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Old 11.04.2021, 21:50
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Crazy owner is the straw that breaks the camel (me)

Apologies if this is a long one, but I need it off my chest. It's been the toughest couple of months of my life.

In January we decided to move to a nicer bigger place. Working (too) hard, our baby arrived last summer, so we thought it was time to cross many mental barriers (budget, location being the main ones).

Searched for a while and we were lucky to amazing place a bit south of Zurich city. Perfect size, great layout, new-ish, nice balcony, nice view, the works. Parking not ideal, and the living room not ideal for me and my home-cinema aspirations but everything else great.

The owner directly renting it out, and although that can be a double-edged sword, my first apartment in CH was rented directly with the owner, I had a great relationship and the guy was great to me.

Turns out the owning family built the thing to sell the apartments, but decided to keep them and rent one out. One of the daughters moved, so they decided to take the 4.5 room to market and after visiting we started talking with them. We really liked it, and the lady we were talking to seemed OK. In our communication she basically said they liked us as applicants and gave me two caveats:

1. no playground to which we were fine. There are loads nearby, and we didn't have one in our previous building anyway.

2. "we are OK when our renters are having a party with louder music - always on weekends of course". We're young, we have (had before covid) friends over all the time, I even enjoy my music sometimes. It's going to be amazing to enjoy the balcony and not fear that we're laughing too loudly or whatever. We thought it would be great.

We told them we're ok with the above, and we met the owners again for a last chat and for them to get to know us a bit better. We brought some wine and we baked something. They liked us, we liked them, they gave us a contract on the spot - we were ecstatic.


A month later we moved. One of the movers pocketed my wife's engagement ring. A shit-show followed. The guy got scared and dropped the ring somewhere were it had no place being and were it had never been before (that's how we know he took it and we didn't misplace it). They then scuffed the newly oiled floor in the new apartment and denied any responsibility.

The writing was on the wall - this was not going smoothly from literally the first day.

We moved in on a Friday. 8 days later, Saturday night, at around 22.30 loud music starts. It's coming from the daughter's apartment downstairs. It then gets louder. It then gets unbearable. The baby thankfully doesn't wake up. But I can't stop re-reading the email with the "occasional" party. How occasional is "welche mal"? What are the chances it happens on the second weekend of our occupancy? At around 01.00 screams of happy birthday come as a relief. "It just so happened the birthday was now", we thought. Mine was actually the week after - it could as well be us...


Two weeks later the same. The music was now literally shaking our not so light dining table. Not only that, the "DJ" likes to play with the volume like a 4-year-old with a new toy. At around 23.00 I go downstairs. I tell them they can have the music loud, but maybe not so loud and I just ask to not play with the volume. I even wished them fun. They said "sorry we didn't know how it sounds upstairs" and kind of respected my wishes.


I send an email to the lady asking if the "parties" she was referring too are going to happen every two weeks and if they're going to be so loud. We were expecting something, but not that. I'm asking for some help.

She replies a few days later: "it wasn't that loud - what's your problem?"


I don't reply, my heart breaks, work is killing me, I'm still in admin hell with the handover of the old apartment, and despair takes over.

Meanwhile, randomly in the day, I'm working (from home -thanks covid) and I start hearing that freaking Tiesto song. It's 13.00 or 14.00 or 11.30 or whenever. Frustration levels are rising, but what can I do?

I just moved, it cost an arm and a leg, the process nearly killed my mental health and my marriage, and now to move again? Pick a fight with the owner?


Thursday before Easter, and not too long after the above incident, they start again. Glasses were shaking in the cupboards. I take a video and text it to the owner. "Please not so loud". Whatsapp didn't even show the read checks until the next day. Even if she did read it, it's not like that anything changed.


Today, they started again. Enough was enough. I called the cops. They came 30min later, and the neighbours were "shocked". A young lady came upstairs and asked me if I called the cops and why.

She basically told me this is it. "You knew" "we're not going to stop" "this is going to happen all the time" "You need to find a solution with the family"

When I told her things are moving in my apartment from the volume, she was like "yeah, I was here, I know. You knew we would have parties - what's your problem?"

This is my life now I guess. I pay 4k a month to live in a quiet suburb, over a club that I don't know when it is on. Friday, Saturday, Sunday with decent weather I am like the guy waiting for something that might come or might not come. I feel lucky if they don't go partying like 20-year-olds on pills.



Tomorrow I'm calling Mieterverband. I've already started looking on homegate, even though I just finished the ing closet a week ago. There are still boxes in every room. My wife told me that there is no way she can go through the moving process with a baby again. Not so soon, and not after everything that happened. And good luck finding a place we like in an area we can agree on.


