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Old 02.12.2011, 11:14
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Wages as Qualified Nurse!

Im a qualified nurse ( DN1 ) working in an Old peoples home in Zürich.

Was checking my monthly loan today. I work 80% and 8 years ago my basic wage was 4160 CHF per month. Now it's 4370 CHF in a month plus 13 Months loan as extra.

That makes 210CHF per month increase over 8 years ( 26 per month) !!

And they tell us at work that we have to give more results.Ha!
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Old 07.12.2011, 01:39
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Re: Wages as Qualified Nurse!

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Im a qualified nurse ( DN1 ) working in an Old peoples home in Zürich.

Was checking my monthly loan today. I work 80% and 8 years ago my basic wage was 4160 CHF per month. Now it's 4370 CHF in a month plus 13 Months loan as extra.

That makes 210CHF per month increase over 8 years ( 26 per month) !!

And they tell us at work that we have to give more results.Ha!
Wasn't your net wage CHF 5'400 monthly (after taxes, but before health insurance payments) a couple of days ago?
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Old 07.12.2011, 01:56
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Re: Wages as Qualified Nurse!

To be honest, i wouldnt be willing to increase your wage with that attitude!

You are complaining about giving more results???? You are responsible for the health and wellbeing of the people you care for and should always be giving 100% or more when it comes to results

If nursing is not a job that is in your heart then get out and get another job, i would be sick if i had a mother or grandmother in your care

If your wage is not on a par with other nurses then complain to you boss, then your union. If it is then i would suggest you dont come on here badmouthing a position which could be a very touchy subject for a lot of people
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Old 07.12.2011, 03:36
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Re: Wages as Qualified Nurse!

is that without tax already?
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Old 07.12.2011, 10:20
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Re: Wages as Qualified Nurse!

No.

I work 80% at 4370 CHF per month BEFORE tax etc etc


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Wasn't your net wage CHF 5'400 monthly (after taxes, but before health insurance payments) a couple of days ago?

Last edited by omtatsat; 07.12.2011 at 10:31.
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Old 07.12.2011, 10:26
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Re: Wages as Qualified Nurse!

It's also got to do with give and take. It's not all about giving. One expects something from the employer and not just a pat on the head-thats a good boy attitude!

Enough with your moralism!

If you dont work in this profession then keep your thoughts to yourself. Ignorance is bliss!

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To be honest, i wouldnt be willing to increase your wage with that attitude!

You are complaining about giving more results???? You are responsible for the health and wellbeing of the people you care for and should always be giving 100% or more when it comes to results

If nursing is not a job that is in your heart then get out and get another job, i would be sick if i had a mother or grandmother in your care

If your wage is not on a par with other nurses then complain to you boss, then your union. If it is then i would suggest you dont come on here badmouthing a position which could be a very touchy subject for a lot of people
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Old 07.12.2011, 10:29
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Re: Wages as Qualified Nurse!

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Im a qualified nurse ( DN1 ) working in an Old peoples home in Zürich.

Was checking my monthly loan today. I work 80% and 8 years ago my basic wage was 4160 CHF per month. Now it's 4370 CHF in a month plus 13 Months loan as extra.

That makes 210CHF per month increase over 8 years ( 26 per month) !!

And they tell us at work that we have to give more results.Ha!
Could you invest a couple of years to do some kind of upgrade qualification which would perhaps put you in a better position to negotiate better conditions? If you are working 80% that gives you a day off in the week plus a two-day weekend to hit the books and attend courses.

Lots of people get stuck in a rut - if you are happy to stay there and live on the salary you currently get then fine but you sound like you are looking for more and that means putting in a bit of effort to find new paths.

Been there myself, had to work against a million excuses (most of them self-invented ) but finally got my finger out and did the necessaries to get where I am today.

Having said that, I am now reaching the edge of another rut and I'm in dire need of topping up my qualifications before I end up in that rut but am finding all the usual excuses keep popping up...
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Old 07.12.2011, 10:40
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Re: Wages as Qualified Nurse!

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To be honest, i wouldnt be willing to increase your wage with that attitude!

You are complaining about giving more results???? You are responsible for the health and wellbeing of the people you care for and should always be giving 100% or more when it comes to results

If nursing is not a job that is in your heart then get out and get another job, i would be sick if i had a mother or grandmother in your care

If your wage is not on a par with other nurses then complain to you boss, then your union. If it is then i would suggest you dont come on here badmouthing a position which could be a very touchy subject for a lot of people
Yep. My grandmother died 2 weeks ago as a result of a fall she had. Nurses were not paying attention and she wasn't properly secured in her wheelchair and she felt down and broke her hip and arm. Since then, her health went spiral down very quickly.
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Old 07.12.2011, 10:56
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Re: Wages as Qualified Nurse!

Well sorry about your grandmother. But you have to realize that accidents do happen. You say " nurses were not paying attention". Unfortunately we cannot sit at the side of the elderly 24 hours a day. They also have their rights to privacy. Negligence is open to interpretation. We don't normally strap older people in their wheelchair. That's got to do legally with robbing a person of their freedom. That's only done with agreement of relatives.


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Yep. My grandmother died 2 weeks ago as a result of a fall she had. Nurses were not paying attention and she wasn't properly secured in her wheelchair and she felt down and broke her hip and arm. Since then, her health went spiral down very quickly.
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Old 07.12.2011, 11:12
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Re: Wages as Qualified Nurse!

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Well sorry about your grandmother. But you have to realize that accidents do happen. You say " nurses were not paying attention". Unfortunately we cannot sit at the side of the elderly 24 hours a day. They also have their rights to privacy. Negligence is open to interpretation. We don't normally strap older people in their wheelchair. That's got to do legally with robbing a person of their freedom. That's only done with agreement of relatives.
They do indeed strap them if it is a risk to fall. If an person can't stand and is stay unstrap it is dangerous for that person to fall and be injured.

