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  #41  
Old 21.08.2018, 00:39
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Re: Notifying school about medication?

It's funny. I've built a persona on this forum on fake outrage and cynicism... I have way, way too much fun here.

But this thread made me genuinely angry. There's nothing like a combination of uselessness and arrogance - that whole cocksure but utterly wrongheaded thing - to bring the blood pressure up.

The situation really is appalling. I hope you can come to some arrangement soon. Please do keep us updated.

Good luck! ... and courage!
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  #42  
Old 21.08.2018, 01:00
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Re: Notifying school about medication?

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No, you didn't. My son is in the local government school..
No I’m confused because early on you stated (unquoted):

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The school, a local international one, started to PHONE ME, to check up on WHETHER I HAD GIVEN HIM HIS MEDICATION I want the decision about medication to be divorced from the will of the teachers. If we do medicate, I want it to be for the benefit of my son and to be able to start/stop on the advice of the doctors who know him, not the school.
I understood you were talking about yourself.
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Old 21.08.2018, 01:08
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Re: Notifying school about medication?

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I also suggest to ask in the meeting for a daily or weekly parent/school diary to be set up immediately so your kept informed of any changes with your son's schedule.
This was standard practice when my son was in school. The diary was updated daily by the teacher and sent home with my son for us to read.
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  #44  
Old 21.08.2018, 01:15
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Re: Notifying school about medication?

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No I’m confused because early on you stated (unquoted):



I understood you were talking about yourself.
You're mixing up two different contributors to the thread.

Dragoneric is using italics as quote markers.
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  #45  
Old 21.08.2018, 01:43
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Re: Notifying school about medication?

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This was standard practice when my son was in school. The diary was updated daily by the teacher and sent home with my son for us to read.
With any SEN kid a diary should be the norm; however, not all teachers use it consistently and simply forget to write in it.. this is why calling for a meeting with the big boys and girls of the educational world gets the ball moving in the right direction. Make no mistake, this is an educational issue, not a medical one (until a Doc says it is).. and these teachers have to call and own it.

A real pity because kids do great when parents and school are on the same page and support each other. My daughter went through a nondescript moany phase about her teacher last April/early May, and my response was to say how fabulous, hard working and dedicated her teacher was (which is true). She soon stopped moaning and thought about her own issues more carefully after that.
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  #46  
Old 21.08.2018, 08:21
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Re: Notifying school about medication?

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You're mixing up two different contributors to the thread.

Dragoneric is using italics as quote markers.
Wonderful why do what everyone else does, when you can cause confusion instead.
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  #47  
Old 21.08.2018, 22:04
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Re: Notifying school about medication?

Sorry couldn't figure out how to multiple quote different people. Will be back tomorrow...
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Old 21.08.2018, 23:47
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Re: Notifying school about medication?

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Sorry couldn't figure out how to multiple quote different people. Will be back tomorrow...
Don't worry about it. It's fine. Hope tomorrow is a good day. I would also second - third?- Swisstrees's suggestions. Have them.
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Old 22.08.2018, 22:52
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Re: Notifying school about medication?

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Call a meeting with head teacher, the gemeinde educational official(s) and the teachers of your son, set this up ASAP.

I also suggest to ask in the meeting for a daily or weekly parent/school diary to be set up immediately so your kept informed of any changes with your son's schedule.
We have a meeting scheduled for the week after next. Trying to get our thoughts together. Find out how much we can demand!

I've already asked for this... I also asked to be told (vaguely) what topics they were covering in school so we could talk about them at home. Son has no idea what he's done at school, so we're completely in the dark.
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Old 22.08.2018, 23:50
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Re: Notifying school about medication?

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We have a meeting scheduled for the week after next. Trying to get our thoughts together. Find out how much we can demand!

I've already asked for this... I also asked to be told (vaguely) what topics they were covering in school so we could talk about them at home. Son has no idea what he's done at school, so we're completely in the dark.
Unless the headteacher, teacher's managers are attending the meeting, you're wasting your time.

"Find out how much we can demand" is a very odd thing to say. You're already on the back foot going into a meeting thinking/saying that. Your son is entitled to an education and entitled to have his needs met; as parents you should be able to access basic info. Consider getting some professional advice before the meeting if you're this unsure.

