Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Employment  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #61  
Old 14.06.2011, 11:04
Gummybear's Avatar
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Zurich
Posts: 81
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 23 Times in 18 Posts
Gummybear has made some interesting contributions
Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

So, just a quick update for everyone.

I wrote an email to my boss yesterday to get her to change the letter and date it properly, and she is saying the dates are NOT wrong!!!!????

She did mention my job would change and perhaps a lower percentage might be offered, but she did not formalize anything untiil the next week (which was already the next month) and therefore the letter should have been dated for then! But then she says that anything verbal is still a verbal agreement. But I dont remember agreeing to anything, and why did she then tell me inthe meeting last week that she woudl backdate the letter????

Now she says she will ask her lawyers what is correct. My question is: Is she right? Can she just hand me a letter in person and write whatever dates she wants on it? There was no people in those meetings, so it is her word against mine. How does that work? She also refuses to write back to my emails and instead just talks to me verbally....

This is the biggest sh*tties day.....
Reply With Quote
  #62  
Old 14.06.2011, 11:07
Cosmicgirl's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: English Riviera
Posts: 251
Groaned at 11 Times in 6 Posts
Thanked 118 Times in 77 Posts
Cosmicgirl has no particular reputation at present
Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Quote:
View Post
So, just a quick update for everyone.

I wrote an email to my boss yesterday to get her to change the letter and date it properly, and she is saying the dates are NOT wrong!!!!????

She did mention my job would change and perhaps a lower percentage might be offered, but she did not formalize anything untiil the next week (which was already the next month) and therefore the letter should have been dated for then! But then she says that anything verbal is still a verbal agreement. But I dont remember agreeing to anything, and why did she then tell me inthe meeting last week that she woudl backdate the letter????

Now she says she will ask her lawyers what is correct. My question is: Is she right? Can she just hand me a letter in person and write whatever dates she wants on it? There was no people in those meetings, so it is her word against mine. How does that work? She also refuses to write back to my emails and instead just talks to me verbally....

This is the biggest sh*tties day.....
And you are thinking of staying 60% .......
Reply With Quote
  #63  
Old 14.06.2011, 11:07
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Quote:
View Post
So, just a quick update for everyone.

I wrote an email to my boss yesterday to get her to change the letter and date it properly, and she is saying the dates are NOT wrong!!!!????

She did mention my job would change and perhaps a lower percentage might be offered, but she did not formalize anything untiil the next week (which was already the next month) and therefore the letter should have been dated for then! But then she says that anything verbal is still a verbal agreement. But I dont remember agreeing to anything, and why did she then tell me inthe meeting last week that she woudl backdate the letter????

Now she says she will ask her lawyers what is correct. My question is: Is she right? Can she just hand me a letter in person and write whatever dates she wants on it? There was no people in those meetings, so it is her word against mine. How does that work? She also refuses to write back to my emails and instead just talks to me verbally....

This is the biggest sh*tties day.....
Usually a letter showing a change to your contract should carry your dated counter-signature (as is the same that would happen if you resigned and the manager / HR has to counter-sign). If she missed the boat on this then it's her fault.

Don't forget; it might be her word against yours but it is also your word against hers. A point that "her lawyers" might make to her.
Reply With Quote
  #64  
Old 14.06.2011, 11:14
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Quote:
View Post

I wrote an email to my boss yesterday to get her to change the letter and date it properly, and she is saying the dates are NOT wrong!!!!????


Now she says she will ask her lawyers what is correct. My question is: Is she right? Can she just hand me a letter in person and write whatever dates she wants on it? There was no people in those meetings, so it is her word against mine. How does that work? She also refuses to write back to my emails and instead just talks to me verbally....

.
Hi,

It's what the Swiss call a 'missunderstanding'!

If she gives you a letter she should ask you to sign & date a copy saying you have received the letter.
Reply With Quote
  #65  
Old 14.06.2011, 11:18
Gummybear's Avatar
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Zurich
Posts: 81
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 23 Times in 18 Posts
Gummybear has made some interesting contributions
Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

I dont want to take the 60%!!! That is the whole point! But the RAV might not see it the same way, and I would be forced to take the job.

I think she should have sent it to me registered....but if she hands me the letter it is still egitimate right?
Reply With Quote
  #66  
Old 14.06.2011, 11:19
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Quote:
View Post
I dont want to take the 60%!!! That is the whole point! But the RAV might not see it the same way, and I would be forced to take the job.

I think she should have sent it to me registered....but if she hands me the letter it is still legitimate right?
Yes, but you should still counter-sign and date it. Date it with the date you receive it and don't budge if she protests.
Reply With Quote
  #67  
Old 14.06.2011, 11:26
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Quote:
View Post
I dont want to take the 60%!!! That is the whole point! But the RAV might not see it the same way, and I would be forced to take the job.
According to the Swiss law you have to take ANY work offered, if you don't the insurance does not have to pay out.

