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-   -   RAV bridging between jobs (https://www.englishforum.ch/employment/117210-rav-bridging-between-jobs.html)

MrVertigo 21.06.2011 11:26

RAV bridging between jobs
 
I would like to have an insight about RAV from our EF community:

My wife's company is closing down and everyone received a dismissal letter. Last working month is Sept. My wife got immediately an attractive offer from a competitor but she would be starting in November. My question: does RAV finance/pay the bridging for October ?

22 yards 21.06.2011 11:28

Re: RAV bridging between jobs
 
Provided your wife qualifies for unemployment benefits in the usual way (has worked in CH or EU for the prescribed period, etc), then yes, she would receive benefits for that month. Bear in mind that there is a "waiting period" ranging from a few days up, where no benefits are paid.

stephen_NE 21.06.2011 11:34

Re: RAV bridging between jobs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MrVertigo (Post 1234937)
I would like to have an insight about RAV from our EF community:

My wife's company is closing down and everyone received a dismissal letter. Last working month is Sept. My wife got immediately an attractive offer from a competitor but she would be starting in November. My question: does RAV finance/pay the bridging for October ?

In theory yes, but in reality it might not be worth the hassle for one month. Unemployment payments do not kick in immediately, there is a delay of between 5 and 20 working days before they start paying. The length of the delay depends on how much the person was earning in their previous job (more then 10K a month = no money for the first month of unemployment).

Your wife will have to attend a three-hour session where the RAV people will explain her rights and responsibilities as a job-seeker, and she will be obliged to provide evidence that she has been actively looking for work ever since the day when she received her notice. In practice, they will expect to see evidence of between 8 and 12 job applications per month.

It's a real pain and a degrading experience, I wouldn't do it for one month unless you badly need the money.

Treverus 21.06.2011 11:39

Re: RAV bridging between jobs
 
No problem at all, they have to pay. I would have to look it up, but if I remeber correctly is the waiting period for people under 120k CHF just five days, so you get three weeks money. I think above that does the waiting period hit one months pretty soon in which case the wife wouldn't see a lot.

Some questions though:
- did the new employer suggest November or the wife?
- is the new employer aware of the wife's current employer closing down?

The RAV might give them a call and check weather somebody is generating a garden leave themselves... but they normally don't. I was in the same situation before and with the RAV for exactly one month. One thing I have to mention as it was insanely stupid: While I already had my offer, they insisted that I needed to continue to write applications for the one month! (But hey, I can pump out those ten applications a month within an hour if I do not want the jobs anyway and therefore send out some standard email with cv)

Treverus 21.06.2011 11:40

Re: RAV bridging between jobs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by stephen_NE (Post 1234951)
Your wife will have to attend a three-hour session where the RAV people will explain her rights and responsibilities as a job-seeker, and she will be obliged to provide evidence that she has been actively looking for work ever since the day when she received her notice. In practice, they will expect to see evidence of between 8 and 12 job applications per month.

It's a real pain and a degrading experience, I wouldn't do it for one month unless you badly need the money.

Not necessarily: When I went there in the exact same situation presenting them a new work contract starting one month later, I did not need to go to the long session on "rights and duties of an umeployed".

Doctor 21.06.2011 11:51

Re: RAV bridging between jobs
 
Do you have children ? Then Waiting days are max 5.

If you dont have children, it is 5 waiting days, if your insured income is abover 3000 but below ca. 5000 per month, then I think 10 waiting days if you earned between 5000 and 7000. And 15 waiting days if you earned between 7000 and 10500. If you earned above 10500 per month, unemployment benefits are capped at that, and you have 20 waiting days.

If you are on low income (below 3k), you dont have waiting days at all.

Doc.

22 yards 21.06.2011 11:52

Re: RAV bridging between jobs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by stephen_NE (Post 1234951)
In theory yes, but in reality it might not be worth the hassle for one month. Unemployment payments do not kick in immediately, there is a delay of between 5 and 20 working days before they start paying. The length of the delay depends on how much the person was earning in their previous job (more then 10K a month = no money for the first month of unemployment).

