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Old 13.06.2011, 00:36
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Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

I have read through a lot of posts regarding unemployment benefit and how I have to go about things, but I need some advice on my particular situation, and any advice would me most appreciated:

On Monday my boss took me into her office and told me that she was going to terminate my 100% contract and offer me a 60% contract. It was a bit of a surprise, but with all the restructuring in my workplace, it did not shock me. She then went on to make it out as if it was a great thing for me, and said she would pretend as if we had the conversation the week before so that I could leave a month early (my contract clearly states either side can only cancel a contract at the end of a calendar month) ...which in NO WAY makes sense as that would mean one month less employment for me. Anyhow, i turned down her offer for 60% as my salary was already lower than the average someone in my job and responsibility should make, and i realize that if I were unemployed, my benefits would be 70%, which is 10% more than what she was offering.

At this point her 60% offer was only verbal and I didn't have anything in my hands. Then, on Friday she called me into her office and gave me the Termination of Contract for my 100%, and backdated it to the end of the last month so that it now states I will lose my job 1 month before the real time it should.

My questions are the following:

1) Since I have to get her to re-write my resignation letter with the correct dates (can't believe she was dodgy enough to try to backdate a letter so she could stop me working a month earlier at 100%). Would it help if my termination of contract also states that she is offering me the 60%?

2) If I sign on as unemployed and they see that my contract was cancelled BUT I was offered a 60% job, will they refuse to give me my unemployment benefits straight away? Will I have to take the 60% job offer? Even if it pays too little? The way I see it is that 60% of my already sh*t 100% salary is crap and I would prefer to try and find a decent salary job or at least one that pays better at a better %. If I work 60% at my job....it won't REALLY be 60%...it will be me doing my 100% job in that timeframe, and I won't have much time to look for another job.

Please, if anyone out there has any advice, that would be great. My boss does not play by the rules, but I don't want this to get ugly. I need a good reference letter from her....
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Old 13.06.2011, 00:55
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Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

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1) Since I have to get her to re-write my resignation letter with the correct dates (can't believe she was dodgy enough to try to backdate a letter so she could stop me working a month earlier at 100%). Would it help if my termination of contract also states that she is offering me the 60%?

2) If I sign on as unemployed and they see that my contract was cancelled BUT I was offered a 60% job, will they refuse to give me my unemployment benefits straight away? Will I have to take the 60% job offer? Even if it pays too little? The way I see it is that 60% of my already sh*t 100% salary is crap and I would prefer to try and find a decent salary job or at least one that pays better at a better %. If I work 60% at my job....it won't REALLY be 60%...it will be me doing my 100% job in that timeframe, and I won't have much time to look for another job.

Please, if anyone out there has any advice, that would be great. My boss does not play by the rules, but I don't want this to get ugly. I need a good reference letter from her....
Re:
1) The 2 contracts (100% and 60%) are separate. But first you need to decide if you are definitely not going to take the 60% job. If no, then you cannot agree to one month backdate (unless you want to for other reasons).

2)this question relates to the RAV. I don't think they could you force you to take a 60% job.

Best would be to terminated for the 100% contract and then get unemployment benefits based on this whilst looking for a new 100% job.

Last edited by MusicChick; 13.06.2011 at 01:25. Reason: Fixed quote.
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Old 13.06.2011, 01:08
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Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Thanks for the reply. The back dating was her dodgy dealing...not a request of mine. She would just like to pay me less as soon as possible.

I heard in other posts that if you are offered a lower percentage at your work and you turn it down, you might get penalized by the RAV for this because you are effectively turning down work? I also heard you can take a part time position, such as the 60% contract, and as unemployment benefits are 70%, the RAV will pay you the extra 10% that I wouldn't make at my job? This is however not an option for me as it doesn't give me a chance to look for a 100% job, and anyway, I no longer want to work in such an environment....

Last edited by Gummybear; 13.06.2011 at 01:08. Reason: Missed a word out
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Old 13.06.2011, 07:59
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Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Simply explain to the RAV the little game that your employer attempted, how they attempted to take away your contractual notice period, and how you don't think it would be very intelligent to continue working for someone with such "ethics".

It would be to the best if you could document any evidence as to when the conversation took place. At the very least, write down (just the facts of!) what happened so you can show it to the RAV. This is a pretty serious error on the part of the employer.
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Old 13.06.2011, 08:37
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Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

If you take the 60% job you can sign on to RAV for the missing 40% while you are looking for a new 100% job. If you refuse the 60% job it may be seen by RAV as your not willing to work and they'll only compensate you with 40% of your last wage.

RAV have really tightened their belt lately and as technically you would only be 40% unemployed (if you refuse the 60%) they would see it as their right to withhold the other 60% for as many days as they are allowed.

If you want your rightful dues, let your boss know your not accepting the back-dated notice and use this time to complete all the paperwork with Rav, so when the time comes you wont have to wait so long for the money to come through.

It's usually easier to get a new job while your in employment.

Good Luck and keep us updated to how things go.
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Old 13.06.2011, 09:14
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Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

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... This is a pretty serious error on the part of the employer.
Con, fraud, dishonest act, chicanery, duplicity. But not error.
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Old 13.06.2011, 09:16
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Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

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Con, fraud, dishonest act, chicanery, duplicity. But not error.
"Error" as in they f'ed that one up pretty good.
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Old 13.06.2011, 10:02
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Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Not sure how long you've been working for this company but usually there is a 3 months notice period!

