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  #221  
Old 13.09.2021, 09:14
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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Not really, according to most data. For the most part, many of the vaccinated are more effective at not spreading the virus. We chose Pfizer over J&J because of the decreased possibility of spreading the virus. Is it zero percent? No. But is it safer than being unvaccinated? Yes, very much so.


Pretty dramatic, and not what I actually said, is it?
A two tiered society seems to be where we are heading.. We're building a list of things that only one side of the fence may participate in.

At the moment we'll control that through scanning apps on phones to allow access to "luxury activities" like the gym. Where will it go though? Stop people being allowed on public transport? Deny healthcare? restrict shopping? Ban kids from school if their parents didn't get vaccinated?

As ever, the poorest will be affected most.
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  #222  
Old 13.09.2021, 09:16
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

This COVID business is just Darwins' theory in action, survival of the fittest, evolution, the weak and stupid ones die !
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  #223  
Old 13.09.2021, 09:20
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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A two tiered society seems to be where we are heading.. We're building a list of things that only one side of the fence may participate in.

At the moment we'll control that through scanning apps on phones to allow access to "luxury activities" like the gym. Where will it go though? Stop people being allowed on public transport? Deny healthcare? restrict shopping? Ban kids from school if their parents didn't get vaccinated?

As ever, the poorest will be affected most.
I'm not afraid for Covid but got my vaccination so that we can get out of the pandemic situation. Why my freedom should be limited because of the unvaccinated?
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  #224  
Old 13.09.2021, 09:28
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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This COVID business is just Darwins' theory in action, survival of the fittest, evolution, the weak and stupid ones die !
Less than one percent will die.

And it’s rather impious of you to equate stupidity with survival of the fittest .
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  #225  
Old 13.09.2021, 09:41
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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Less than one percent will die.

And it’s rather impious of you to equate stupidity with survival of the fittest .
Actually, 100% will die, how many from COVID is still TBC.

True, survival of the fittest has nothing to do with strength or intelligence unfortunately, but procreation. (something the stupid are actually pretty good at)
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  #226  
Old 13.09.2021, 09:48
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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I'm not afraid for Covid but got my vaccination so that we can get out of the pandemic situation. Why my freedom should be limited because of the unvaccinated?
But how are we getting out of pandemic? We're not making it go away, numbers of infections are not going down even in the most vaccinated places?

Vaccinated people are still getting the virus and still spreading it. Even if we reach 100% vax rate, including kids, we're not making it go away.

The message has changed throughout the whole crisis.. Stay home, save yourself. Stay home, save the healthcare, stay home save other people.. Wear a mask, save yourself.. Get vaccinated, save your grand parents. Wash your hands etc etc etc Do all this and we'll beat this virus.

What is the message now? Get vaccinated and ... ? Get into bars?

Anyway .. There has been another uptick in the vaccinations to allow people into nightclubs.. So we'll see where the message goes in a couple of weeks.
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  #227  
Old 13.09.2021, 10:07
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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But how are we getting out of pandemic? We're not making it go away, numbers of infections are not going down even in the most vaccinated places?

Vaccinated people are still getting the virus and still spreading it. Even if we reach 100% vax rate, including kids, we're not making it go away.

The message has changed throughout the whole crisis.. Stay home, save yourself. Stay home, save the healthcare, stay home save other people.. Wear a mask, save yourself.. Get vaccinated, save your grand parents. Wash your hands etc etc etc Do all this and we'll beat this virus.

What is the message now? Get vaccinated and ... ? Get into bars?

Anyway .. There has been another uptick in the vaccinations to allow people into nightclubs.. So we'll see where the message goes in a couple of weeks.
You can still spread when vaccinated, you get still get ill but will not die. Sounds like worth the effort.

I agree with you on the message and general handling of the pandemic, which was a mess. At least, here in Switzerland we were quite lucky and didn't have crazy measures like in many other European countries.
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  #228  
Old 13.09.2021, 10:09
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

Just spoke to a conductor. Five people showed their covid certificates instead of their tickets this morning. We’re all a bit confused on what’s mandatory and what isn’t.
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  #229  
Old 13.09.2021, 10:18
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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Just spoke to a conductor. Five people showed their covid certificates instead of their tickets this morning. We’re all a bit confused on what’s mandatory and what isn’t.
I had an interesting message from my gym .. Either >
1.We'll have to show our vax certificates
2. We'll have to show negative test, 72 hrs etc
3. Go to gym in a special class to be announced.

