Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Living in Switzerland > Daily life  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 15.03.2021, 17:31
Talk to you later's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: ZH
Posts: 1,563
Groaned at 71 Times in 37 Posts
Thanked 2,923 Times in 1,058 Posts
Talk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond repute
Proportionality of wage/work

Made up numbers to explain the situation my friend is facing!

Let us say that my friend works 4 days a week and earns CHF400, so basically CHF100 per day.

Boss asks my friend if he is willing to work 5 days a week. Friend says, yes. The next day, the boss comes with the contract, but the wage is shown as CHF470 for the week!!!!

If he starts working 5 days a week, he should earn a minimum CHF500 per week based on his current wages! If my friend accepts the offer then he is basically taking a pay cut!

What would your advice be to my friend?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 15.03.2021, 17:35
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2020
Location: Zurich
Posts: 500
Groaned at 6 Times in 5 Posts
Thanked 499 Times in 247 Posts
Spaceghost has an excellent reputationSpaceghost has an excellent reputationSpaceghost has an excellent reputationSpaceghost has an excellent reputation
Re: Proportionality of wage/work

Depends on the role though - maybe a 5 day job would have other perks like more holidays, better pension etc which balance out purely the base salary figure being quoted.

Also maybe with 5 days he'll work say 42 hours a week vs 4 days of 4 x10 hour days ( so it's not an exact multiple) - there could be more to it.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Spaceghost for this useful post:
  #3  
Old 15.03.2021, 17:37
Talk to you later's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: ZH
Posts: 1,563
Groaned at 71 Times in 37 Posts
Thanked 2,923 Times in 1,058 Posts
Talk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Proportionality of wage/work

Quote:
View Post
Depends on the role though - maybe a 5 day job would have other perks like more holidays, better pension etc which balance out purely the base salary figure being quoted.

Also maybe with 5 days he'll work say 42 hours a week vs 4 days of 4 x10 hour days ( so it's not an exact multiple) - there could be more to it.

Everything is exactly the same, the hours worked per day I mean. No extra perks. Role has not changed either, just more work!!!!
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 15.03.2021, 17:40
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2020
Location: Zurich
Posts: 500
Groaned at 6 Times in 5 Posts
Thanked 499 Times in 247 Posts
Spaceghost has an excellent reputationSpaceghost has an excellent reputationSpaceghost has an excellent reputationSpaceghost has an excellent reputation
Re: Proportionality of wage/work

Then i'd be going back to the employer asking why its lower for sure and asking for the higher 5 day rate.
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank Spaceghost for this useful post:
  #5  
Old 15.03.2021, 17:41
komsomolez's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: SZ
Posts: 3,150
Groaned at 266 Times in 181 Posts
Thanked 6,355 Times in 2,659 Posts
komsomolez has a reputation beyond reputekomsomolez has a reputation beyond reputekomsomolez has a reputation beyond reputekomsomolez has a reputation beyond reputekomsomolez has a reputation beyond reputekomsomolez has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Proportionality of wage/work

My wife has had several changes from 80% to 100% and back. There was never a discussion of the 100% salary being anything else than exactly 25% higher than the salary for 80%.

One thing to keep in mind is also whether this is longer days, or an additional day per week. If you extend your hours per day, you don't have higher cost of commuting. If you come in one additional day, you do.
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank komsomolez for this useful post:
  #6  
Old 15.03.2021, 17:42
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Proportionality of wage/work

Quote:
View Post
Then i'd be going back to the employer asking why its lower for sure and asking for the higher 5 day rate.
Bulk discount
Reply With Quote
The following 5 users would like to thank fatmanfilms for this useful post:
  #7  
Old 15.03.2021, 17:46
Talk to you later's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: ZH
Posts: 1,563
Groaned at 71 Times in 37 Posts
Thanked 2,923 Times in 1,058 Posts
Talk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Proportionality of wage/work

Quote:
View Post
My wife has had several changes from 80% to 100% and back. There was never a discussion of the 100% salary being anything else than exactly 25% higher than the salary for 80%.

Don't you mean 20%?


