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Old 22.11.2020, 12:24
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another neighbor issue thread

Hi everyone,

I am a non-EU student studying and working in Zurich. I found a really nice studio in the city with a really good price (Genossenschaft) two years ago. Upon finding this place, i thought i were lucky, but my happiness didn't last as i realized the wall is really thin and i share two walls with my neighbors' kitchen and bathroom. The neighbors are not a family, but a combination of an old lady, a young guy and a lady who is mentally sick. Two of them are getting financial support from the government and only one works. This means they are at home all day, and guess what? They use the kitchen as a living room always sitting there talking, cooking, watching TV although they have 4 bedrooms and they can use one as a living room. At the beginning, I asked them politely not to make noise from 22.00 to 7.00 and the lady who looked so friendly and nice told me that she was sorry and she didn't know that I can hear them. This didn't stop here as after one week, they started doing the same thing. I started using earplugs the whole day and night cause i cannot ask someone 20 times to stay silent during the night. My patience lasted 2 complete years, but i cannot take it anymore. I started having hearing problems because of using earplugs and earphones for years. Today, I gathered my courage and asked the old lady once again to not make noise from 22.00 to 7.00 and she aggressively told me that they work at night and they are living, so there is nothing they can do. Worse than that, there will be another roommate coming to live with them from December who wakes up at 5.00 to go to work. Every year, one of the roommates leave the place and someone new will come (the first roommate was a girl addicted to drugs and i was so scared of her). I don't understand why the agency would rent such a nice and cheap place to someone like her instead of a family with children. I need to sleep at night in order to be able to study and work during the day, but they wake me up at least 5 times during the night. Do you have any suggestions? Now that she showed her true colors, i don't want to tolerate the situation anymore.
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Old 22.11.2020, 12:31
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Re: another neighbor issue thread

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Hi everyone,

I am a non-EU student studying and working in Zurich. I found a really nice studio in the city with a really good price (Genossenschaft) two years ago. Upon finding this place, i thought i were lucky, but my happiness didn't last as i realized the wall is really thin and i share two walls with my neighbors' kitchen and bathroom. The neighbors are not a family, but a combination of an old lady, a young guy and a lady who is mentally sick. Two of them are getting financial support from the government and only one works. This means they are at home all day, and guess what? They use the kitchen as a living room always sitting there talking, cooking, watching TV although they have 4 bedrooms and they can use one as a living room. At the beginning, I asked them politely not to make noise from 22.00 to 7.00 and the lady who looked so friendly and nice told me that she was sorry and she didn't know that I can hear them. This didn't stop here as after one week, they started doing the same thing. I started using earplugs the whole day and night cause i cannot ask someone 20 times to stay silent during the night. My patience lasted 2 complete years, but i cannot take it anymore. I started having hearing problems because of using earplugs and earphones for years. Today, I gathered my courage and asked the old lady once again to not make noise from 22.00 to 7.00 and she aggressively told me that they work at night and they are living, so there is nothing they can do. Worse than that, there will be another roommate coming to live with them from December who wakes up at 5.00 to go to work. Every year, one of the roommates leave the place and someone new will come (the first roommate was a girl addicted to drugs and i was so scared of her). I don't understand why the agency would rent such a nice and cheap place to someone like her instead of a family with children. I need to sleep at night in order to be able to study and work during the day, but they wake me up at least 5 times during the night. Do you have any suggestions? Now that she showed her true colors, i don't want to tolerate the situation anymore.
You have two choices:

1) Complain to your landlord with a detailed record of the times and types of noice that you have heard so they can be sent warnings. You may need to do this 2 or 3 times until more serious action is taken.
2) Move.