Or, you could just save your son, save yourself the heartache and find a better school.
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Old 23.08.2018, 00:21
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Re: Notifying school about medication?

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Or, you could just save your son, save yourself the heartache and find a better school.
This
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  #52  
Old 23.08.2018, 00:27
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Re: Notifying school about medication?

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I also asked to be told (vaguely) what topics they were covering in school so we could talk about them at home. Son has no idea what he's done at school, so we're completely in the dark.
So what happens at parent - teacher meetings then and in particular at the beginning of the school year? From memory that is when this stuff happens - what they will cover, which books will be used, any planned trips etc...

And if this is not happening what have other parents got to say?
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  #53  
Old 23.08.2018, 00:27
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Re: Notifying school about medication?

I think you're right, Swisstree, but to whom should she turn to find such professional advice before the meeting? What kind of profession besides those already involved?

I was wondering whether there is someone here on the forum with enough spoken German, and enough experience of the schools and knowledge about children with special needs, who might coach dragoneiric for the meeting, or even go with her. Anyone?

The "how much we can demand"... yes, I also found that a bit of a strange phrase (though dragoneiric gets bonus points on account of most likely having frazzled nerves by now). I agree that your son has a right to get an education, and the help he needs to get there. As least some part of the purpose of the meeting, I would hope, would be to find out how to build bridges, how to find ways to all get on the same page, to reach the point where the teachers and you are working together and not in opposition. That doesn't mean you have to agree on everything, but that the communication is open and fair.

As to dragoneiric's son changing school: as I understand it they live in small town which has only one school. So not so easy to find a better one, at least not there. Also, they have a second child, so would have to plan the logistics very well if this son were to move to a fee-paying school (if the money is available) elsewhere, or to a government school for children with special needs, in the next city.
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  #54  
Old 23.08.2018, 00:48
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Re: Notifying school about medication?

Doropfiz, the thinking behind your questions is spot on, but why are you asking these questions and not the OP? Jim has also asked valid, puzzling questions about basic day to day info that the OP does not have.

Something is very off.
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Old 23.08.2018, 01:21
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Re: Notifying school about medication?

Yes, Swisstree, you, too are making good points. And yes, I also get the feeling that something is "off".

My guess is that OP is exhausted and frazzled. She is trying to cope with her son, and also a second child. She doesn't really command enough German to deal with things with clout. She lives in a small town. In addition, there's probably quite a cultural gap, to do with expectations on all sides, of what schools, doctors, psychologists and parents do and don't provide.

Dragoneiric, I hope you can sense that the posters here really are trying to understand, and to figure out what it is you need, to ease the whole situation.

From my perspective, it sounds a little (and I'm trying to say this gently, and ready to back off quickly if you think I'm wrong) as if you are hoping that just around the corner, as soon as a penny drops somewhere (preferably in the teacher's mind), things will suddenly fall into place such that The Right Solution for your son will be found.

Wonderful though that would be, I think it is unlikely. It is, in fact, even unlikely for completely healthy, happy, fully functioning children, who can suddenly develop an inexplicable loathing for the sport or the pullover they loved last term or become incapable of doing those sums they had learnt last month, or last week, or who gradually change their circle of friends, or declare that the only place they can sleep comfortably is under the bed, but soon give that up again to be closer to the hamster.

You know that your son is, at least for this year and next, and depending on his development maybe for much longer, going to need extra help. It won't, however, come from one source, nor from finding one right method. It's always going to be a matter of re-negotiating what might be appropriate or useful… for the next while.

Your son's main need now may be repetition and routine, and in another phase may be quiet, and in another phase access to physically demanding challenges, an in another phase some fun mathematical puzzles.

Realistically, it will not get better than that, in the sense that after a few weeks or months, he will change, you will change, his sister will interact more or less with him, he will be more or less influenced by the seasons changing, his teacher will resign, new educational methods will be developed, the pendulum in the whole meds-or-no-meds discussion will swing first one way, then t'other.

For this reason, I wrote above that it might be useful, in such a meeting, to establish that whatever method is applied ("measures" or "medication", or anything else), all parties will regard it as a trial period.

