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Old 11.03.2014, 15:14
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Re: Latin or more German for child in secondary school

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He's 11 years old. The last thing on his mind should be employment. He obviously has a penchant for the classics and has a teacher he likes. It's the stuff stories are made of.

Employment...

And with a mother who gives herself a name like Manley Hopkins (Gerard?) - there's little wonder where the boy gets it from :-)
Perish the thought that future employment prospects should be a factor in deciding what a child studies!
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  #22  
Old 11.03.2014, 15:15
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Re: Latin or more German for child in secondary school

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Not that placing blame is productive, but in this case I would see it less as an irresponsible action of your parents, than an unenlightened and outdated school system that allowed Science to be an interchangeable option with home economics. I don't know which generation you fall into, but we had choices of home economics and design tech (wood/metalshop) and art or music. Something like science was mandatory, as was maths, history, social studies (yes, US version of geography) and....PE
I'm not that old, but my parents had to leave school early and weren't able to direct me. I do think it was very unenlightened of the school. The year after mine, they changed it and made science mandatory, as it should be ..
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Old 11.03.2014, 15:20
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Re: Latin or more German for child in secondary school

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Perish the thought that future employment prospects should be a factor in deciding what a child studies!
In which case learn Chinese.
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  #24  
Old 11.03.2014, 16:02
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Re: Latin or more German for child in secondary school

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Latin teaches you how to structure and think.
Just for the record: I find German WAY more structured than Latin.
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Old 11.03.2014, 16:30
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Re: Latin or more German for child in secondary school

I had Latin for two years (3rd and 4th grade high school, 2 and 1 classes per week resp.). While many people do remember something, I remember nothing. And I had top grades... At best, something sounds familiar..

I guess it may be more useful if one is going to study Medicine or something else that actually uses Latin.

Overall, I like knowing/deriving etymologies of words, but when faced with choice of learning another language, I guess I would opt for the second language.
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Old 11.03.2014, 21:11
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Re: Latin or more German for child in secondary school

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Just for the record: I find German WAY more structured than Latin.
Is your impression due to the absence of word order in Latin ?
Enjoy the flexibility.....


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Perish the thought that future employment prospects should be a factor in deciding what a child studies!
Prospective employment is not a measure of success.
Is a person considered only by his earning capacity ?

Last edited by Sky; 11.03.2014 at 21:36. Reason: typos
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Old 11.03.2014, 22:07
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Re: Latin or more German for child in secondary school

First of all if he is living in France I fail to see what difference it makes if he has a few less German lessons... I'd far prefer to have a kid studying something he is highly motivated to study, that a battle every day trying to get him to do the extra German!

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I have to disagree about it not being our place about this decision. When I was 12, our school ludicrously gave us the option between home economics and science. My parents said nothing. I chose home economics so I could eat the food I would prepare. For the next 5 years, I could never do science - physics, biology, chemistry. I was good at maths and might have been good at physics. It was a decision I always regretted. At 12 I was not mature enough to decide for myself.
I fail to see how this is the same thing... We are not talking about him not doing German at all, just a bit less. And since the main language of instruction is French not German, I doubt it will make much difference at this stage.

You rue the fact that you did not get to do science, but what if Latin is his thing and you prevent him for even getting a sniff of it?
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  #28  
Old 12.03.2014, 08:58
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Re: Latin or more German for child in secondary school

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Just curious to see what people think of this.


We have basically made up our mind, but just curious as to what people think - it's a great advantage to learn more German at a young age, isn't it? He argues that he won't have a chance to learn Latin again..
...and he is right.
Sorry OP, your boy sounds like a very intelligent kid (I find it extraordinary that he wants to have a well-rounded education!!!), why would you like to cut off his wings? Having a desire to study Latin in a time when most (arguable, I know) kids are lacking the motivation to read books...wow, kudos to your kid!
You should be proud of his stance instead of making "realistic", "more down to earth" choices for him..
Besides, you will not be depriving him of his German classes anyway.
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Old 12.03.2014, 10:38
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Re: Latin or more German for child in secondary school

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Thanks to all. We had filled in a form to say we wanted him to do German. The teacher at school, who teaches French and Latin, has requested a meeting with us and another parent to try to persuade us to study Latin - the students who are good at French are encouraged to do it..

After all the feedback here, I am leaning towards it, but I want to make sure that it won't affect his options in Lycee later on.

I have to disagree about it not being our place about this decision. When I was 12, our school ludicrously gave us the option between home economics and science. My parents said nothing. I chose home economics so I could eat the food I would prepare. For the next 5 years, I could never do science - physics, biology, chemistry. I was good at maths and might have been good at physics. It was a decision I always regretted. At 12 I was not mature enough to decide for myself.
Ok, but TBH if it were a choice between home ec & German I can see your point. We are talking about the difference between Latin & losing a few hours of German class, not that he will no longer do German.

I agree with those that say let him do Latin. He wants to do and it is useful (not like home ec) for many subjects. And living in Europe he has many options to be exposed to German.

I was looking to go back to uni to study art history. I was told that if I never studied Latin, I'd have to do it now. So it's so important in many fields and as others have said useful for increasing English vocab and learning other languages.
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  #30  
Old 13.03.2014, 15:17
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Re: Latin or more German for child in secondary school

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I was looking to go back to uni to study art history. I was told that if I never studied Latin, I'd have to do it now. So it's so important in many fields and as others have said useful for increasing English vocab and learning other languages.

Join me !!!! It's the same class I'm now obliged to take due to my former History studies.
The Latin classes are so much fun
I've fallen in love with the authors I attempt to understand/translate.
Oh Ovid is
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Old 13.03.2014, 15:33
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Re: Latin or more German for child in secondary school

I hated every minutes of Latin I had to do at school, and I studied it for 8 years

But now I'm SO grateful and happy I did it.

