #48  
Old 12.09.2020, 11:26
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Re: Jehovah's Witnesses

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I don't mind these people. I don't get why others do, because they don't force you to do anything you don't like. Not even to talk to them. If you're so peeved by their mere existence, it's your problem not theirs.
Tolerance goes a long way. Peace.
I don't mind them either, but if you come to my home, insistently disturb my peace, and try to sell/convince me of something, I do consider it an attack. I did not call them. I only made use of my right to freedom of speech.
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  #49  
Old 12.09.2020, 12:33
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Re: Jehovah's Witnesses

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I don't mind them either, but if you come to my home, insistently disturb my peace, and try to sell/convince me of something, I do consider it an attack. I did not call them. I only made use of my right to freedom of speech.

You make it sound like Ulysses' encounter with the Sirens.



Just politely tell them that you're not interested and they will leave. This approach always worked for me.
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  #50  
Old 12.09.2020, 13:04
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Re: Jehovah's Witnesses

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Wouldn't you feel threatened if someone rings your doorbell 7 times? 3 are more than enough!
They’ve been knocking on my door non-stop for the last three hours now.

Jokes on them, I ain’t ever letting them out of the cellar.
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  #51  
Old 12.09.2020, 13:05
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Re: Jehovah's Witnesses

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Fit?
Yep. Nice knockers!
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  #52  
Old 12.09.2020, 13:07
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Re: Jehovah's Witnesses

My Dad used to do this.... he said it broke the day up.....

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My sister likes to invite them in and then debate them on points in the Bible!

Tom
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Old 12.09.2020, 13:14
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Re: Jehovah's Witnesses

I rarely answer the door unless I'm expecting someone and I have a camera to see if its the lovely postie/DHL man, occasionally I make a mistake and open it but I then make everyone trying to sell ANYTHING speak to me in English... and I keep interrupting with 'I'm sorry can you repeat that, I don't understand' every time they make a mistake...... really pisses them off I can tell you..... Once someone informed me that I should speak German if I live in CH to which I replied that I do but its my house and my rules - in German.... pisses them off more....

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Hello beautiful groaners!

Ladies: Hello Mr. Wrongster, do you speak Italian?
Wrongsty: Yes, I do!

.
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  #54  
Old 12.09.2020, 14:00
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Re: Jehovah's Witnesses

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I rarely answer the door unless I'm expecting someone and I have a camera to see if its the lovely postie/DHL man, occasionally I make a mistake and open it but I then make everyone trying to sell ANYTHING speak to me in English... and I keep interrupting with 'I'm sorry can you repeat that, I don't understand' every time they make a mistake...... really pisses them off I can tell you..... Once someone informed me that I should speak German if I live in CH to which I replied that I do but its my house and my rules - in German.... pisses them off more....
Oooo! Nice touch.
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Old 13.09.2020, 15:18
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Re: Jehovah's Witnesses

Curiously since I retired about 18 months ago, haven't seen a single JW or Mormon at my door, which rather surprized me, as I do spend more time at home than I used to. Maybe I've been blacklisted, which wouldn't surprize me and suits me anyway. I always started off by telling them there wasn't any god, which I think derailed them from their script, as I suspect their script starts by assuming there is one, but you're looking at the wrong one and that theirs is much better.
I sometimes use a similar technique on cold-callers, though if I detect a North-African touch in French or the Indian tones of a Microsoft scammer, I just switch to Swiss-German. I don't speak it fluently but certainly several leagues better than they do.
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  #56  
Old 13.09.2020, 15:45
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Re: Jehovah's Witnesses

Just a small point, but surprise is one of those words that's spelled the same in US and British English. Similarly enterprise and capsize.
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  #57  
Old 13.09.2020, 19:00
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Re: Jehovah's Witnesses

I have one of those faces that seems to attract various weirdos and Jehovah's Witnesses. Had them at the door when I lived in Kleinbasel, but when they realised I didn't speak German they figured there was no pint talking to me. I've even been stopped by them in the street twice on holiday in Malta.
My dear old dad was N Irish and he used to lie to them by saying he was RC as he said they'd go away thinking they'd never be able to convert him.
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  #58  
Old 13.09.2020, 19:26
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Re: Jehovah's Witnesses

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My dear old dad was N Irish and he used to lie to them by saying he was RC as he said they'd go away thinking they'd never be able to convert him.
I used to tell them I'm a Jewish lesbian. They didn't even say goodbye.
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Old 14.09.2020, 13:52
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Re: Jehovah's Witnesses

The automatic answer to proselytisers is "I don't think you want to talk to me, I'm an apostate."

Usually they politely say "thank you" and leave.
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  #60  
Old 14.09.2020, 14:01
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Re: Jehovah's Witnesses

My parents actually once invited a pair of Mormon missionaries over for dinner.

They felt sorry for them being lonely and so far away from home, as well as being rejected by everyone. Ther only condition attached to the invitation was that they don't mention any religious stuff.

They agreed and they apparently had a very pleasant dinner together and were still in touch many years later.
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