You said the little boy is repeating his first year of school… it's now the start of a new school year… will this be the repeat year, or is he now entereing Year 2? Have you already attended a "start of the new year" parents' information evening, as Jim described?

I think you will have achieved something if you and the other adults agree that you and they will work with, and monitor, your son, and also ask him how he feels, and agree to meet up again at the lastest after 3 months, to review the course of action taken, discuss the outcomes, and decide together on the next phase.

Of course, the communication must be open in the interim. I just have a hunch that things could improve if you insisted on the framework of communcation (a physical diary is one way to do it), and then could move on to appeal to everyone to be open to compromise, on the understanding that whatever course of action you and they take, it will necessarily be an experiment, it is not cast in stone, and when you next sit together you (plural) can be open about mistakes that were made, and sieve out and extend whatever turned out to be useful. You (and the teachers, etc.) will only know it when you try it out.

It feels like a piece of the puzzle is missing. Yet maybe I'm just not hearing part of what you're saying. Please continue to post here. There's a great deal of knowledge about schooling, children, and cross-cultural issues on this forum. Perhaps someone will work out how better to help you and your son. Or perhaps the questions here will help you to work it out.
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Old 23.08.2018, 02:47
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Re: Notifying school about medication?

OP, do you have an ADHD diagnosis for your son and a a corresponding prescription for ritalin? I know your original question was about a student potentially being penalised in exams for being on meds. This is issue 1.

You then asked about the apparent breachjng of what we would deem (in the UK) the inviolable doctor-patient confidentiality agreement. I certainly would not expect a school to receive confidential medical info about a child unless provided by a parent/guardian. Issue 2.


Issue 3 seems to be the madness that is your son's teacher(s) seeming refusal to meet your child's special educational needs and the resulting impasse.

Not trying to be arsey, trying like Doropfiz,Swisstree, Jim et al to understand because I think I'm missing why you haven't been to see the head teacher and class teacher's line manager before now. There is no way I'd be waiting.

In your meeting you shouldn't need to demand anything other than that these education professsionals do their job in meeting the needs of all the kids in their care. Some of the answers you've been given as you try to find solutions for your son's immediate school issues have been ludicrous. You need to know their reasoning for these decisions. It may be an inexperienced teacher. It may be a lack of care. It may be a combination of factors, I don't know, but you have a right to an explanation and a workable solution/approach to schooling your child
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Old 23.08.2018, 03:02
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Re: Notifying school about medication?

Yes.

Issue 4 is the challenge of striking that balance between being a properly concerned, assertive parent who is ready to do whatever it takes to get her child what he needs, and being perceived as the difficult, uncooperative, demanding person with an entitlement chip on their shoulder.

Please know that I am NOT saying that you are any of those latter things. I don't know. I just think it is hard to strike that balance.

I have been advocating standing tall and declaring, with dignity, that of course "we" (all of us in this room) cannot know for certain what the boy needs until we try, and that your hope is that you and they will learn, together, to figure out his needs, and will all be willing to adjust as we go along…, etc..

My reason for so doing is because I think that it cannot be to the child's advantage if the parents get labelled as problematic, or if the child senses the parents' ongoing antagonism towards the teacher. I think it is fine to say: "I don't know, and I think you don't know" and to say: "I'm new at this, and I'm not from here, and I'm doing my best to learn German, and to understand how things work here," and then to appeal for open communication. And for the kinds of help (diary, etc.) that others in this thread have mentioned.

Having said all that, I do think that moving away can sometimes help. That's a lot of work, though, and I suppose you have to weigh up your options.

Last edited by doropfiz; 23.08.2018 at 03:21.
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Old 23.08.2018, 08:28
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Re: Notifying school about medication?

Ok, Ok. Maybe wrong choice of word. I'm not planning to rock up and say "Oi, I demand that you do this for my son"! I'm kind of splitting it in my head into demand, request, suggest categories.

So things we want to insist on - and have the backing of the Lehrplan/Law.
Things we want to request - and have e.g. examples from how it's done in other schools.
Things we want to suggest - might be worth trying but in the grand scheme of things are not as important as the above.

