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Old 30.05.2011, 12:37
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Working hours (family members) in French and German sides.

Hello guys,

I am in a dilemma.. which is the "best city" to work in. Of course all sums up to.. the place that gives the job, but, I have read that Switzerland (in general terms) you are required to work 42-45 hours per week, or until you get the work done. OK.

But, how does this apply to family guys/gals?

Well, being part of a your family and a young child (5), focused on going out on evening to bike, or to the park or whatever, my intentions would be to leave the sooner as possible from work and be home in time to actually work in my family.

Which, in your opinion, would be more "flexible", so to say, about Family members? The German side or the French one? Or more specifically speaking, Zürich or Genéva?

I am used to start at one hour, finish at another (covering fully my working hours, of course).. work done, or not.

Thanks for your opinions.
PS. I hope this exact topic has not been covered yet
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Old 30.05.2011, 13:03
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Re: Working hours (family members) in French and German sides.

I think it mainly depends on your employer and the nature of the job that you do rather than the geographical location. You need to discuss and agree with your employer before you join about your working hours. There are many offices where flexible working is accomodated, as long as you do your hours..but best to discuss it in the beginning..
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Old 30.05.2011, 13:40
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Re: Working hours (family members) in French and German sides.

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I am in a dilemma.. which is the "best city" to work in.
.
.
.
my intentions would be to leave the sooner as possible from work and be home in time to actually work in my family.
I think the city you are looking for is 'France'.

You work 35 hours per week, you get 45 working days off when working for the government (which should not difficult since they try to keep the unemployment rate artificially low) and you even get 2 or 3 days off a year when the whole city is on strike.

Plus long lunches, free health care and some other freebies.
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Old 30.05.2011, 14:13
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Re: Working hours (family members) in French and German sides.

Also you need to consider the daily commute from both of those cities to get to your home. You could very easily have a much better 'family friendly' life in a much smaller swiss city or village, e.g. neuchatel, solothurn, etc. just because your work/home commute could be very short, ie. 10 minutes. Whereas, in GVA or Zurich, the two overcrowded cities in CH, with difficult housing markets, your commute could easily be 1 hour or more. I would consider this aspect into your equation.
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Old 30.05.2011, 14:41
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Re: Working hours (family members) in French and German sides.

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I think the city you are looking for is 'France'.

You work 35 hours per week, you get 45 working days off when working for the government (which should not difficult since they try to keep the unemployment rate artificially low) and you even get 2 or 3 days off a year when the whole city is on strike.

Plus long lunches, free health care and some other freebies.
Sounds like a much better option

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Also you need to consider the daily commute from both of those cities to get to your home. You could very easily have a much better 'family friendly' life in a much smaller swiss city or village, e.g. neuchatel, solothurn, etc. just because your work/home commute could be very short, ie. 10 minutes. Whereas, in GVA or Zurich, the two overcrowded cities in CH, with difficult housing markets, your commute could easily be 1 hour or more. I would consider this aspect into your equation.
True. A lot is into consideration when it comes to family terms. I need to try to squeeze the most out of it without sacrificing (much) time. Thanks.
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Old 31.05.2011, 16:20
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Re: Working hours (family members) in French and German sides.

You know Geza... I would suggest you start by looking for a job you actually like, before wondering how fast you will be able to duck out everyday... that may improve your dramatically your life satisfaction.

If you are worried to provide best for your yun'ones, perhaps you should stay where you are; change is always hardest to manage, generate stress and extra work...

The required work hours are 42.25 per week; depending on the job, up to 50 per week (punctually) may be expected before overtime kicks in.
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Old 31.05.2011, 16:26
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Re: Working hours (family members) in French and German sides.

"sacrifice time" as you put it happens, when one is employed. I get your question since I have a family too, but, honestly, unless you are a big shot then it is the employer who dictates the work hours. Fr or Ge part has nothing to do with it, really. These days people are happy they have got a job. I think living in a city might eat up commute time more than living and working in a small place, you also get nice time off for lunch, to hop home to eat and see your family.

Last edited by MusicChick; 31.05.2011 at 17:09.
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Old 31.05.2011, 16:51
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Re: Working hours (family members) in French and German sides.

I don't at all mean this as a personal attack, like, at all. But... the way you word things related to family and employment rub me the wrong way. This wording could rub a lot of potential co-workers of yours the wrong way.

In my own workplace, no one cares what time anything gets done. People only care that the work does get done. Except for our secretary, no one has a strictly set work time. This actually works very well for parents with small children, they say they appreciate the flexibility. This is another approach that you could try out.

The thing that bothers me about your wording, is that I feel like you'd leave at 5pm sharp, and then not care that someone else has to complete what you didn't. I really really hope that is not your attitude. Make sure you make it clear to a potential employer that it's not. Another thing with the wording is the whole "sacrifice" thing. It's really much nicer to find a job where you feel more positively than that.

And yeah, I just *might* have a chip on my shoulder, having had to pull the slack for parents of young children before. Because, you know, employees without children clearly don't have any outside responsibilites or lives at all. So, please please make sure you don't let yourself become one of those parents. <off my soap box>
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Old 31.05.2011, 17:44
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Re: Working hours (family members) in French and German sides.

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I think it mainly depends on your employer and the nature of the job that you do rather than the geographical location. You need to discuss and agree with your employer before you join about your working hours. There are many offices where flexible working is accomodated, as long as you do your hours..but best to discuss it in the beginning..
I am very concerned about these matters.
Here are some related topic I started in the past(anyone can contribute there too):
Working hours
Working hours across different jobs
Quality and balance: working & personal life

I do not believe that swiss employers are not clever enough to realize that staying long hours in the office does not necessarily means better productivity.