And apparently I even have some nice rests from those years!
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  #32  
Old 14.03.2014, 02:25
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Re: Latin or more German for child in secondary school

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I hated every minutes of Latin I had to do at school, and I studied it for 8 years
Exactly.


Teacher: "Is this a gerundium or gerundivum?"
Me: "Er, um, gerundium."
Teacher: "Let me rephrase that. WHY is it gerundivum..."


Don't really miss those days and I really doubt it improved my logical thinking... but the vocabulary keeps on coming in handy.
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  #33  
Old 08.04.2014, 18:01
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Latin in Media School is it necessary ?

Hi there, I wondered if someone can explain why Media School Children have the option to learn Latin ? What are the advantages and is it useful only for specific careers ? I really don't know much about this subject and my son is now in Media in the Italian part of Switzerland. Id really appreciate any tips and advice please. Thanks
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  #34  
Old 07.01.2015, 10:30
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Re: Latin or more German for child in secondary school

It's a very long time after, but I wanted to say he went on to do latin, and likes it, but it's maybe not as much as he thought! He's going to Rome this year for a trip, which is great for him.
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Old 07.01.2015, 14:30
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Re: Latin or more German for child in secondary school

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...thought French would be more useful. They were probably right.
I think French is only useful if you live and work in a French speaking country, Latin on the other hand teaches you a lot of interesting history and gives you a good basis for learning all european languages.

German is very useful though and I would put it ahead of Latin if I had to choose.
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Old 07.01.2015, 17:48
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Re: Latin or more German for child in secondary school

I would suggest not falling into the trap though of deciding the present on the basis of the past, not to say that your experience is not useful.

Your son is not in the same situation as you were; this choice is not so stark, and German is not going to be off the menu after this.

Personally I follow the views of those above who favour following the child's instincts. Having a motivated child is a precious thing. Whose life is it anyway?

But trusting our kids in situations like this I guess asks us to sit with and work with our own fears, rather than trying to control them and their choices. Hard, but not as hard as going down the road of what may become a conflictual and resentful relationship on his side.

Also agree with those being positive about learning German in other ways; we are only talking about two hours here - you are across the border, there are tons of ways he can interact with German speakers.

And… my husband studied Classics at the Gymnasium here in Basel. He only learnt fluent English after 18 when he went to live abroad. He is the most fluent non-native English speaker I know, and works in a profession which demands an absolutely rigorous command of the language.

And I went to Latin American countries at a similar age, and learnt Spanish easily and quickly with the helpful basis of other languages from school (French, German and Latin), and also speak it to near-native level.

Good luck to him, and you.
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Old 08.01.2015, 01:26
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Re: Latin or more German for child in secondary school

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Just curious to see what people think of this.

We live in France and our son is in the local French college - secondary school. My 11-year old son has been given a choice for next year at school to do latin, 3 hours. He really wanted to do it as he likes the teacher, and I said he probably could. But then when I got the papers, I learned that if he takes that, he will forfeit the option of doing extra German classes for the following two years. So he would only do 3 hours a week German instead of 5 hours.

My husband and I discussed it and found that, although latin is useful and interesting, it's much more important that he learns more German. So we've told him, and written on the school form, that he needs to do German. I've tried to explain to him why, but he doesn't agree. When I was that age, I took some school choices that I shouldn't have and whenever I think of it now, I wish my parents had intervened.

We have basically made up our mind, but just curious as to what people think - it's a great advantage to learn more German at a young age, isn't it? He argues that he won't have a chance to learn Latin again..

Were you domiciled in Epinal or Dijon I would have supported the Latin Option, but as you are domiciled in Sankt Ludwig im Elsass, it indeed shoud be German. I in Secondary School was to take either English or Italian. I would have preferrred Italian which I liked and already had some command, but Mum argued that I should be able to speak with our relatives accross the pond
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Old 11.03.2015, 16:51
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Re: Latin or more German for child in secondary school

I spent quite all my life studing latin at school and at university. If you don't have any intention to go on with classical studies 'd say that it's a wasteof time (and energy). The beauty of latin is to be the row of so many languages and to give the key to understand the analysis of the grammar and use of language, ethymology etc etc, but to be honest I would not suggest to my daughter to study a dead language INSTEAD of a modern, useful, beautiful language as german. Sorry for my poor english, but until few years ago i studied Latin and Greek instead of english! Shame on me!
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Old 11.03.2015, 18:34
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Re: Latin or more German for child in secondary school

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I think French is only useful if you live and work in a French speaking country, Latin on the other hand teaches you a lot of interesting history and gives you a good basis for learning all european languages.

German is very useful though and I would put it ahead of Latin if I had to choose.
Am not sure about your logic of German being more useful than French. Whereas the good days of French as a world language are behind us, it's hard to argue that German is more important on a global scale. It's interesting though your comment as it is probably wider spread than I thought, it shows how people see the world differently on the other side of the Röstigraben. In Geneva nobody wants to hear about German as a language (let alone Swiss German).
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Old 11.03.2015, 20:03
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Re: Latin or more German for child in secondary school

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Am not sure about your logic of German being more useful than French. Whereas the good days of French as a world language are behind us, it's hard to argue that German is more important on a global scale. It's interesting though your comment as it is probably wider spread than I thought, it shows how people see the world differently on the other side of the Röstigraben. In Geneva nobody wants to hear about German as a language (let alone Swiss German).
It is in Europe...I have studied French (and English) in school, and pitied those "less fortunate" who had to study German (and English usually or rarely, Spanish) in school..had I known!
Not to mention that back home so many parents are striving now to put their kids in German kindergartens/schools..(bilingual schools) OK it was popular enough before but even more now.
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