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Old 17.11.2009, 16:11
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Liechtenstein border control from CH.

Saturday night we drove into neighbouring Liechtenstein for dinner and were surprised to meet a temporary border control. They checked our passports and had a good look in the car, including the dog crate (our Rottweiler made them jump!). It's the first time this has happened to us so we mentioned it to our hosts who told us over the last few weeks there have been hundreds (I haven't seen any news reports about this, this was their figure so it could be exaggerated) of people seeking asylum in Vaduz and as Liechtenstein is not yet a part of Schengen the authorities could not send them back into Switzerland and so would have to accommodate them themselves.

Seeing as the population of FL is only about 32,000 it could soon turn into a major problem for them. I'm not posting this to start a debate about whether it's right or not for FL to not want to care for asylum seekers, just wanted to warn you to carry your passports if you're heading into the principality.
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Old 17.11.2009, 16:14
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Re: Liechtenstein border control from CH.

asylum in Vaduz - there's something I never thought I'd be reading
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Old 17.11.2009, 16:18
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Re: Liechtenstein border control from CH.

I work in FL and go in and out a few times a day, and they have been there every day at each border for about 2 weeks now, the main thing they are stopping are the buses, it appears form the news I heard, there were a significant number or people form somalia and eritrea that arrived and asked for asylum and it was known that others were "enroute"
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Old 17.11.2009, 16:22
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Re: Liechtenstein border control from CH.

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I work in FL and go in and out a few times a day, and they have been there every day at each border for about 2 weeks now, the main thing they are stopping are the buses, it appears form the news I heard, there were a significant number or people form somalia and eritrea that arrived and asked for asylum and it was known that others were "enroute"
Is there a tunnel between FL and Africa (or through Italy) bypassing Schengen?!

Last edited by Macchiato; 17.11.2009 at 16:38.
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Old 17.11.2009, 16:29
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Re: Liechtenstein border control from CH.

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Is there a tunnel between FL and Africa (or through) Italy bypassing Schengen?!
who knows macchiato, sure has been a lot of road works around the last few years !
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Old 17.11.2009, 16:48
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Re: Liechtenstein border control from CH.

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Is there a tunnel between FL and Africa (or through Italy) bypassing Schengen?!
Effectively, yes.

Asylum seekers in a Schengen country are not entitled to travel freely
to another Schengen, are subject to rules set out in Dublin Convention
as to the country to which their application for asylum must be made.

Crossing out of Schengen changes the rules; esp the "target" country's
right of return ...
.
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Old 17.11.2009, 17:25
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Re: Liechtenstein border control from CH.

This is a real pain in the arse at times as on occasions they have managed to build up rather large queues on times because of the incompetant way they organise these checks.

Apparently there's checks only on 3 of the bridges (Buchs and 2 others) which just leaves 2 more road bridges, several foot bridges, an unguarded land border and a river that one could wade through if one is careful. High security indeed!
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Old 17.11.2009, 17:35
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Re: Liechtenstein border control from CH.

I heard this on the news today. They were talking about lots of people coming into Vaduz, I think flying into Italy and then via Switzerland. and the need to step up border control at the CH-FL border. My German is a little marginal, but that's as much as I caught.
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Old 17.11.2009, 19:42
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Re: Liechtenstein border control from CH.

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Saturday night we drove into neighbouring Liechtenstein for dinner and were surprised to meet a temporary border control. They checked our passports and had a good look in the car, including the dog crate (our Rottweiler made them jump!). It's the first time this has happened to us so we mentioned it to our hosts who told us over the last few weeks there have been hundreds (I haven't seen any news reports about this, this was their figure so it could be exaggerated) of people seeking asylum in Vaduz and as Liechtenstein is not yet a part of Schengen the authorities could not send them back into Switzerland and so would have to accommodate them themselves.

Seeing as the population of FL is only about 32,000 it could soon turn into a major problem for them. I'm not posting this to start a debate about whether it's right or not for FL to not want to care for asylum seekers, just wanted to warn you to carry your passports if you're heading into the principality.
It has been in both the Tages Anzeiger and the NZZ at length. As Liechtenstein is not yet Schengen (just a few months behind Switzerland in reality), the EU forced Switzerland to establish a "Schengen outer border".
-
Here the explanatory text :
Kein Schengenstaat. Das Abkommen wurde zwar ratifiziert, wurde aber noch nicht in Kraft gesetzt. Entgegen der ursprünglichen Planung kein Beitritt zusammen mit der Schweiz. Die Grenzen zur Schweiz werden durch Streifen und mit Kameras überwacht (nur Personen-, keine Zollkontrollen, da Zollunion mit der Schweiz). Grenzkontrolle nach Österreich durch die Schweizer Grenzwacht (Personen- und Zollkontrollen). Kein Flughafen und somit keine Einreisemöglichkeit durch die Luft.
and here the link
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schengener_Abkommen

I did not find anywhere a clear date of the FL-entry into Schengen, but since Mrs Merkel signed approval for Germany, the way for FL is basically open
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Old 17.11.2009, 19:53
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Re: Liechtenstein border control from CH.

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Effectively, yes.

Asylum seekers in a Schengen country are not entitled to travel freely
to another Schengen, are subject to rules set out in Dublin Convention
as to the country to which their application for asylum must be made.

Crossing out of Schengen changes the rules; esp the "target" country's
right of return ...
.
But in spite of Schengen, FL still is in full customs and monetary and postal union with Switzerland, so that the Rules do not change that much. These refugees may be back in Switzerland more swiftly than they might dream about it.