Wondering what option 3 is .. I'll find out tomorrow.. Although I'll just show my golden ticket anyway
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  #230  
Old 13.09.2021, 10:22
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

From 1st of October if you don't have covid symptoms and you want to do a rapid test - you will have to pay.

If you have symptoms the test will be free, but in case you test negative - you will not receive a covid negative certificate.

One more reason to object to this illogical farce they call covid measures.
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  #231  
Old 13.09.2021, 10:25
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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I had an interesting message from my gym .. Either >
1.We'll have to show our vax certificates
2. We'll have to show negative test, 72 hrs etc
3. Go to gym in a special class to be announced.

Wondering what option 3 is .. I'll find out tomorrow.. Although I'll just show my golden ticket anyway
Option 3 sounds like the safe way to get infected as soon as possible.
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  #232  
Old 13.09.2021, 10:31
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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Just spoke to a conductor. Five people showed their covid certificates instead of their tickets this morning. We’re all a bit confused on what’s mandatory and what isn’t.
Early in the day to be attending a concert? Maybe I am also a bit confused
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  #233  
Old 13.09.2021, 10:32
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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Very busy this morning in the vaccination center here. Seems like a good amount of spontaneuous decisions.

Good!
People need more proof of coercion?
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  #234  
Old 13.09.2021, 10:36
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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Actually, my post was a sarcastic reaction to limiting freedoms. People still have a choice regarding vaccinations…. Unlike women in Texas who have lost their right to have an abortion.
The can still abort outside of Texas. Why do you think so many travel to Switzerland for euthanasia.

Not saying I agree with stricter abortion laws (I most definitely don't) but because of its more limited scope (applies only to pregnant women in Texas) is actually a little less oppresive than the vaccination-coercion through anti-constitutional right restrictions.
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  #235  
Old 13.09.2021, 10:37
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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I'm not afraid for Covid but got my vaccination so that we can get out of the pandemic situation. Why my freedom should be limited because of the unvaccinated?
Because it's unfair™ and undemocratic™ (or for the serious hysterics among us "fascism", ending up with gas chambers). We should all go into lockdown, not just the unvaxxed.

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But how are we getting out of pandemic? We're not making it go away, numbers of infections are not going down even in the most vaccinated places?
The highest vaccine rate is Denmark, with 73.4% Infections are going down. No restrictions now.
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The message has changed throughout the whole crisis..
Situations change, knowledge changes, message changes. Quite normal. Current message "If you want freedom, get vaxxed".

[QUOTE=k_and_e;3348441]You can still spread when vaccinated,/QUOTE]But at about half the rate of the unvaxxed.
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  #236  
Old 13.09.2021, 10:38
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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People need more proof of coercion?
Tyranny Now off to the gym, then lunch at the restaurant. Great day.

Enjoy your days, freedom fighters.
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  #237  
Old 13.09.2021, 11:18
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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Because it's unfair™ and undemocratic™ (or for the serious hysterics among us "fascism", ending up with gas chambers). We should all go into lockdown, not just the unvaxxed.

The highest vaccine rate is Denmark, with 73.4% Infections are going down. No restrictions now.
Situations change, knowledge changes, message changes. Quite normal. Current message "If you want freedom, get vaxxed".
Denmark was the first European country to make the vaccine pass mandatory within the country in Springtime, it has been a great success.
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  #238  
Old 13.09.2021, 11:32
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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I had an interesting message from my gym .. Either >
1.We'll have to show our vax certificates
2. We'll have to show negative test, 72 hrs etc
3. Go to gym in a special class to be announced.

Wondering what option 3 is .. I'll find out tomorrow.. Although I'll just show my golden ticket anyway
What's option 3?
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  #239  
Old 13.09.2021, 11:32
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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Denmark was the first European country to make the vaccine pass mandatory within the country in Springtime, it has been a great success.
I believe Russia was the first
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  #240  
Old 13.09.2021, 11:39
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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This COVID business is just Darwins' theory in action, survival of the fittest, evolution, the weak and stupid ones die !
In terms of the econony, yes, obviously. Now the problem seems to me that things disguised as health issues (and pushed as health concerns) are in fact issues of the economy. These latest measures will sink a lot of businesses that would be entitled for subsidies otherwise. It seems that people, clients and customers are being used to exit from the need to subsidize. I really think that the health of people is actually secondary but it's sold as primary, so the medical justifications fall behind, are contradictory or facilitate loss of trust or boost conspiracies. It's a bit like "masks are useless" when there was in fact a shortage and that was the reason for the narrative.
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