Quote:
One thing to keep in mind is also whether this is longer days, or an additional day per week. If you extend your hours per day, you don't have higher cost of commuting. If you come in one additional day, you do.
Exactly one additional day.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 15.03.2021, 17:47
Talk to you later's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: ZH
Posts: 1,563
Groaned at 71 Times in 37 Posts
Thanked 2,923 Times in 1,058 Posts
Talk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Proportionality of wage/work

Quote:
View Post
Bulk discount

Actually this was the reason for the thread, I thought maybe there is some Swiss bulk discount wages rule thing
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Talk to you later for this useful post:
  #9  
Old 15.03.2021, 17:55
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Zürich
Posts: 752
Groaned at 9 Times in 8 Posts
Thanked 599 Times in 318 Posts
gipfelisturmer has an excellent reputationgipfelisturmer has an excellent reputationgipfelisturmer has an excellent reputationgipfelisturmer has an excellent reputation
Re: Proportionality of wage/work

Quote:
View Post
Don't you mean 20%?
Nope.
25% of 80% = +20%
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank gipfelisturmer for this useful post:
  #10  
Old 15.03.2021, 17:59
Talk to you later's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: ZH
Posts: 1,563
Groaned at 71 Times in 37 Posts
Thanked 2,923 Times in 1,058 Posts
Talk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Proportionality of wage/work

Ok, thanks. I will let you know if my friend loses his job tomorrow!
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 15.03.2021, 18:02
curley's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: canton ZH
Posts: 13,131
Groaned at 218 Times in 182 Posts
Thanked 15,264 Times in 7,847 Posts
curley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Proportionality of wage/work

Quote:
View Post
My wife has had several changes from 80% to 100% and back. There was never a discussion of the 100% salary being anything else than exactly 25% higher than the salary for 80%.

One thing to keep in mind is also whether this is longer days, or an additional day per week. If you extend your hours per day, you don't have higher cost of commuting. If you come in one additional day, you do.
Hmmm, yeah, employees never complain when it's in their favour. No matter how strange the calculation is.

Salaries are offered in 100%. Anyone working less gets the according percentage.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank curley for this useful post:
This user groans at curley for this post:
  #12  
Old 15.03.2021, 18:05
curley's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: canton ZH
Posts: 13,131
Groaned at 218 Times in 182 Posts
Thanked 15,264 Times in 7,847 Posts
curley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Proportionality of wage/work

Quote:
View Post
Ok, thanks. I will let you know if my friend loses his job tomorrow!
What? Is it work more or not at all?
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank curley for this useful post:
  #13  
Old 15.03.2021, 18:12
Talk to you later's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: ZH
Posts: 1,563
Groaned at 71 Times in 37 Posts
Thanked 2,923 Times in 1,058 Posts
Talk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Proportionality of wage/work

Quote:
View Post
What? Is it work more or not at all?
If his boss says that is his final offer, can't give CHF500, and my friend rejects the lower offer, then it could potentially get tricky, no?

Not instant job loss but friend will have to keep his job change options open.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 15.03.2021, 18:15
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Zurich
Posts: 13,871
Groaned at 1,320 Times in 886 Posts
Thanked 20,733 Times in 7,947 Posts
Chuff has a reputation beyond reputeChuff has a reputation beyond reputeChuff has a reputation beyond reputeChuff has a reputation beyond reputeChuff has a reputation beyond reputeChuff has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Proportionality of wage/work

Quote:
View Post
Made up numbers to explain the situation my friend is facing!

Let us say that my friend works 4 days a week and earns CHF400, so basically CHF100 per day.

Boss asks my friend if he is willing to work 5 days a week. Friend says, yes. The next day, the boss comes with the contract, but the wage is shown as CHF470 for the week!!!!

If he starts working 5 days a week, he should earn a minimum CHF500 per week based on his current wages! If my friend accepts the offer then he is basically taking a pay cut!

What would your advice be to my friend?
I mean really... isn't the answer to this completely obvious... that they should ask their boss why it is 30chf lower and ask for it to be the full 500chf? I mean if you can't advise your friend of something so simple as to ask his boss for an explanation then that's a little surprising. They just need to discuss it.

Quote:
View Post
If his boss says that is his final offer, can't give CHF500, and my friend rejects the lower offer, then it could potentially get tricky, no?

Not instant job loss but friend will have to keep his job change options open.
Without knowing the actual figure involved it's hard to say how much of a big deal this is. Obviously 470chf vs 500chf per week may not be such a big deal to an employer, but 2k vs 2.5k probably is.

Last edited by Chuff; 15.03.2021 at 18:28.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Chuff for this useful post:
  #15  
Old 15.03.2021, 18:35
Axa's Avatar
Axa Axa is offline
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Suhr, Aargau
Posts: 4,255
Groaned at 72 Times in 67 Posts
Thanked 5,939 Times in 2,796 Posts
Axa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Proportionality of wage/work

There are no simple answers to complicate situations

B permits come along withheld income tax. When you earn more, you also go up in the cantonal tax brackets and pay a higher percentage of tax, thus....the net income per hour goes down. So, is your friend talking about nettolohn or bruttolohn?

Next, what kind of boss? Is your friend employed directly by the business or via an employment agency? Weekly salary sounds like an employment agency which may or may not take a larger cut for longer working hours.