After 2 years of this, with no realistic end in sight, I woud be moving. The walls are thin, that cannot be changed, you will always hear noise to some extent. It also sounds like their living habits are very fixed/ingrained and could not be easily changed. So, ultimately it all depends on how much of your energy you want to dedicate to this and how much you are willing to endure to fight it.
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Old 22.11.2020, 12:50
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Re: another neighbor issue thread

Thanks for the suggestion! I just earn enough money to survive in this expensive city, so moving out is not an option considering the fact that the rent is really cheap. I also think even if i move out, there would be another person coming to live here and i don't want them to go through the same issues as me, so better to find a solution. I told the landlord at least 4 times, but nothing has changed. Maybe they think that i will leave after my studies, but the old Swiss lady will stay here forever. She moved to the apartment only 4 months before me.
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Old 22.11.2020, 13:08
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Re: another neighbor issue thread

Sounds like moving is your only option if the landlord/agency won't do anything. Have you even looked for a new place? Does it have to be a flat, could you make do with a subletted room? www.wgzimmer.ch
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Old 22.11.2020, 13:14
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Re: another neighbor issue thread

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Sounds like moving is your only option if the landlord/agency won't do anything. Have you even looked for a new place? Does it have to be a flat, could you make do with a subletted room? www.wgzimmer.ch
I prefer to have my own privacy. Studios are usually expensive in the city. Isn't there any other option than me leaving my studio? I am not the one who is breaking the rules. It is even written in the contract that no noise is allowed between 22.00 to 7.00. I actually know that the agency repaired the wall for one of the tenants, but after 10 years of her complaining to them.
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Old 22.11.2020, 13:16
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Re: another neighbor issue thread

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I prefer to have my own privacy. Studios are usually expensive in the city. Isn't there any other option than me leaving my studio? I am not the one who is breaking the rules. It is even written in the contract that no noise is allowed between 22.00 to 7.00. I actually know that the agency repaired the wall for one of the tenants, but after 10 years of her complaining to them.
There's a reason why some of these flats are cheap....it's because there are issues that won't be resolved. The hard truth is either put up with it or move out.

Good luck.
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Old 22.11.2020, 13:22
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Re: another neighbor issue thread

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I prefer to have my own privacy. Studios are usually expensive in the city. Isn't there any other option than me leaving my studio? I am not the one who is breaking the rules. It is even written in the contract that no noise is allowed between 22.00 to 7.00. I actually know that the agency repaired the wall for one of the tenants, but after 10 years of her complaining to them.
You could try asking at the renters' association if there's any pressure you could put on the landlord/agency about it. Are there other neighbours who suffer from this as well? If so, club together and put pressure on the landlord/agency to sort it out.

If neither of these work, then no, not much you can do except continue to put up with it or move.
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Old 22.11.2020, 13:28
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Re: another neighbor issue thread

According to the ever helpful ch.ch, the correct approach is to report the issue to the police:

https://www.ch.ch/en/noise-disturban...ms-neighbours/
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Old 22.11.2020, 13:37
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Re: another neighbor issue thread

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You could try asking at the renters' association if there's any pressure you could put on the landlord/agency about it. Are there other neighbours who suffer from this as well? If so, club together and put pressure on the landlord/agency to sort it out.

If neither of these work, then no, not much you can do except continue to put up with it or move.
I actually was curious if I was the only one who suffered from this. Then i talked to two other neighbors living in the studios and it seems like they have no issues. When i told them my neighbors don't sleep at night and spend the whole night making noise in the kitchen, they said that's really weird.
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Old 22.11.2020, 13:49
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Re: another neighbor issue thread

Curiously, what kind of ear plugs have you been using? I know that store-bought ones are not good to wear very often (or so I've been told), as they can cause your ears to begin to ring. They're also not very comfortable. I had some custom-made, silicone earplugs made for me a few years ago which are extremely comfortable because they fit perfectly inside my ear and they block out about 80% of noise. I can barely hear the fan on in my room when I wear them. I was told by the ear doctor, when they were made, that they're okay to wear often. I guess they're often made for people whose partners snore in bed.

