Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Education  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 30.09.2018, 11:32
Newbie 1st class
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Basel
Posts: 24
Groaned at 2 Times in 1 Post
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Beyondinfinite has made some interesting contributions
Children’s education subsidized by employer

Hi experts,

Can you kindly give me a ballpark figure of how much the subsidy or reimbursement is for children’s education? Is it a % of salary or dependent on number of children?
I’m particularly interested in the Basel area with the ”giants” Roche and Novartis. We are contemplating a move and I have to take this into consideration.

Thank you, in advance.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 30.09.2018, 11:34
roegner's Avatar
Moderately Dutch
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Zurich
Posts: 11,141
Groaned at 370 Times in 311 Posts
Thanked 14,126 Times in 6,574 Posts
roegner has a reputation beyond reputeroegner has a reputation beyond reputeroegner has a reputation beyond reputeroegner has a reputation beyond reputeroegner has a reputation beyond reputeroegner has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Children’s education subsidized by employer

Depends on your rank I would say. My previous company has paid for the kids of people who reported to the CEO.

Maybe other companies pay for others as well, probably depends also on how much they want you as it is fearfully expensive.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank roegner for this useful post:
  #3  
Old 30.09.2018, 17:09
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Children’s education subsidized by employer

I think it very much depends on role/rank/ level of expertise/ your negotiating skills. We had friends whose package involved all but one term's fees for (i believe) their son's four remaining school years at ISB. We had friends at the same company who got zero.

AFAIK it's CHF 30k per year per child. Unless you teach there, then discount.


Edit: just seen Roegner's response. Sorry for duplicating info.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank for this useful post:
  #4  
Old 02.10.2018, 11:58
Newbie 1st class
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Amsterdam, NL
Posts: 27
Groaned at 2 Times in 2 Posts
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
adamer has annoyed a few people around hereadamer has annoyed a few people around hereadamer has annoyed a few people around here
Re: Children’s education subsidized by employer

From the company expenses prospective.



The money - company spending on school/ education for its employees, how would they be taxed?

Is there special tax rules for education in this respect?
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 02.10.2018, 13:34
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Children’s education subsidized by employer

All depends how high up the greasy pole you are....


Nestle have pretty much stopped paying for school fees to my understanding unless you are way up the pole.....
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 02.10.2018, 13:35
Mullhollander's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Aargau
Posts: 2,614
Groaned at 10 Times in 9 Posts
Thanked 3,694 Times in 1,619 Posts
Mullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Children’s education subsidized by employer

Quote:
View Post
From the company expenses prospective.

The money - company spending on school/ education for its employees, how would they be taxed?

Is there special tax rules for education in this respect?

Canton Aargau regulations say:


"The following apply as additional special deductible professional expenses of expatriates residing in Switzerland:
- Costs of the move and the trip to Switzerland and back abroad;
- Reasonable living expenses in Switzerland upon demonstrable maintenance of a permanent home abroad;
- Reasonable expenses for minor children to attend a foreign-speaking private school, if public schools do not provide adequate instruction."

More information at (English):
https://www.ag.ch/media/kanton_aarga...xpatriates.pdf
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 02.10.2018, 14:03
st2lemans's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Lugano
Posts: 31,918
Groaned at 2,392 Times in 1,740 Posts
Thanked 38,868 Times in 18,320 Posts
st2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Children’s education subsidized by employer

Quote:
View Post
The money - company spending on school/ education for its employees, how would they be taxed?
As income.

However, depending on the canton, some of the school costs MAY be deductible.

Tom
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 02.10.2018, 14:28
Newbie 1st class
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Amsterdam, NL
Posts: 27
Groaned at 2 Times in 2 Posts
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
adamer has annoyed a few people around hereadamer has annoyed a few people around hereadamer has annoyed a few people around here
Re: Children’s education subsidized by employer

At the end, in most of the cases it comes down to the benefits package
-- as for employer it is yet another 20.000-30.000 CHF gross per annum to your salary package.