If anyone has any decent, tried and true real estate agents please let me know (pm or post).
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Old 11.04.2021, 21:58
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Re: Crazy owner is the straw that breaks the camel (me)

Just call the police next time like any swiss would do


No noise after 22:00 is the law (Allgemeine Polizeiverordnung)
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Old 11.04.2021, 21:58
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Re: Crazy owner is the straw that breaks the camel (me)

Start calling cops every time they break the noise rules.

When searching for a new home do check Anibis rentals and Immoscout24 as well, always better to use multiple sources for a new place.

Other than that, not too much to say here - it's an expensive lesson, and there are surely not-so-legal ways to make them stop this crap.
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Old 11.04.2021, 22:23
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Re: Crazy owner is the straw that breaks the camel (me)

So she is the owner's daughter- where do the owners live? In same building? What do THEY say?
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Old 11.04.2021, 22:30
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Re: Crazy owner is the straw that breaks the camel (me)

With such an expression I was expected something of a climax like you shot them all or something.
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Old 11.04.2021, 22:43
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Re: Crazy owner is the straw that breaks the camel (me)

In the morning after every party play loud music staring at 7:30 in the morning (or whatever the legal noise time is). Wake them up, keep them awake.

Seriously, call the police every time they party. Keep records of each detail of any interaction with them.
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Old 11.04.2021, 22:49
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Re: Crazy owner is the straw that breaks the camel (me)

As above. Just call the cops until they get with the program. They might own the property, but you rent it and are entitled to rights and certain expectations. Hopefully they adjust. Worst case you have to move on.
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Old 11.04.2021, 23:18
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Re: Crazy owner is the straw that breaks the camel (me)

I am so sorry about your predicament and especially having to deal with the entitled daughter. Calling the cops continuously isn't really going to help because obviously the owners aren't really going to care.

You've spoken to the daughter and unfortunately, you agreed to the "parties." I would personally move again or find the daughter a quiet boyfriend.

By the way, if her parties include more than ten people, call the cops about breaking COVID regulations. There's a hefty fine to pay for breaking the law.

https://refbl.ch/refbl/aktuelles/mel...rona-Virus.php

Im Freien sind private Veranstaltungen mit bis zu 15 Personen wieder erlaubt. Im Innenbereich gilt NEU die Grenze von 10 Personen.

Organisierte Veranstaltungen gelten weder als spontane Treffen noch als private Veranstaltungen oder als Aktivitäten in den Bereichen Sport und Kultur; sie bleiben weiterhin verboten. Explizit weist der Bundesrat darauf hin, dass dies auch für Anlässe in Pfarrgemeinden, Quartiervereinen und andere Vereinsaktivitäten gilt.
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Old 11.04.2021, 23:22
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Re: Crazy owner is the straw that breaks the camel (me)

Sorry about your situation. I would first contact the landlord, who is the other side of your rental contract, and ask them to reason other cohabitants, because actions of those cohabitants make your apartment's quality much lower than advertised. If that won't stop, your will have to ask for a significantly rent reduction and compensation of any incurred costs, such as anti-stress therapy or paid weekends in Saas for the whole your family.

As well as playing inspirational music on those mornings after parties (in case you have a good taste it may be inefficient for the cause), you may try to relieve you stress with tidying up the apartment by fiercely vacuuming it or do some stress relieving screaming - I saw a scientific-ish article somewhere about it, and, apparently, it works best projected towards the source of stress.

Last edited by evop; 11.04.2021 at 23:35. Reason: typos
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Old 12.04.2021, 01:48
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Re: Crazy owner is the straw that breaks the camel (me)

As others have said you must keep calling the police. Get a copy of the incident report.

You should keep a log and any communication to the landlord should be in writing by registered mail.

As a tenant you have rights. Why should you have to move?

Do let us know what the Mieterverband advises you to do.
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Old 12.04.2021, 06:44
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Re: Crazy owner is the straw that breaks the camel (me)

As others have said, they have broken your trust and are now being completely unreasonable so end 'friendly' relationships with them. Be civil, cool and cordial, and call the police each and every time it get out of control... that is your only weapon and they will soon get the message.
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Old 12.04.2021, 08:13
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Re: Crazy owner is the straw that breaks the camel (me)

I agree with others about calling the police every time. I would even, politely, inform them that this is what you will do.


Unfortunately this will probably ruin your relationship, but either the noise will end or they will give you an easy way out of the tenancy.


Crappy situation, but the law is really on your side.
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Old 12.04.2021, 09:46
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Re: Crazy owner is the straw that breaks the camel (me)

Hi OP,

The others on this thread have given valid advice which I would echo. To be honest, the fact they mentioned about the parties and lack of play area from the outset would have already had alarm bells ringing in my head that this is not going to be an ideal place for a young family.

In your position would:

- Look for somewhere else to live - do this RIGHT NOW.