One thing to remember, your friend will earn as good as he's able to negotiate. I've seen people talked into steep discounts to save the business during covid time......and people say yes
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank Axa for this useful post:
  #16  
Old 15.03.2021, 18:35
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Basle
Posts: 2,907
Groaned at 76 Times in 60 Posts
Thanked 2,025 Times in 1,178 Posts
Landers has a reputation beyond reputeLanders has a reputation beyond reputeLanders has a reputation beyond reputeLanders has a reputation beyond reputeLanders has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Proportionality of wage/work

Your friend is free to decide how much the extra day is worth but as others have said, in general it should be 25% more if he works the same hours each day.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Landers for this useful post:
  #17  
Old 15.03.2021, 18:49
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2020
Location: Lausanne
Posts: 343
Groaned at 21 Times in 12 Posts
Thanked 404 Times in 187 Posts
Sinking has earned the respect of manySinking has earned the respect of manySinking has earned the respect of many
Re: Proportionality of wage/work

Quote:
View Post
I mean really... isn't the answer to this completely obvious... that they should ask their boss why it is 30chf lower and ask for it to be the full 500chf? I mean if you can't advise your friend of something so simple as to ask his boss for an explanation then that's a little surprising. They just need to discuss it.



Without knowing the actual figure involved it's hard to say how much of a big deal this is. Obviously 470chf vs 500chf per week may not be such a big deal to an employer, but 2k vs 2.5k probably is.
Agreed, difficult without an actual figure. It depends how much salary is at 80%. If we are talking 50'000 is one thing, if we are talking 150'000 is a whole new story (as others have pointed out, deductions, etc. will increase considerably on the employer side).
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Sinking for this useful post:
  #18  
Old 15.03.2021, 18:52
Talk to you later's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: ZH
Posts: 1,563
Groaned at 71 Times in 37 Posts
Thanked 2,923 Times in 1,058 Posts
Talk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Proportionality of wage/work

Quote:
View Post
I mean really... isn't the answer to this completely obvious... that they should ask their boss why it is 30chf lower and ask for it to be the full 500chf? I mean if you can't advise your friend of something so simple as to ask his boss for an explanation then that's a little surprising. They just need to discuss it.
I already advised my friend the obvious. It was on Friday that his boss spoke with him, my friend used the weekend to analyse the numbers and tomorrow he will talk to the boss. The point is that-

a. We are living in Corona times.
b. The boss indirectly told him that it is the best he can offer him.
c. Boss thinks that my friend per month will get more money, so he is somehow doing him a favour, even though per hour my friend will earn less!!!!

Quote:
Without knowing the actual figure involved it's hard to say how much of a big deal this is. Obviously 470chf vs 500chf per week may not be such a big deal to an employer, but 2k vs 2.5k probably is.
Yes, which I can't reveal for obvious reasons. The new contract if he takes would mean that he works 8hrs per month for free (technically), when compared with current wages.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 15.03.2021, 18:58
Murloc's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Bern
Posts: 535
Groaned at 5 Times in 5 Posts
Thanked 593 Times in 297 Posts
Murloc has an excellent reputationMurloc has an excellent reputationMurloc has an excellent reputationMurloc has an excellent reputation
Re: Proportionality of wage/work

i would refuse, but the boss can give notice of course. He can also ask to take a pay cut or else anyway. So i don't see the point in just accepting a per-hour pay cut.
If he wants him to work more hours it's because he knows how much an extra employee costs in terms of overhead, training, risk etc. so i would negotiate the wage to its correct level. Asking such a thing is non-standard and taking the piss really.

Last edited by Murloc; 15.03.2021 at 19:00. Reason: add
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Murloc for this useful post:
  #20  
Old 15.03.2021, 19:05
Talk to you later's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: ZH
Posts: 1,563
Groaned at 71 Times in 37 Posts
Thanked 2,923 Times in 1,058 Posts
Talk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond reputeTalk to you later has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Proportionality of wage/work

Ok, I am satisfied that the advice I gave my friend was good. Meaning he should get per hour exactly the same or more but definitely not less (all other things being equal).

I Whatsapped him just now and told him to stick with the plan.
Reply With Quote
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
My wage in Switzerland Englishinswiss Finance/banking/taxation 8 31.12.2020 15:32
Must propose new wage HudaCH Employment 25 22.08.2016 15:57
what is the minimum wage/median wage in CH Jaro Employment 1 16.09.2009 14:05
Wage cut? Larry2009 Employment 9 21.04.2009 11:32
Minimum wage telandy Employment 5 06.05.2008 13:16


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 02:21.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0