Either employer pays XXX.000 per annum and plus covers costs of education, or might say - here is (YYY.000 + 30.000) per annum and you go figure out yourself (of course, not in such wording ).

And as being good company, business likely to choose first option.



And looking at Aargau tax rules listed -- you have to be temporarily joining business in Swiss. Right?
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 02.10.2018, 14:31
aSwissInTheUS's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Zurich area
Posts: 12,783
Groaned at 99 Times in 88 Posts
Thanked 19,576 Times in 8,681 Posts
aSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Children’s education subsidized by employer

Quote:
View Post
From the company expenses prospective.

The money - company spending on school/ education for its employees, how would they be taxed?
From the company side? Not taxed as it is expenses. Just like bribes, fines and other regular expenses which incur by operating a business. Or to you mean tax at source paid on behalf of the employee?

Other question is if the such expenses are also subject to social security contributions.

If it is education expenses for the employee's education itself they are not subject to social security contributions if the education has a strong relation with the job and cover tuition and books only: https://www.koordination.ch/de/onlin...aege/unkosten/

If it is education expenses for the employee's kids it seems to be subject to social security contributions for the part over a small threshold:
https://www.koordination.ch/de/onlin...tgelte/#c19748
__________________
On Hiatus- Normal operation will resume 22.02.2022 22:02:20.22
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank aSwissInTheUS for this useful post:
  #10  
Old 03.10.2018, 12:01
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Zürich
Posts: 244
Groaned at 2 Times in 2 Posts
Thanked 379 Times in 159 Posts
jazh has a reputation beyond reputejazh has a reputation beyond reputejazh has a reputation beyond reputejazh has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Children’s education subsidized by employer

Yes... you can't generalize. It depends on so many factors...
  • the policy of the company
  • the individual managers and their budgets and their personal feelings
  • how much they need/want you to move to CH vs. how much you want to move to CH
  • how well you can/will/want to negotiate

Call or google some international schools to determine what their costs are (or use the estimates in the other responses) and consider your budget and also decide how much of a go/nogo criteria you would want to make this for your move to Switzerland.

Again, the Swiss public schools are generally fantastic and enrolling your kids in Swiss public school is a super way to integrate into the country, meet local people and improve your experience here. It definitely isn't the right choice for every family, every age or every child, but please consider it.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 21.10.2018, 08:36
Newbie 1st class
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Zurich
Posts: 19
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 6 Times in 6 Posts
evera has no particular reputation at present
Re: Children’s education subsidized by employer

The cost of a private school with aftercare would be around 30 000 CHF per year. The public school aftercare is more affordable and the quality of care generally high.

I think for the decision for a private vs public school how long you plan to stay in Switzerland is important. As already said the public schools are a great opportunity for children to socialize and get integrated in the community. But on the other hand, if you plan staying only a few years, there is the question if learning German and then in German will be easily transferable to the educational system they join next.

Last edited by evera; 21.10.2018 at 08:58.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 26.10.2018, 21:36
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Basel
Posts: 389
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 758 Times in 216 Posts
Moorsholm has a reputation beyond reputeMoorsholm has a reputation beyond reputeMoorsholm has a reputation beyond reputeMoorsholm has a reputation beyond reputeMoorsholm has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Children’s education subsidized by employer

Just a point regarding private versus public.

It depends on your child's age.I've worked in the private sector in Basel for 10 years and have lost count of the number of teenagers who were placed in the public system age 12+ only to struggle massively, have to repeat years only to then transition back to private education.

This year there have been cantonal changes in the requirements demanded by both Basel Stadt and Basel land when it comes to completion of the matura. These changes place a double value on Maths, German and in Science. This means the days are over when you can 'compensate' your mark with high scores in English or French. The changes will, most likely mean, that fewer Swiss kids are able to make to through the matura...and with the extra weight given to German for those arriving age 12/13+ it is just not something I would recommend at all.