The main reason why foreigners are controlled on the border is rather that customs authorities fear anonymous random controls by EU experts. This means that "Whites" are controlled possibly even more than "Africans" as some EU inspectors might be among them.
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Old 17.11.2009, 19:58
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Re: Liechtenstein border control from CH.

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This is a real pain in the arse at times as on occasions they have managed to build up rather large queues on times because of the incompetant way they organise these checks.

Apparently there's checks only on 3 of the bridges (Buchs and 2 others) which just leaves 2 more road bridges, several foot bridges, an unguarded land border and a river that one could wade through if one is careful. High security indeed!
"unguarded land border" ? Many kilometers of the borderline north of Schaffhausen already were "unguarded" in the 1950ies/60ies, and this even included countless gravel-roads. The same applies to many parts of the borderlines in Ticino and Valais/Wallis and even some outer-suburbs in Geneva. The checks you mention are adhoc things and not "organized".

CH + FL alike opposed that thing but the EU insisted.
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Old 17.11.2009, 20:07
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Re: Liechtenstein border control from CH.

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I heard this on the news today. They were talking about lots of people coming into Vaduz, I think flying into Italy and then via Switzerland. and the need to step up border control at the CH-FL border. My German is a little marginal, but that's as much as I caught.
Such "news" are a bit exaggerated. Flying into Italy means landing at an Italian airport (Schengen-borders) and Italian customs officials are not exactly forthcoming. I suppose, the problem rather is, and this is why Mr Schäuble in 2007 was opposed to Schengen-FL, that the FL police force is not really up to the job they face now.

Another aspect is the size of Vaduz, the size of the FL. Ever been there ? Where would you stay if arriving illegally from a non-Schengen country ? It may not be very easy to hide in the Vaduzan metropolis after all ! Asking for asylum ? They will be turned over to Swiss customs officials for the normal procedure, as FL is inside Swiss customs borders. As the Swiss saying goes "diä wärded no uf d'Welt choo" !
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Old 17.11.2009, 20:32
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Re: Liechtenstein border control from CH.

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Another aspect is the size of Vaduz, the size of the FL. Ever been there ? Where would you stay if arriving illegally from a non-Schengen country ? It may not be very easy to hide in the Vaduzan metropolis after all ! Asking for asylum ? They will be turned over to Swiss customs officials for the normal procedure, as FL is inside Swiss customs borders. As the Swiss saying goes "diä wärded no uf d'Welt choo" !
Yeah, I realised immediately why the FL authorities would be unhappy to see any number of asylum seekers. It is not a large area. It would be very messy.

Thanks for the info on Swiss customs. I had no idea. Very interesting.

Brian.
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Old 18.11.2009, 10:16
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Re: Liechtenstein border control from CH.

Just for info for any one going to FL, there are also random checks all over, and as I said before public transport is a big target, so not a good idea to forget any documents. this morning, for the 3rd time, I saw a CH bus stopped and boarded as it was about to leave the bus stop in Schaan, the other day, they stopped the bus on the roundabout at triesen to do a check. anyway, no big hassle is caused really, but just incase anyone is heading that way, make sure you have your id.
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Old 18.11.2009, 11:08
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Re: Liechtenstein border control from CH.

perhaps the fl could assist england .
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Old 18.11.2009, 14:20
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Re: Liechtenstein border control from CH.

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The main reason why foreigners are controlled on the border is rather that customs authorities fear anonymous random controls by EU experts. This means that "Whites" are controlled possibly even more than "Africans" as some EU inspectors might be among them.
I've seen a few people pulled off busses by these controls...not many were white.

They confused me today by stopping a bus leaving FL and pulling a couple of african-looking men off it. Illegal emigrants?
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Old 18.11.2009, 14:27
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Re: Liechtenstein border control from CH.

this is common in uk ; we have more illegals in prison for leaving uk border , than those entering.
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Old 18.11.2009, 14:33
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Re: Liechtenstein border control from CH.

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this is common in uk ; we have more illegals in prison for leaving uk border , than those entering.
Is this the Schengen (sp) violation issue?

I mean why would they try so hard to get in illegally and then get caught on the way out?

Brian.
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Old 18.11.2009, 14:37
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Re: Liechtenstein border control from CH.

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Is this the Schengen (sp) violation issue?

I mean why would they try so hard to get in illegally and then get caught on the way out?

Brian.
Free flight home? (sarcasm)
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Old 18.11.2009, 18:26
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Re: Liechtenstein border control from CH.

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Just for info for any one going to FL, there are also random checks all over, and as I said before public transport is a big target, so not a good idea to forget any documents. this morning, for the 3rd time, I saw a CH bus stopped and boarded as it was about to leave the bus stop in Schaan, the other day, they stopped the bus on the roundabout at triesen to do a check. anyway, no big hassle is caused really, but just incase anyone is heading that way, make sure you have your id.
you have to see some important points :
<> the Swiss Customs Border is not west of the FL but EAST of the FL
<> accdg to Schengen, a border-zone of 20kms, all internationally accessible airports, airfields and heliports, and all major rail stations like Zürich-HB, Luzern-HB and Bern-HB (Cornavin, Basel-SBB, Basel BadBhf are in the border zone anyway) are subject to random-controls
<> and this means that Liechtenstein is in the Swiss border zone
<> being part of the Swiss customs union, FL can just like a Swiss Canton, ask the Grenzschutz (part of customs) for assistance if they feel like it


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I've seen a few people pulled off busses by these controls...not many were white.

They confused me today by stopping a bus leaving FL and pulling a couple of african-looking men off it. Illegal emigrants?
suspect illegal immigrants, I suppose. Those who are ok have no problems really, the others however most likely will be handed over to the police.
-
They possibly in the end will face a stay in THIS building at Zurich-Airport :


awaiting departure !
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