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So what happens at parent - teacher meetings then and in particular at the beginning of the school year? From memory that is when this stuff happens - what they will cover, which books will be used, any planned trips etc...
We were just told they would be using the Schweizer Zahlenbuch and working on addition and subtraction between 1-20. - But of course we never got to see the book etc. Explained the reasoning behind the faces for reading (Susi & Peter?). I asked several times to be told what topics they were covering so we could talk about them at home make sure he knew the vocab etc. Nothing.
His first year, I had a meeting with the music teacher in which she agreed to notify me if there were any issues. Didn't hear a work until the end of the year when an "ungenügend" appeared on his report.--> after a hassle to get an answer, the answer was because he wasn't singing and joining in with the class. As he often can't recall stuff which is just said to him (as explained by psych) I asked if we could have a copy of the songs/they could send his music book home every now and again so we can go through it and make sure he understands the words etc. --> No, this isn't necessary


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Unless the headteacher, teacher's managers are attending the meeting, you're wasting your time.
School Inspector, Head, Class teacher, TA, IF, Logo, Psych.

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As to dragoneiric's son changing school: as I understand it they live in small town which has only one school. So not so easy to find a better one, at least not there. Also, they have a second child, so would have to plan the logistics very well if this son were to move to a fee-paying school (if the money is available) elsewhere, or to a government school for children with special needs, in the next city.
fee-paying is out of our reach, he doesn't meet the criteria for a SN school.

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From my perspective, it sounds a little (and I'm trying to say this gently, and ready to back off quickly if you think I'm wrong) as if you are hoping that just around the corner, as soon as a penny drops somewhere (preferably in the teacher's mind), things will suddenly fall into place such that The Right Solution for your son will be found.
Hell no, we gave up on that in KG. Our aim is that our son will survive school with as little damage as possible.

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You said the little boy is repeating his first year of school… it's now the start of a new school year… will this be the repeat year, or is he now entereing Year 2? Have you already attended a "start of the new year" parents' information evening, as Jim described?
Yes, he's now in Kl2. Parents info evening is next week.

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I think you will have achieved something if you and the other adults agree that you and they will work with, and monitor, your son, and also ask him how he feels, and agree to meet up again at the lastest after 3 months, to review the course of action taken, discuss the outcomes, and decide together on the next phase.

Of course, the communication must be open in the interim.
Honestly it feels like it's communicating with a brick wall. Other parents seem to think it is usual. But then if you've no issues, it's not such an issue. We do have a parent-teacher diary. It is however, rarely used.
I have, however, found out it's not just me. A veteran of the school now has her youngest in my son's class and the experience she had with her second child doesn't seem wildly different.

And the most ridiculous thing that has just occurred to me... When he started KG and every year since, they have tried to strongly suggest that we stop speaking our native languages to the kids and speak German to them... And then they refuse to organise a parent's meeting with just me because my German is insufficient
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Old 23.08.2018, 08:36
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Re: Notifying school about medication?

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OP, do you have an ADHD diagnosis for your son and a a corresponding prescription for ritalin? I know your original question was about a student potentially being penalised in exams for being on meds. This is issue 1.

We have an assessment (WISC) that suggests a similarity to others who have ADHD. And we were told not to rely 100% on the assessment as it was German and son's best language is still English. No prescription for Ritalin (yet).

I mentioned to the husband that I should call KA and have a chat before we go to the meeting and he said "Why? That's none of their business, they can't ask about that there." or words to that effect. I'm sure they're going to bring it up!

Last edited by dragoneiric; 23.08.2018 at 08:38. Reason: Orthographic ineptitude.
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Old 23.08.2018, 10:35
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Re: Notifying school about medication?

Can anyone throw any light on this next question?

Can we refuse that our child repeats a school year?
It says in the DVBS:
2 Die Schulleitung trifft die Schullaufbahnentscheide.

Which clearly says it's a matter of the Schulleitung and we have no say. (Which is, in fact what happened.) The TA also told us in the 1st Kl1 that he would have to repeat Kl 4.

What is not clear is if they take into account any non-academic reasons for keeping a child with their class as they move up through the school. Or if the school can say "he didn't make the grade. Tough."
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