Arriving with young kids and planning on staying for the long term - that's a different story.
Reply With Quote
The following 6 users would like to thank Moorsholm for this useful post:
  #13  
Old 27.10.2018, 14:24
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: near Langenthal, BE
Posts: 936
Groaned at 3 Times in 3 Posts
Thanked 1,074 Times in 465 Posts
swisscanmom has an excellent reputationswisscanmom has an excellent reputationswisscanmom has an excellent reputationswisscanmom has an excellent reputation
Re: Children’s education subsidized by employer

Quote:
It depends on your child's age.I've worked in the private sector in Basel for 10 years and have lost count of the number of teenagers who were placed in the public system age 12+ only to struggle massively, have to repeat years only to then transition back to private education.
This is only a problem if you think the direct route through Gymnasium/Matura is the only way. If you are open to the Swiss educational system, you will realize that pushing every child through Gymnasium is just not necessary in order to achieve succes. Gymnasium here is really reserved for high achievers, if your child is average the apprenticeship route is often the better route. I would argue the practical experience and maturity a child gains in the apprenticeship can be invaluable for many careers. There are so many options of tertiary education that can also be reached through apprenticeships.
Reply With Quote
The following 6 users would like to thank swisscanmom for this useful post:
  #14  
Old 27.10.2018, 14:39
NotAllThere's Avatar
Mod x2
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Baselland
Posts: 13,871
Groaned at 245 Times in 216 Posts
Thanked 20,474 Times in 8,319 Posts
NotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Children’s education subsidized by employer

Quote:
View Post
Gymnasium here is really reserved for high achievers...
While I agree with most of what you say, I'd rather say "the more academically inclined". I know some very smart kids who've gone down the apprentice route - either directly from secondary, or have dropped out of Gym, despite high marks. Some apprenticeships require an above average level of intelligence.
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank NotAllThere for this useful post:
  #15  
Old 27.10.2018, 16:22
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Basel
Posts: 389
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 758 Times in 216 Posts
Moorsholm has a reputation beyond reputeMoorsholm has a reputation beyond reputeMoorsholm has a reputation beyond reputeMoorsholm has a reputation beyond reputeMoorsholm has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Children’s education subsidized by employer

My son was born here and has been through the Swiss system. His dad is Swiss.

He got the grades to go to Gymi but really wanted to experience working life and so he is doing an apprenticeship and Berufsmatura and has a fantastic placement in a large well known Swiss company. He loves it and is really happy. I wouldn't call him average and I think it is a real misperception to regard apprenticeship particularly Berufsmatura as some sort of easy route. He attends KV 2 days a week, and they are still pushed hard, still have to complete lots of tests and still face the pressure of being pushed off if they cannot maintain a particular average, he still has to do some demanding Economics, Maths, German, French, and Bookkeeping as well as English.

Whether a young person coming over with no German aged, say, 13 would be able to cope with what they do particularly at Berufsmatura just 2 years later, is, I think also questionable. Of course there are different types of apprenticeships and some which are more manual would be different.

But seeing what my son is doing (he is in his 2nd year) I would not agree that the apprenticeship system as an easy option for average kids.
Reply With Quote
The following 6 users would like to thank Moorsholm for this useful post:
  #16  
Old 27.10.2018, 17:01
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Zurich
Posts: 57
Groaned at 5 Times in 2 Posts
Thanked 44 Times in 20 Posts
apsta is considered knowledgeableapsta is considered knowledgeableapsta is considered knowledgeable
Re: Children’s education subsidized by employer

Quote:
View Post
My son was born here and has been through the Swiss system. His dad is Swiss.

He got the grades to go to Gymi but really wanted to experience working life and so he is doing an apprenticeship and Berufsmatura and has a fantastic placement in a large well known Swiss company. He loves it and is really happy. I wouldn't call him average and I think it is a real misperception to regard apprenticeship particularly Berufsmatura as some sort of easy route. He attends KV 2 days a week, and they are still pushed hard, still have to complete lots of tests and still face the pressure of being pushed off if they cannot maintain a particular average, he still has to do some demanding Economics, Maths, German, French, and Bookkeeping as well as English.

