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  #121  
Old 12.09.2021, 19:14
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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Brief reminder :

1. Are there possible adverse event outcomes?
> 675,591 in VAERS database (through September 3rd, 2021) - https://vaers.hhs.gov/data.html

2. Do the pharmaceutical companies have total indemnification from liability?
> Yes, Congressional “PREP ACT”

3. Is this a vaccine?
> No, mRNA messenger is lab synthetic genetic therapy

4. What additional chemicals are in the injection?
> Moderna SM-102 proprietary

5. Is the vaccine FDA approved?
> No, emergency approval only

6. Were drug interaction studies done?
> No

7. Were single dose toxicity studies done?
> No

8. Were toxicokinetic studies done?
> No

9. Were genotoxicity studies done?
> No

10. Were carcinogenicity studies done?
> No

11. Were pre/postnatal studies done?
> No

12. Is the mRNA injection effective?
> Mild reduction in symptoms

13. How long does it protect against Covid?
> Don’t know

14. Does it help people who contracted and survived Covid?
> Don’t know

15. Does it prevent transmission of Covid?
> Don’t know

16. Are there medical treatments for Covid?
> Yes: Ivermectin, Hydroxychloroquine, Zinc, and Vitamins D & C

17. What are Covid survival chances?
> 0-14: 99.9998%
> 15-44: 99.9931%
> 45-64: 99.9294%
> 65-85: 99.6297%
I love hiking too, but this is just too much.

Thanks for starting this useful thread by the way. We needed it.
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  #122  
Old 12.09.2021, 19:25
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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abortions are far more deadly than covid. This just shows the Dems don't care about saving lives as much as they claim they do.
Texas abortion law was the GOP, not the Dems.

Tom
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  #123  
Old 12.09.2021, 19:27
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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Only if you consider a fetus a person.
Indeed, it's a potential person, but NOT a person!

Tom
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  #124  
Old 12.09.2021, 19:28
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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  #125  
Old 12.09.2021, 19:35
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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Most of Switzerland is fully vaccinated (53%). However, roughly 2.5 million people over the age of 12 in Switzerland remain unvaccinated, reflecting one of the lowest rates of vaccination in Europe. 53% of Switzerland is fully vaccinated compared to 60% across the EU, 64% in the UK, 62% in France, 61% in Germany and 63% in Italy.

The overwhelming majority of those getting infected and ending up in hospital with Covid-19 now are unvaccinated. The unvaccinated are also more likely to suffer severe symptoms and end up in ICU.
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This statement is a typical example of fake news.

Obviously everything depends on health condition of a person. Many cases are asymptomatic
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This is a direct quote from the article I shared.
How is it fake news? or have we reached a point where everything that does not align with our respective world view = Fake......
It's neither news nor fake news. It's an assumption.

An assumption that seems to align with logo123's world view and does not with otec's. Yet logo123 is blaming otec for not sharing the view. Go figure.
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  #126  
Old 12.09.2021, 19:37
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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A common error that people make is confusing Jewish with Israeli. While many Jews identify with Israel, many do not.
And many Israelis don't identify with Jewishness.
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  #127  
Old 12.09.2021, 19:53
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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is there any fundamental difference between refusing access to an abortion clinic and refusing access to an icu?
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so you agree people shouldn't be coerced into vaccation?
Yes, there is. An ICU is far more likely to have resource limitations. You triage who is admitted. If the ICU has limited beds, you‘re going to admit those who have the best chance of survival. I suppose there are criteria likewise for the abortion clinic.

There are different criteria, however, you can‘t use the same yardstick to measure both.

I don‘t like the idea of coercion. But, I think about being cared for in hospital by someone who refused to get the vax, and I don‘t think I want them to care for me. I‘m very honestly unsure. This has a whiff of false equivalence about it to me.
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  #128  
Old 12.09.2021, 19:58
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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Yes, there is. An ICU is far more likely to have resource limitations. You triage who is admitted. If the ICU has limited beds, you‘re going to admit those who have the best chance of survival. I suppose there are criteria likewise for the abortion clinic.

There are different criteria, however, you can‘t use the same yardstick to measure both.
ICUs can't have limited beds 1.5years into pandemic.

This is clearly government failure but for some reason no one got fired or have their end of year bonus forfeit.

You are making assumptions on fundamentally broken basement.
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  #129  
Old 12.09.2021, 20:02
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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ICUs can't have limited beds 1.5years into pandemic.

This is clearly government failure but for some reason no one got fired or have their end of year bonus forfeit.

You are making assumptions on fundamentally broken basement.
Every ICU has limited beds. Moreover, many hospitals have limited staff which can lead to even fewer ICU beds. Talk to those who worked in the ICU and they’ll tell you they’re overworked thanks to the large amount of non-vaccinated Covid patients they’re treating.