I hope swiss employers can understand that it is not a crime for somebody wanting to leave at 5pm.
What does it mean 'get the job done' and this is timeless? Come on, job tasks never end!
If your contract describes that you can leave at 5pm, don't you can? Exception takes place for very special reasons of course. But I hope that the daily departure time could be 5pm.

I think Switzerland has the best of both worlds, for most cases: good company environments with respect to working hours and traditional-oriented life style(family), generally speaking. And all these, with a very robust market, corporate environment, and very competitive and innovative companies.

You don't have to be America with exhausting working hours for employees in order to be a 'super' country. Switzerland can show the world a really alternative a successful way to do so, without these problems.
Am I wrong?
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Old 31.05.2011, 17:49
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Re: Working hours (family members) in French and German sides.

I also didn't read OPs post as so much of trying to slack, but rather keeping family and private life and professsional one separated, and actually having time for family, or being able to include family in the schedule. The question was worded in a bit complicated way, but honestly, long hours does not mean high efficiency. And then you have fleelancers, flexible hours, etc etc. I think it might not be a regional distinction, rather small towns, big cities (with bigger cities pushing people for longer hours, in my experience).
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Old 31.05.2011, 17:50
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Re: Working hours (family members) in French and German sides.

42.5 hours a week is 9-6pm or 8-5pm, with a appox. 1h15 lunch. If you want to leave earlier, then you just come in earlier. This has to be the best country i've worked in for being able to leave on time, the Swiss even have a word for it....
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Old 01.06.2011, 16:22
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Re: Working hours (family members) in French and German sides.

Is it ok to ask the future employer about working hours and if there is a chance to go earlier in the morning and leaving earlier in the afternoon? For example 8-5pm?
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Old 01.06.2011, 16:59
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Re: Working hours (family members) in French and German sides.

Sorry for this long reply message..

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You know Geza... I would suggest you start by looking for a job you actually like, before wondering how fast you will be able to duck out everyday... that may improve your dramatically your life satisfaction.

If you are worried to provide best for your yun'ones, perhaps you should stay where you are; change is always hardest to manage, generate stress and extra work...

The required work hours are 42.25 per week; depending on the job, up to 50 per week (punctually) may be expected before overtime kicks in.
I wouldn't use the term, "duck out".. as I am not "escaping" from work, but rather, finishing for the day. It is true though that I need to find my "dream" job, but that's a different story trying to become true.

I am worried to provide the best to my family (in terms of environment, safety and family economy) and that's why I am looking into Switzerland.

And I have no problem with changes, whatsoever, nor do my family

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The thing that bothers me about your wording, is that I feel like you'd leave at 5pm sharp, and then not care that someone else has to complete what you didn't. I really really hope that is not your attitude. Make sure you make it clear to a potential employer that it's not. Another thing with the wording is the whole "sacrifice" thing. It's really much nicer to find a job where you feel more positively than that.

And yeah, I just *might* have a chip on my shoulder, having had to pull the slack for parents of young children before. Because, you know, employees without children clearly don't have any outside responsibilites or lives at all. So, please please make sure you don't let yourself become one of those parents. <off my soap box>
Again, I am not trying to escape from work. I get my things done. If anything shows up a minute before 5, I attend it and finish it (if it's a short activity or urgent). If it's something that requires an hour or so, forget it. I never said I cut my work and leave it to someone else. Please stop dragging words into my mouth that were never intended.

What's wrong with you people? Seems like you're suffering from this at your workplace.. but seems I also messed up describing the problem specifically.

What I meant is, I start at Xam and finish by Ypm and I leave, ending my activities for the day, but if there are more, sorry, but will end up by tomorrow (if it has been a very-very-very busy day). I can't work at 120% with no time to even pee, all 8 hours (or more), can you? If you can, wow, you must be the perfect employee.

Sorry for the sarcasm, but it's the way it is.

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"sacrifice time" as you put it happens, when one is employed. I get your question since I have a family too, but, honestly, unless you are a big shot then it is the employer who dictates the work hours. Fr or Ge part has nothing to do with it, really. These days people are happy they have got a job. I think living in a city might eat up commute time more than living and working in a small place, you also get nice time off for lunch, to hop home to eat and see your family.
Holy crap.. not again..

It is true though, everything else, and thanks

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I am very concerned about these matters.
Here are some related topic I started in the past(anyone can contribute there too):
Working hours
Working hours across different jobs
Quality and balance: working & personal life

I do not believe that swiss employers are not clever enough to realize that staying long hours in the office does not necessarily means better productivity.

I hope swiss employers can understand that it is not a crime for somebody wanting to leave at 5pm.
What does it mean 'get the job done' and this is timeless? Come on, job tasks never end!
If your contract describes that you can leave at 5pm, don't you can? Exception takes place for very special reasons of course. But I hope that the daily departure time could be 5pm.

I think Switzerland has the best of both worlds, for most cases: good company environments with respect to working hours and traditional-oriented life style(family), generally speaking. And all these, with a very robust market, corporate environment, and very competitive and innovative companies.

You don't have to be America with exhausting working hours for employees in order to be a 'super' country. Switzerland can show the world a really alternative a successful way to do so, without these problems.
Am I wrong?
Thanks!

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I also didn't read OPs post as so much of trying to slack, but rather keeping family and private life and professsional one separated, and actually having time for family, or being able to include family in the schedule.
The employer MUST know that you have a family and that he owns part of your life, but not all of it! That's how I see it.

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42.5 hours a week is 9-6pm or 8-5pm, with a appox. 1h15 lunch. If you want to leave earlier, then you just come in earlier. This has to be the best country i've worked in for being able to leave on time, the Swiss even have a word for it....
Thank you.
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