- Assume you will be stuck in the current place for a time until you find a new place - therefore deal with the noise situation via the "official" routes described - call the police when they transgress the "Nachtruhe" rules, and follow any other advice the MV can give you

I assume being new parents you are currently sleep-deprived anyway from caring for the needs of a soon-to-be toddler. If you have to wait until 10pm before you can call the police in, it will be no fun trying to get a child to sleep at 7pm with techno wobbling the walls and floors. And you just don't want the stress of having to deal with the general unpleasantness from the building owners. If there are other tenants / owner-occupiers surely they are also bothered by the noise - it may be worth getting them on-side, but in the end, there is no point devoting time and energy to fighting a battle you are unlikely to win.

Your child will soon be walking around, and honestly your next place needs to be a place with plenty of off-road green space and communal play areas and parks on the doorstep, and young families in the neighbourhood which will allow your child to build up a network of friends. A place where you can light a fire and cook a sausage on a stick must be maximum 200m away from your door. You want to enjoy the time with your child as they are growing up - believe me the time until they become a teenager and want nothing to do with you will pass more quickly than you think.

When nickatbaseljnr was born, we were in an ideal flat for a couple in Kleinbasel - rooftop terrace, bars and restaurants a-plenty. As my job was in Zurich by that time, we were going to move anyway, however the other thing we began to notice was the nearest park with a water tap and sandpit involved a walk through a busy street to get to - not ideal with a fast-moving toddler to guide. You quickly realise with a child, your partying days will need to be put to one side for a few years.

By chance we found the current place in Albisrieden. A good sq km or so of green space, with play areas etc and young families. When we first came we enrolled our son (then 3) in a nearby Kinderkrippe (daycare) and when he got to Kindergarten age he was enrolled in one that is within the apartment complex - so in these ways he got to know the children in the neighbourhood. Also nearby us is the Bachwiesen GZ (community centre) which has all kinds of activities, a park, a cafe which has been a good way for us to get to know the grown-ups in the area.

Sorry for the long ramble - but hope this helps.

Cheers,
Nick
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Old 12.04.2021, 10:02
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Re: Crazy owner is the straw that breaks the camel (me)

Get the hell out of there. We moved into a new apartment shortly before our first child was born. Put in new floors in one of the rooms, "resurrected" the old wooden floors in one of the other rooms, so quite a bit of money and time invested. It just didn't work out. Not one big thing, like in your case, but several small things. Wasn't even the owner's fault, but there was also not much he could do. Not feeling at home in your home will wear you out. We moved out as soon as we found something else and that's one decision we've never regretted.
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Old 12.04.2021, 10:11
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Re: Crazy owner is the straw that breaks the camel (me)

I agree with other sentiments.

First priority - look for a new place at the next earliest opportunity. It will never work out long term, so don't wait in the vain hope that it might.

Second, tell them you will call the police each and every time they break the rules, without exception.

Third stop beating yourself up, and look on the bright side as well - e.g. instead of the fact that the ring got stolen, at least you got it back, etc.
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Old 12.04.2021, 10:14
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Re: Crazy owner is the straw that breaks the camel (me)

Cops are gonna come once and then they'll tell you to move.

Maybe making more noise 7am everyday will do the trick. But then you risk going nuts as much as your neighbors gone.
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Old 12.04.2021, 11:08
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Re: Crazy owner is the straw that breaks the camel (me)

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I agree with other sentiments.

First priority - look for a new place at the next earliest opportunity. It will never work out long term, so don't wait in the vain hope that it might.

Second, tell them you will call the police each and every time they break the rules, without exception.

Third stop beating yourself up, and look on the bright side as well - e.g. instead of the fact that the ring got stolen, at least you got it back, etc.
Yes and with all the moves I have done, expensive jewelry I have always carried them myself and never left them for movers to touch....
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Old 12.04.2021, 11:29
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Re: Crazy owner is the straw that breaks the camel (me)

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Maybe making more noise 7am everyday will do the trick....
Bad idea. That will escalate matters and put the OP on the wrong side of the law.
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Old 12.04.2021, 11:32
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Re: Crazy owner is the straw that breaks the camel (me)

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Yes and with all the moves I have done, expensive jewelry I have always carried them myself and never left them for movers to touch....
Even if someone did want them to be moved for whatever reasons, why wouldn't valuable items be tightly sealed in unmarked boxes anyway?
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Old 12.04.2021, 11:49
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Re: Crazy owner is the straw that breaks the camel (me)

It sounds like theft by moving companies might be a fairly common thing. A friend of mine moved last Summer and while unpacking, she realized that one of the movers had emptied her son's piggy bank (), which had at least 300 CHF in it.

I agree about calling the cops. They seem to be pretty good about responding to situations like that, and especially if you let them know that you have a small child (tell them the neighbors' noise is disturbing your baby's sleep). There is a hobby room below our son's bedroom that some teenagers were using as a party room and were playing music loudly with heavy bass until 2:00 in the morning sometimes. So we finally started calling the cops on them and after the third time that the police came, they finally stopped.

Good luck!
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