Tell her that you will not accept the notice as it's illegal and that she will be hearing from your lawyer! You shouldn't let her pressure you into this kind of deal unless of course she can come up with a shiny spotless reference letter but still 3 months notice and not just 1!!
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Old 13.06.2011, 10:06
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Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

It's totally unacceptable.
Yes you'll have to grab the 60% or the RAV could get difficult with you, but do not worry, the other 40% (well 70% if single or 80% if you have kids, of the 40% to be exact) are covered by the RAV.

Perhaps you can ask the RAV what you should do ? They will help you, it is in their interest because if you are terminated for economical reasons (no fault) one month earlier, they'll have to cover you for that month.

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but still 3 months notice and not just 1!!
No, not true. Legally if I recall correctly, it's 1 week notice during the first 3 months of employment, 1 month notice after the 3 months until the end of the first year and then after that it's 2 months notice.
Unless you have a signed contract with other agreements/indications
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Old 13.06.2011, 10:08
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Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Thanks for all the information.

I have yet to turn down the 60%, but my boss wants an answer soon. But to be honest, I don't want to take it and have to work in that environment...especially as it leaves me VERY insecure and I never know if she will decrease my % more, and then I am really screwed with the RAV. At least now I am guaranteed a percent of my 100% salary. if I take the 60 %, I could be left with an unemployment benefit of 70% of that in the future, which would be peanuts. But...how will I know what the RAV will think of all this before I turn down the contract? Can I really know, or do I just have to take the chance that the RAV will work in my favor once I sign on?

I also don't understand the part about the RAV compensating the other 40% of my salary. To make things easy, let's say I make 1000 CHF a month. If I don't take the 60% job, I will get 7000 CHF from the RAV. But if I take the 60% job and make 600 CHF a month, will the RAV compensate me with 100 CHF to bring it up to 70% of my previous salary, or 40% more, which is 400 CHF to bring it up to the same level as my 100% salary?

I am sorry I am asking so many questions, but I can't relax until I know my rights
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Old 13.06.2011, 10:18
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Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

It would be worth going along to RAV now and asking your options. You will need a German speaker with you to help interpret. I believe RAV get very interested when employers try to duck out of their legal obligations.

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Old 13.06.2011, 10:25
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Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

No.... let's say you make 1000 SFr as you mentioned and you accept the 60% job from your employer.

60% will come from your employer = 600

You will register with the RAV for the 40% loss of salary.
They will look at:
- what you've earned over the past 6 months and make an average and then calculate 40% of that
- if you have children or not
- how many months you've worked over the past 2 years.

This will determine the amount of days to which you are entitled + the amount you will receive.

So with the hypothesis of 1000 SFr:

40 % of 1000 = 400
Then depending to what you are entitled (kids or not):
70 % of 400
or
80% of 400

They will expect you to actively search for a 40% job during your time with the RAV.

Hope this helps but:
This is info I heard of years ago, I think it's still valid though you'd need to check.
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Old 13.06.2011, 10:25
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Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

The Rav will compensate you with 70% of the 40% reduced work load for as many day's as your entitled to. During this time they will expect you to seek employment either for the missing 40% or a new 100% job.

You have been given a choice of 60% or nothing. If you refuse the 60% RaV may see this as unwillingness to work and cut your money accordingly. There is no guarantee that a new job will keep you for ever either.

I know it sounds tough but in the end effect by not taking the 60% you would be refusing work.
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Old 13.06.2011, 10:26
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Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Oops, I just said the same as Sky.
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Old 13.06.2011, 10:33
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Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Thanks Oldhand and Sky. I feel like I have a basic idea of what to expect...but I would prefer not to have to take the 60%. I prefer to look for a 100% job straight off.

Does anyone have good or bad experiences with the RAV in Zurich? Especially anyone living in Oerlikon?
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Old 13.06.2011, 10:45
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Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

Gummy.... don't think you'll have a choice.
You'll be obliged by the RAV to accept the 60% from your employer.
The RAV will only cover the missing 40% if you have a written doc from your employer that they are willing to offer you a 60% job. They'll contact the employer as a normal part of the procedure.

This of course does not stop you from actively looking for 100% job whilst you're in this situation.
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Old 13.06.2011, 10:49
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Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

As Sky say's you probably won't have a choice. Rav will not pay money out when a person has a chance to work.
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Old 13.06.2011, 10:50
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Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

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Gummy.... don't think you'll have a choice.
You'll be obliged by the RAV to accept the 60% from your employer.
The RAV will only cover the missing 40% if you have a written doc from your employer that they are willing to offer you a 60% job. They'll contact the employer as a normal part of the procedure.

This of course does not stop you from actively looking for 100% job whilst you're in this situation.
OK so you can have a 60% job with 88% or 92% pay once you get the top up from the RAV. Not such a bad deal, with less tax to pay as well!
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Old 13.06.2011, 10:53
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Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

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Thanks Oldhand and Sky. I feel like I have a basic idea of what to expect...but I would prefer not to have to take the 60%. I prefer to look for a 100% job straight off.
It's definitely easier to find a job while you have a job, and you will have two free days in which to search for a new 100% job. Also in taking the 60% you may keep on better terms with your current employer for the all-important reference and demonstrate willingness to keep working to future employers as well as RAV.

Could you even indicate to your employer that you will take the 60% but will have to immediately start looking for a new full-time role so you want a shorter notice period written into your new contract and to be able to take time off for interviews? Might help a little, and knowing that they will lose you anyway they may decide not to bother offering you a 60% contract and just let you go!

Best of luck
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Old 13.06.2011, 10:57
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Re: Contract termination and offered a much lower work %

I don't think that you can have a shorter notice period than 1 month. Plus it would be a 2 way street.
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