Your wife will have to attend a three-hour session where the RAV people will explain her rights and responsibilities as a job-seeker, and she will be obliged to provide evidence that she has been actively looking for work ever since the day when she received her notice. In practice, they will expect to see evidence of between 8 and 12 job applications per month.

It's a real pain and a degrading experience, I wouldn't do it for one month unless you badly need the money.

I don't agree with this. The waiting period can be as little as 5 days, even for incomes >CHF 200k. (Of course, unemployment benefits are capped at around CHF 8,500 per month, before tax and other deductions.)

ETA: Capably explained by the post above.

The three-hour session doesn't exist in some RAV offices. Often, highly-paid professionals are not subjected to this -- the assumption is that they are very motivated (and capable) to find a new job.

stephen_NE 21.06.2011 11:53

Re: RAV bridging between jobs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Treverus (Post 1234957)
the waiting period for people under 120k CHF just five days, so you get three weeks money.

As from 1st April 2011, the waiting period is:

No delay if your salary was below 36,000 CHF
5 days if between 30,000 and 60,000 CHF
10 days between 60,000 and 90,000 CHF
15 days between 90,000 and 125,000 CHF
20 days above 125,000 CHF

Source (in French) : http://www.seco.admin.ch/themen/0038...x.html?lang=fr.... and I was told the same thing at my local ORP/RAV three weeks ago.

22 yards 21.06.2011 11:56

Re: RAV bridging between jobs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Doctor (Post 1234982)
If you earned above 10500 per month, unemployment benefits are capped at that, and you have 20 waiting days.

Just to clarify, benefits are capped at 80% of CHF10,500 per month if you have children (and the waiting period is 5 days); 70% if no children.

Guest 21.06.2011 12:12

Re: RAV bridging between jobs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Treverus (Post 1234957)
No problem at all, they have to pay. I would have to look it up, but if I remeber correctly is the waiting period for people under 120k CHF just five days, so you get three weeks money. I think above that does the waiting period hit one months pretty soon in which case the wife wouldn't see a lot.

Some questions though:
- did the new employer suggest November or the wife?
- is the new employer aware of the wife's current employer closing down?

The RAV might give them a call and check weather somebody is generating a garden leave themselves... but they normally don't. I was in the same situation before and with the RAV for exactly one month. One thing I have to mention as it was insanely stupid: While I already had my offer, they insisted that I needed to continue to write applications for the one month! (But hey, I can pump out those ten applications a month within an hour if I do not want the jobs anyway and therefore send out some standard email with cv)



My husband went through the same thing with the RAV a few years ago. He finished one job then in the interim period of about a month or so, he was able to collect unemployment benefit.

He was not required to make the usual job applications normally required by the RAV and the whole process was fairly simple.

It makes sense to make use of the RAV / unemployment benefits even if it's for a short time - after all, we pay into the system; we might as well reap the benefits when we need it.

stephen_NE 21.06.2011 12:21

Re: RAV bridging between jobs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by 22 yards (Post 1234983)
The three-hour session doesn't exist in some RAV offices. Often, highly-paid professionals are not subjected to this -- the assumption is that they are very motivated (and capable) to find a new job.

Interesting that in some cantons, RAV don't make you go through the information session. In Neuchâtel, everyone seems to have to do it. When I was laid off a year ago along with seven colleagues (all in relatively senior positions), all of us were made to attend a session during which we were told absolutely nothing that wasn't already written down in the various brochures that we were given.

Thankfully, when I went back recently to sign on again, they exempted me from it because I had already attended last year.

Treverus 21.06.2011 12:30

Re: RAV bridging between jobs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by stephen_NE (Post 1235017)
Interesting that in some cantons, RAV don't make you go through the information session. In Neuchâtel, everyone seems to have to do it. When I was laid off a year ago along with seven colleagues (all in relatively senior positions), all of us were made to attend a session during which we were told absolutely nothing that wasn't already written down in the various brochures that we were given.

Thankfully, when I went back recently to sign on again, they exempted me from it because I had already attended last year.