Maybe another option would be to put something up to try to thicken and soundproof that shared wall, to help stop the noise from coming through. Maybe something like this (which you could attach using double-sided rug-tape, which comes off the wall easily, when you move):

https://www.amazon.de/-/en/Waveform-...6045593&sr=8-8

I agree with the above poster, though. There are noise laws here in CH and it sounds like your neighbors are refusing to respect your need to sleep at night. So maybe calling the police would be a good idea, since they're clearly not willing to adjust their noise levels otherwise.
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Old 22.11.2020, 14:06
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Re: another neighbor issue thread

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Curiously, what kind of ear plugs have you been using? I know that store-bought ones are not good to wear very often (or so I've been told), as they can cause your ears to begin to ring. They're also not very comfortable. I had some custom-made, silicone earplugs made for me a few years ago which are extremely comfortable because they fit perfectly inside my ear and they block out about 80% of noise. I can barely hear the fan on in my room when I wear them. I was told by the ear doctor, when they were made, that they're okay to wear often. I guess they're often made for people whose partners snore in bed.

Maybe another option would be to put something up to try to thicken and soundproof that shared wall, to help stop the noise from coming through. Maybe something like this (which you could attach using double-sided rug-tape, which comes off the wall easily, when you move):

https://www.amazon.de/-/en/Waveform-...6045593&sr=8-8

I agree with the above poster, though. There are noise laws here in CH and it sounds like your neighbors are refusing to respect your need to sleep at night. So maybe calling the police would be a good idea, since they're clearly not willing to adjust their noise levels otherwise.
I have the ones sold in Migros.
I am trying hard to be respectful towards them as this is really important in my culture to be in good terms with your neighbors, but it's just getting worse and worse. We never argues like this before, but it was the first time i decided to stand up for my own rights instead of trying to be as nice as possible to them.
The wall is 2.73*5, so i need 15 square meters to cover the whole wall. the other problem is that the water pipes are also inside the wall. When they open the tap, it produces loud noise that wakes me up. When they flush the toilet, i can also clearly hear them especially at night when there is complete silence. I don't know whether spending money to repair the wall would in the end block the noise somehow.
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Old 22.11.2020, 14:20
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Re: another neighbor issue thread

In your position, I would move. It seems very likely that the rent you pay is low because the neighbours make the place hard to let. You don't say much about what you have, where, and what you pay. But if it's the bargain you say it is, there is very likely to be a reason for that -- as you've discovered.

Your best bet may be to move further out of the city to find something at a similar price. Not sure about students but most people working in Zürich actually live outside. Public transport is so good that a short bus or train ride should make little practical difference to you. In return you may get somewhere more spacious in a friendly community where you'll be able to concentrate on your studies and enjoy a higher quality of life. Seems like a no-brainer to me.
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Old 22.11.2020, 14:32
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Re: another neighbor issue thread

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In your position, I would move. It seems very likely that the rent you pay is low because the neighbours make the place hard to let. You don't say much about what you have, where, and what you pay. But if it's the bargain you say it is, there is very likely to be a reason for that -- as you've discovered.

Your best bet may be to move further out of the city to find something at a similar price. Not sure about students but most people working in Zürich actually live outside. Public transport is so good that a short bus or train ride should make little practical difference to you. In return you may get somewhere more spacious in a friendly community where you'll be able to concentrate on your studies and enjoy a higher quality of life. Seems like a no-brainer to me.
Thanks for your post! I think that no one else can live in this studio because of the neighbors. I am looking for a real solution for the future tenant. I have to suggest someone upon leaving and I am going to be completely honest with whoever is interested in renting this place.
Everyone else pays the same rent as me. The neighbors moved in 4 months before me. They wanted to destroy the building to build a new apartment, so I first got a rental contract for 7 months only and they got one for 11 months. We were all supposed to leave, but they decided to keep the building as it is, so we stayed. I pay CHF 860 for a studio (1.5) and they pay CHF 1500 for a four-bedroom apartment, and this can be shared among the three of them.
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Old 22.11.2020, 14:36
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Re: another neighbor issue thread

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Everyone else pays the same rent as me. The neighbors moved in 4 months before me. They wanted to destroy the building to build a new apartment, so I first got a rental contract for 7 months only and they got one for 11 months. We were all supposed to leave, but they decided to keep the building as it is, so we stayed. I pay CHF 860 for a studio (1.5) and they pay CHF 1500 for a four-bedroom apartment, and this can be shared among the three of them.
Then you got unlucky with your neighbours. Put in for a change of studio as soon as one becomes available.
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Old 22.11.2020, 15:04
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Re: another neighbor issue thread

Welcome to the real Switzerland! On paper you live in a 1st world country with high living standards etc. etc. In reality you live in a country where in many situations you are totally powerless and void of basic human rights (in this case - ability to recover after hard days work). Your agency does not care, your neighbors do not care... I wonder have there been any cases where one has went to court to resolve a similar situation.