Whether a young person coming over with no German aged, say, 13 would be able to cope with what they do particularly at Berufsmatura just 2 years later, is, I think also questionable. Of course there are different types of apprenticeships and some which are more manual would be different.

But seeing what my son is doing (he is in his 2nd year) I would not agree that the apprenticeship system as an easy option for average kids.
Would love your perspective. My daughter is in her second year of kinsky at our local school. She's well on her way to fluency in Swiss German. The educational system here is fantastic, and I love that they have so many options for children and teens, but I am curious if you think the apprenticeship program vs Matura limits your child's long-term career opportunities outside of Switzerland? My husband and I agree this is an amazing system for families that are very convinced/certain they'll stay in country, but we worry that our children will want to return to the US, and their job prospects will be limited without a University degree. I guess I'm just unfamiliar with how outside countries view professionals that have come from an apprenticeship path. Are we silly to worry? Thank you for any insight!
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank apsta for this useful post:
  #17  
Old 27.10.2018, 22:12
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Basel
Posts: 389
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 758 Times in 216 Posts
Moorsholm has a reputation beyond reputeMoorsholm has a reputation beyond reputeMoorsholm has a reputation beyond reputeMoorsholm has a reputation beyond reputeMoorsholm has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Children’s education subsidized by employer

Hi Apsta,

Sorry I couldn't figure out how to embed your question. I know of a few students (with similar backgrounds to your daughter) who did the berufsmatura. one in particular I'm thinking of did a very well regarded banking befursmatura. She came to me to help her with some standard English tests that UK Universities required to for entry. She got a place at her University of choice in the UK where she enrolled onto an accounting degree. Many of the UK Universities are now accepting a wide, wide range of qualifications, including more technical or practical qualifications.

In the US from what I have seen it depends on the school. With some schools the most important thing is the students ACT/SAT score. But US schools also love students with broad life experience and extra curricular experience and how fantastic would a berufsmatura look for that. I honestly don't think that it would impact the chances of transitioning. Universities like Oxford and Harvard might prefer a purer academic route, but honestly I'm in a lot of educational networks both in the UK and US and times are changing slowly, there is slowly slowly more talk, more recognition of the importance of skills beyond academic.

If your daughter wanted to transition straight into the world of work in the US with a Swiss qualification, I don't know, it depends on the field. I think each country does demand that professionals such as teachers, doctors, lawyers are licensed to practice in that particular country or state....so she may have to do some add on training I guess, but that's just a guess.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Moorsholm for this useful post:
  #18  
Old 28.10.2018, 22:26
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: near Langenthal, BE
Posts: 936
Groaned at 3 Times in 3 Posts
Thanked 1,074 Times in 465 Posts
swisscanmom has an excellent reputationswisscanmom has an excellent reputationswisscanmom has an excellent reputationswisscanmom has an excellent reputation
Re: Children’s education subsidized by employer

Somehow my response above got misunderstood. I never meant to say that an apprenticeship is an easy option for average kids. However, I see many parents of average kids that try to push their kid through gymnasium, and then wonder why they fail. They simply underestimate the demands, because in their home country everyone goes to high school.
There are many smart kids here that choose an apprenticeship over Gymnasium, and yes, some apprenticeships are equally demanding, especially along with a Berufsmatura.
Average kids can really shine in an apprenticeship, if they choose one that matches their strengths. My son is in his 2nd year of an apprenticeship in logistics. He is loving it and is getting great grades in Berufschule. This has really boosted his confidence, and even though he never liked school that much previously, he now wants to continue and study IT after.
Reply With Quote
The following 7 users would like to thank swisscanmom for this useful post:
Reply

Tags
basel, novartis, roche, school basel




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Rent paid by the employer ? roxteo Employment 12 28.08.2018 16:52
USA/Swiss children - Education Micki Family matters/health 7 02.06.2011 11:11
children [sex] education golddust Family matters/health 3 23.02.2011 18:15
I'm in a dilemma: children's education Claire6966 Family matters/health 29 29.10.2010 13:37


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 06:38.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0