I think in my case was it more the timing: I went to the RAV for "my" one month exactly when the financial crisis hit Zurich and the RAVs were totally overworked... If I remember correctly, I would have to attend the course as well, but since my advisor could only get me a place in a course AFTER I started my new job we agreed that this makes no sense.

MrVertigo 21.06.2011 12:42

Re: RAV bridging between jobs
 
thank you all for your inputs.
Some answers to all your questions:

- yes we have 2 kids
- wife earns more than 120kchf
- new employer knows about the 1 month gap but can't start earlier for "internal" reasons.
- she does not need to look for another job as the new employer sent a contract with starting day 1st November.

It's still worth trying to get a few days paid in October I guess.

stephen_NE 21.06.2011 12:47

Re: RAV bridging between jobs
 
The two kids are going to be what saves you, I think. Otherwise it wouldn't be worth it.

MrVertigo 21.06.2011 12:49

Re: RAV bridging between jobs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by stephen_NE (Post 1235056)
The two kids are going to be what saves you, I think. Otherwise it wouldn't be worth it.

thanks. I knew I had a good reason to make them :D

22 yards 21.06.2011 13:02

Re: RAV bridging between jobs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MrVertigo (Post 1235046)
thank you all for your inputs.
Some answers to all your questions:

- yes we have 2 kids
- wife earns more than 120kchf
- new employer knows about the 1 month gap but can't start earlier for "internal" reasons.
- she does not need to look for another job as the new employer sent a contract with starting day 1st November.

It's still worth trying to get a few days paid in October I guess.

There are 21 working days in October. Subtract the 5 waiting days, that leaves 16 paid days. If my calculations are correct, I think your wife would receive just under CHF 6,200 for the month, before tax etc.

So, IMO, it's worth applying ...

Search EF for the other RAV threads and make sure she does all the right things. I'm sure there's no need to send off applications, but check first! And she should go and register with RAV now. Don't wait.

Doctor 21.06.2011 13:10

Re: RAV bridging between jobs
 
All months have 21.7 days, as that is the average.

So your wife will get 80% for 16.7 days.

Doc.

22 yards 21.06.2011 13:18

Re: RAV bridging between jobs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Doctor (Post 1235093)
All months have 21.7 days, as that is the average.

So your wife will get 80% for 16.7 days.

Doc.

Not quite correct. 21.7 days is the average per month. The payment is based on actual days. There will be 16 actual, payable days in October, so that's what the fund will pay for.

The average of 21.7 (derived from 260 working days per year) is used to determine the payment per day, but the number of days paid varies from month to month. That's why the payment in February is considerably lower than that in August, for example. October 2011 is a "good" month. ;)

MathNut 21.06.2011 13:21

Re: RAV bridging between jobs
 
I'm in the same boat at the moment (currently unemployed but will start working again in August.)

I was strongly advised by Swiss friends not to take RAV benefits for the two-month gap if Mr. MathNut and I could possibly get by without them. Hassle, social stigma (especially given that we are newcomers in a small town), and possible implications for naturalization were cited as reasons not to.

I'd be interested to know how well-founded any of that advice was (the last bit particularly*) but in the meantime, we've decided to err on the safe side and haven't applied for it. Tightened our belts a bit instead and so far it's all right.

If you've got kids there is only so much belt-tightening you can do, of course! Either way, just thought I'd pass along the advice that's been given to me.


* as I understand it, you're not meant to apply for citizenship WHILE you are on benefits, but having applied for them in the past isn't necessarily a problem. Like everything else though I'm sure it 'varies from canton to canton', and the rules in Zürich may not be the rules in Schönesdörfli GL...

Treverus 21.06.2011 13:27

Re: RAV bridging between jobs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MathNut (Post 1235123)
I'd be interested to know how well-founded any of that advice was (the last bit particularly*).

It was uninformed. For naturalization and in some cases the C permit you need to prove that you did not take Sozialhilfe. That's what you get after all those RAV days... and a completely different story: Everyone has some gaps between jobs, but taking Sozialhilfe means that your gap is years wide and you cost the tax payer. Not worthy to become Swiss...


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