To summarize: effectively there is no way how-to fix the situation. Move out and never look back.
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Old 22.11.2020, 15:12
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Re: another neighbor issue thread

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Welcome to the real Switzerland! On paper you live in a 1st world country with high living standards etc. etc. In reality you live in a country where in many situations you are totally powerless and void of basic human rights (in this case - ability to recover after hard days work). Your agency does not care, your neighbors do not care... I wonder have there been any cases where one has went to court to resolve a similar situation.

To summarize: effectively there is no way how-to fix the situation. Move out and never look back.
So true! I come from a third-world country and lived in the capital city with more population than the whole Switzerland and never had any issue like this. It's actually good that i spent some years of my life in a so-called first-world country to experience the reality. After finishing my studies in less than a year, i will go back home and never regret leaving Switzerland.
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Old 22.11.2020, 15:13
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Re: another neighbor issue thread

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Thanks for your post! I think that no one else can live in this studio because of the neighbors. I am looking for a real solution for the future tenant. I have to suggest someone upon leaving and I am going to be completely honest with whoever is interested in renting this place.
Everyone else pays the same rent as me. The neighbors moved in 4 months before me. They wanted to destroy the building to build a new apartment, so I first got a rental contract for 7 months only and they got one for 11 months. We were all supposed to leave, but they decided to keep the building as it is, so we stayed. I pay CHF 860 for a studio (1.5) and they pay CHF 1500 for a four-bedroom apartment, and this can be shared among the three of them.
1) it is not your responsibility to make any improvements for the next tenant
2) if you try to advertise this apartment as being uninhabitable you have effectively 0 chances to find a nachmieter so I'd be very cautious about doing that
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Old 22.11.2020, 15:20
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Re: another neighbor issue thread

I like olygirl's idea -- to ask your landlord for the next studio apartment that becomes available. Maybe ask about the neighbors there first.

Another idea I had, in terms of dealing with the current noise, is maybe you could consider getting a white noise machine to use while you sleep. They really help drown out unwanted background noise. I use one sometimes and also one in my little boy's room when he's having trouble falling asleep. He likes the sound of it -- says it helps lull him to sleep. This is the one we have, but there are a lot of different ones out there (and cheaper):

https://techstudio.ch/products/lectr...xoCkyUQAvD_BwE

I like this one because the noise doesn't repeat in a cycle, it's just continuous.
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Old 22.11.2020, 16:03
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Re: another neighbor issue thread

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Thanks for your post! I think that no one else can live in this studio because of the neighbors. I am looking for a real solution for the future tenant. I have to suggest someone upon leaving and I am going to be completely honest with whoever is interested in renting this place...
It is not your responsibility to worry about the next tenants, so please don't do this to yourself. It's true that if you want to leave before the contract ends, you need to put forward another solvent candidate. But it's not your job to make sure that person is happy and to warn them of all the things you hate. Who knows, maybe a potential candidate is a night owl or heavy sleeper and wouldn't mind the neighbors at all!

As others have said, most people in CH realize that if you take a cheap studio in town there are going to be drawbacks. The flat is priced that way for a reason.

If you want to stay there because the rent is cheap, then I agree with the suggestions already given. Stop worrying about others and do what you can to make it work. Get a white noise machine and/or fitted earplugs that are designed to be worn for a longer time. You'll have to deal with the flushing of toilets and running water no matter who lives there.

One other option that's out there but might be worthwhile, order some soundproofing foam and offer to install it on their side of the wall.
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Old 22.11.2020, 16:15
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Re: another neighbor issue thread

A white noise machine is a good idea

Don't worry about "the next tenants"

You could start to make your own noise
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