The RAV's job is to reduce any insurance claim, i.e. get you working ASAP.
Reply With Quote
  #68  
Old 14.06.2011, 11:34
Cosmicgirl's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: English Riviera
Posts: 251
Groaned at 11 Times in 6 Posts
Thanked 118 Times in 77 Posts
Cosmicgirl has no particular reputation at present
Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Quote:
View Post
I dont want to take the 60%!!! That is the whole point! But the RAV might not see it the same way, and I would be forced to take the job.

I think she should have sent it to me registered....but if she hands me the letter it is still egitimate right?


The below link shows you were to get FREE legal advice ( only 20 minutes given )Visited the Zurich one myself. Get there around 1 hour early , 1st come , 1st seen. Run it by them to give yourself piece of mind and where you stand with the RAV before telling them ALL.

http://www.zav.ch/service/dienstleis...l?newLangID=en
Reply With Quote
  #69  
Old 14.06.2011, 11:52
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Quote:
View Post
The below link shows you were to get FREE legal advice ( only 20 minutes given )Visited the Zurich one myself. Get there around 1 hour early , 1st come , 1st seen. Run it by them to give yourself piece of mind and where you stand with the RAV before telling them ALL.

http://www.zav.ch/service/dienstleis...l?newLangID=en
Having been receiving money from the RAV for 5 years, I am on my 3rd Rahemnfrist I have a pretty good understanding of how it actually works!
Reply With Quote
  #70  
Old 14.06.2011, 12:02
Cosmicgirl's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: English Riviera
Posts: 251
Groaned at 11 Times in 6 Posts
Thanked 118 Times in 77 Posts
Cosmicgirl has no particular reputation at present
Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Quote:
View Post
Having been receiving money from the RAV for 5 years, I am on my 3rd Rahemnfrist I have a pretty good understanding of how it actually works!
I'm not saying you don't know how it works , just offering some advice that the OP may which to take or not and also sharing my experiences as others have.

We are all writing on this thread to help the OP I assume in a very difficult confusing time for them. FREE LEGAL advice is always helpfull in situations like this.
Reply With Quote
  #71  
Old 14.06.2011, 12:08
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Quote:
View Post
I'm not saying you don't know how it works , just offering some advice that the OP may which to take or not and also sharing my experiences as others have.

We are all writing on this thread to help the OP I assume in a very difficult confusing time for them. FREE LEGAL advice is always helpfull in situations like this.
Swiss legal advice is all about compromise, I would not get too excited or hold my breath.
Reply With Quote
  #72  
Old 14.06.2011, 12:10
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Quote:
View Post
According to the Swiss law you have to take ANY work offered, if you don't the insurance does not have to pay out.

The RAV's job is to reduce any insurance claim, i.e. get you working ASAP.
The form you fill in at registration asks you what percentage of work you are looking for, though. I ticked the 80% and 100% boxes and my adviser said he "obviously" wouldn't be trying to make me take jobs of less than 80% any more than he would be forcing me to take a tin-pot low-paid 100% job (unless it had been one of those "filler" jobs you can offset against your unemployment benefit).

I think the reasoning behind it is that if you are forced into a 60% job, you are effectively dropping your income which then has a knock-on effect of maybe making you move out to a cheaper area (which would be major upheaval if you've got kids in a local school), causes problems with the costs of your current insurances and will generally leave you more dangerously out of pocket than if you could afford to willingly take a 60% job. That's how I understood it.

If the RAV don't force you into taking a part time position, why should it be legal for a company to do it to one of its full time employees?
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank for this useful post:
  #73  
Old 14.06.2011, 12:21
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Quote:
The form you fill in at registration asks you what percentage of work you are looking for, though. I ticked the 80% and 100% boxes and my adviser said he "obviously" wouldn't be trying to make me take jobs of less than 80% any more than he would be forcing me to take a tin-pot low-paid 100% job (unless it had been one of those "filler" jobs you can offset against your unemployment benefit).

I think the reasoning behind it is that if you are forced into a 60% job, you are effectively dropping your income which then has a knock-on effect of maybe making you move out to a cheaper area (which would be major upheaval if you've got kids in a local school), causes problems with the costs of your current insurances and will generally leave you more dangerously out of pocket than if you could afford to willingly take a 60% job. That's how I understood it.

If the RAV don't force you into taking a part time position, why should it be legal for a company to do it to one of its full time employees?
The percentage box is so they know how much to pay you!20%,40% 60%, 80%, 100%.

As the 60% job is suitable except it's not exactly what you are looking for I think the OP will be fined at the very least, they are choosing to be 100% uneployed!

I do a few highly paid days a month, thats how I am still in the system, there are many ways to skin a cat! Even my lawyer cannot understand why I have not had my current Rahemnfrist reduced to 260 days, acording to the RAV I have been employed 100% for the last 18 months! I know I did under 1 day a week last year, I was suprised I got anything!
Reply With Quote
  #74  
Old 14.06.2011, 12:22
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Quote:
View Post
According to the Swiss law you have to take ANY work offered, if you don't the insurance does not have to pay out.