Edit: Imagine a vaccination as a mat under your chair. It would have saved your carpet from becoming more damaged, just like vaccinations can save you and others from serious symptoms.
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  #130  
Old 12.09.2021, 20:05
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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Every ICU has limited beds. Moreover, many hospitals have limited staff which can lead to even fewer ICU beds. Talk to those who worked in the ICU and they’ll tell you they’re overworked thanks to the large amount of non-vaccinated Covid patients they’re treating.
Thanks no. You clearly have no idea how to run a successful business
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  #131  
Old 12.09.2021, 20:06
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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Although I still believe in freedom of choice whether someone has the vaccine or not. To those who choose not to, they have to accept the consequences of where they might be allowed to go in public places and mixing with the general population for the time being.

Many people on this forum are probably too young to remember the physical appearance of people who survived Smallpox.

The World Health Organisation (WHO) certified the GLOBCAL ERADICATION of the Smallpox disease in 1980.

It was achieved by various means including inoculations.

That is all I have to say to people who are anti the vaccine.
Smallpox and Covid are two very different viruses though, as are their vaccines:

The Covid vaccines are not as effective as the Smallpox vaccine
The Covid vaccines are not as safe as the Smallpox vaccine
The Covid vaccines wears off after a few months, the Smallpox vaccine grants lifelong immunity
The prognosis from being infected with Covid is far better than with Smallpox
Even the developers of the Covid vaccine are saying that they will not be enough to irradiate the disease
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  #132  
Old 12.09.2021, 20:07
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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PS: A larger attack I would have in this paper is the disclosure of CIs altogether.
My background is not social sciences, but I do have a minor in statistics. My biggest issue is methodological, as a survey off Facebook hardly qualifies for a paper, in my very personal opinion.

In any case, I think the claim that PhDs are more vaccine-hesitant than other groups is not correct.
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  #133  
Old 12.09.2021, 20:15
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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Thanks no. You clearly have no idea how to run a successful business
Generally speaking ICUs are not run as a Business, however. More like a government Service. And you can reach full capacity based on insufficient resources, both physical and personnel.
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  #134  
Old 12.09.2021, 20:15
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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and what is a pass?

what is the minimum level it must fulfill?

how old can pcr and antibody tests be?

are foreign documents accepted?

will the barman tell me, i have to drink up quickly because my test expires in 10 minutes?
He'll ring the "last round" bell next to your ear.

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Correct. No more bars or gyms etc. unless they get tested first.

I'd really like to know who's those are in category one. Won't you please share it with us?
Sans papiers for example.

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Limiting freedom can be seen in Texas for women wanting an abortion.

Either get the shot or live with the consequences. Moaning about it ain't gonna change the reality of tomorrow.
So far I hear no unvaccinated people moaning. Strangely enough it's the vaccinated ones who can't stop moaning in spite of having all they want: Apparent health savety, freedom of movement ....
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  #135  
Old 12.09.2021, 20:16
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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Thanks no. You clearly have no idea how to run a successful business
Geneva and Thurgau ICUs are full at the moment and many other regions are at 80%. This has nothing to do with running a successful business... it's how to run a hospital that doesn't have enough staff to keep up with the amount of serious COVID cases coming in.
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  #136  
Old 12.09.2021, 20:17
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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It's not facism at all, silly.
What? fascism doesn't exist now?
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  #137  
Old 12.09.2021, 20:17
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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So far I hear no unvaccinated people moaning. Strangely enough it's the vaccinated ones who can't stop moaning in spite of having all they want: Apparent health savety, freedom of movement ....
The title of this thread is a perfect example of a moan.
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  #138  
Old 12.09.2021, 20:18
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

What strikes me is that so many mature people can't go outside of black-and-white type of thinking when it comes to hospitalization and ICUs.

It's not a new problem. Government had hard statistical data already 6 months into pandemic. One doesn't need to have PhD in rocket science to:

1. Order to build or buy ICU either locally or from other countries.

2. Create a joint Pan European manufacturer with enough funding from 25 states to secure components and etc needed to build

3. Inact emergency laws to fast track training of medical personnel to work with ICU

4. Change immigration laws to allow hiring ICU operators from 3rd world countries and/or train them

5. Build temporary hospital facilities like London's Excel

6. Hire ex Goldman Sachs CEO with proven track record to deliver complicated projects in short time


All doable in few months of good planing, provided lawmakers and treasurey people are onboard.

But no, they keep saying there are shortages of ICUs and beds and we need a covid pass now to lower it down. This is ass-type thinking.
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  #139  
Old 12.09.2021, 20:19
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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Geneva and Thurgau ICUs are full at the moment and many other regions are at 80%. This has nothing to do with running a successful business... it's how to run a hospital that doesn't have enough staff to keep up with the amount of serious COVID cases coming in.
I posted what I think about it above
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  #140  
Old 12.09.2021, 20:22
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Re: Last Day Before Your Freedoms are Limited

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I posted what I think about it above
I read it Glad you could solve the problem...
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