The RAV's job is to reduce any insurance claim, i.e. get you working ASAP.
Last year I posted about a friend who was planning to leave his work as he just had enough- I was surprised that he believed that despite the fact he would choose to leave an excellent post- he would still get unemployment benefit. Many here confirmed this is the case- so how can somebody whose job is reduced to such an extent, not receive benefits if he refuses this?
Reply With Quote
  #75  
Old 14.06.2011, 12:31
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Quote:
Last year I posted about a friend who was planning to leave his work as he just had enough- I was surprised that he believed that despite the fact he would choose to leave an excellent post- he would still get unemployment benefit. Many here confirmed this is the case- so how can somebody whose job is reduced to such an extent, not receive benefits if he refuses this?
Did your friend get a payout from day 1 or was there a punnishment? 90 days (21.6 ave working days a month) is possible!
Reply With Quote
  #76  
Old 14.06.2011, 12:34
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Quote:
View Post
The percentage box is so they know how much to pay you!20%,40% 60%, 80%, 100%.
The RAV registration form is nothing to do with how much you will be paid, that info is decided by and comes from the Arbeitslosenkasse, a separate body to the RAV.

The registration form requires you to stipulate the % you have worked and for what % you are searching for. My adviser suggested I put 100% because that is what I had been working before then, if I could afford it, lower the % to 60 or 80% to broaden my chances.
Reply With Quote
  #77  
Old 14.06.2011, 12:42
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Quote:
The RAV registration form is nothing to do with how much you will be paid, that info is decided by and comes from the Arbeitskasse, a separate body to the RAV.

The registration form requires you to stipulate the % you have worked and for what % you are searching for. My adviser suggested I put 100% because that is what I had been working before then, if I could afford it, lower the % to 60 or 80% to broaden my chances.
Hi,

If you put your SEARCHING for a 60% job then your pay out is 60%.

Every month you have to confirm what percentage you want! You have to be actively looking & Available to work, so if your looking after children your not available....

Worst case for accepting a 60% job is a 12% loss, gives you 2 years to find a full time job or another part time job.
Reply With Quote
  #78  
Old 14.06.2011, 12:51
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Quote:
View Post
Hi,

If you put your SEARCHING for a 60% job then your pay out is 60%.

Every month you have to confirm what percentage you want! You have to be actively looking & Available to work, so if your looking after children your not available....

Worst case for accepting a 60% job is a 12% loss, gives you 2 years to find a full time job or another part time job.
No, of course you don't tick the box with lower percentages but the point I was trying to make was if you can afford it (i.e. on YOUR terms) you look also for lower % jobs and the RAV won't force you to do this.

If you have been working at 100% you would be daft to reduce your payments by suddenly looking for 60% jobs but if the OP lies down and takes the 60% job at his current firm, he has already cut any future payment from the RAV accordingly.
Reply With Quote
  #79  
Old 14.06.2011, 12:56
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Quote:
No, of course you don't tick the box with lower percentages but the point I was trying to make was if you can afford it (i.e. on YOUR terms) you look also for lower % jobs and the RAV won't force you to do this.

If you have been working at 100% you would be daft to reduce your payments by suddenly looking for 60% jobs but if the OP lies down and takes the 60% job at his current firm, he has already cut any future payment from the RAV accordingly.
Hi,

You wrote "My adviser suggested I put 100% because that is what I had been working before then" which is why I commented.

The problem is that you have turnrd down an offer! if you get offered more than you insured salary loss yoy have to accept it or you will lose benefits, i.e 70.1% if you have no children. The OP needs to be very careful!

A nasty employer will offer you 80% knowing you have to accept it & you dont get any unemployment pay!
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank fatmanfilms for this useful post:
  #80  
Old 14.06.2011, 13:05
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Zürich
Posts: 219
Groaned at 29 Times in 11 Posts
Thanked 90 Times in 56 Posts
pasty is considered a nuisancepasty is considered a nuisancepasty is considered a nuisance
Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Quote:
View Post
What kind of employer breaches contract law and tries to forcibly make an employee partially redundant while pretending it's a good thing?

I don't know why you are so against the OP standing up for herself and trying to get as much as possible for herself out of this unfortunate situation.
On the contrary, I wished her luck.
However, I don't think the type of employer she appears to have, and you have described, is likely to give them additional time off, particularly when you suggest telling them you to take the 60% offer, on the basis that they tell the employer they will be looking for other 100% work. If I were the employer, I would say fine, take your notice, I'll get someone else who wants to work 60% long term
Reply With Quote
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
[Work contract] Termination clause prevents working for competitor - normal? Just Employment 13 21.12.2013 11:50
Permit / Contract Termination sathishk2k Housing in general 9 02.07.2010 16:10
Employment contract termination Guest Employment 29 23.04.2009 22:11
Termination of rental contract Termite Housing in general 5 26.02.2009 20:45
termination of rental contract. ktdt77 Housing in general 28 10.07.2007 21:53


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 19:43.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0