If you can't sit next to them make sure they are properly safe and secure before to go having a private moment. Job of a nurse in home for older people have a huge responsibility, which all of us are aware of. But you take the job and you are there to provide aids and support to them. Your private moment you have it when you go back home. During your working hours, you deal with human being that are 100% dependant on you to be feed, washed, changed, etc.

Accident happen, yes. Negligence is usually the reason of the accident.
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Old 07.12.2011, 11:26
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Re: Wages as Qualified Nurse!

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Well sorry about your grandmother. But you have to realize that accidents do happen. You say " nurses were not paying attention". Unfortunately we cannot sit at the side of the elderly 24 hours a day. They also have their rights to privacy. Negligence is open to interpretation. We don't normally strap older people in their wheelchair. That's got to do legally with robbing a person of their freedom. That's only done with agreement of relatives.
But publicly saying that you are not happy about putting in as much effort as you can is simply wrong.

A fireman for instance, doesnt believe he gets paid enough to walk into a fire should not be a fireman

A police officer who does not believe he gets paid enough to appraoch a criminal in a difficult situation should not be a police officer.

You, who doesnt believe that you should give everything you have in caring for the peple that you have been made responsible for should not be a nurse.

Complaining about your wage is one thing, but saying that you are not willing to produce mre results when in charge of people is in my opinion, not on.

And dont tell me to keep my opinon to myself as i dont work in the profession, go and post your question/opinion on a medical forum. There are not enough members on the forum who work in the profession in this country to justify that statement, its an open forum.
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Old 07.12.2011, 11:31
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Re: Wages as Qualified Nurse!

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That makes 210CHF per month increase over 8 years ( 26 per month) !!
At least you've had an increase!

Tom
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Old 07.12.2011, 11:33
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Re: Wages as Qualified Nurse!

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Well sorry about your grandmother. But you have to realize that accidents do happen. You say " nurses were not paying attention". Unfortunately we cannot sit at the side of the elderly 24 hours a day. They also have their rights to privacy. Negligence is open to interpretation. We don't normally strap older people in their wheelchair. That's got to do legally with robbing a person of their freedom. That's only done with agreement of relatives.
How about "with their own agreement"? That's why wheelchairs have straps, and having worked with disabled folks in a former life, I can say they make damn sure they're strapped in before they move about in a wheelchair and handbike.

You on the other hand sound like a jaded person, whose answer is "yeah, whateveaaah" when patients or relatives (or your superiors) complain. And fair enough, it's a tough job with not very much reward and constant cost pressure.

But telling relatives that their elderly that "accidents do happen, tough luck, sorry she's dead" is not good enough - how about "accidents like this should not happen, we apologise for not strapping her in and will make sure it will not happen again, and we're sorry for your loss"? That would be a good start.

Last edited by tom tulpe; 07.12.2011 at 11:37. Reason: Question mark at the end
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Old 07.12.2011, 11:41
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Re: Wages as Qualified Nurse!

(I'm probably going to regret this) To be fair, the OP didn't say which additional "results" he was being asked to deliver so it is a bit unfair to make the leap that he is skimping on the care of his charges.

Perhaps his management has asked him to fill in extra paperwork or take on some duties he's not been contracted to do or pull extra shifts without much notice or whatever.

Still not a great attitude to work but we don't know what kind of management he's working under. We shouldn't assume he's not taking proper care of the elderly people.
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Old 07.12.2011, 12:01
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Re: Wages as Qualified Nurse!

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(I'm probably going to regret this) To be fair, the OP didn't say which additional "results" he was being asked to deliver so it is a bit unfair to make the leap that he is skimping on the care of his charges.

Perhaps his management has asked him to fill in extra paperwork or take on some duties he's not been contracted to do or pull extra shifts without much notice or whatever.

Still not a great attitude to work but we don't know what kind of management he's working under. We shouldn't assume he's not taking proper care of the elderly people.
Well the OP did have a chance to remedy the situation by explaing what was meant in later posts and chose not to. Instead the quote was made "accidents do happen", to a person whose grandmother recently died

Nursing is not like any other service where we can pick and choose which company or person works for us. Its a job that we take what we get and we really should expect the best of service no matter who it is.

But however, the OP has the chance now to describe what was meant by producing more results and maybe help the thread lighten up a bit
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Old 07.12.2011, 12:26
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Re: Wages as Qualified Nurse!

Ok, independently of the (really bad) attitude of the OP, also seen in the other thread started by him in which he stated a different income, whether he does a good service or not is, I guess, not in discussion.

I'm sorry you grandmother died Nil. Mine also died because of negligence - the carers left the window open while she slept and she died of pneumonia a couple of days later. Worse than that, one of the last things she told us when we rushed her into the hospital was "the carer, she stole my ring".

On the other hand, OP, if you feel you earn too little, you have always an option: change job. Search for a better paid one, if you feel you are being underpaid. I have enough nurses in the family that got their payment REDUCED during the years.

Maybe it's because I am bitter and sour, but even though I am paid way under what most Swiss loan tables say of what an Architect should earn, I can't get a better one. So I shut up and wait for better times.

One should be realistic:

1. You have the chance? Then look for a new, better paid job.
2. You don't have the chance? Be happy you actually have that job.

Sorry for the rant.
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Old 07.12.2011, 12:49
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Re: Wages as Qualified Nurse!

Having watched nurses and ancilliary staff in the OAP home where my parents were, I can honestly say it is a very hard job, and one I could never ever do. My mum was a very independent person, and if any staff had tried to tie her into her wheel-chair to make her 'safe' she would have strongly objected and screamed blue-murder. You have to balance safety with independence, rights, quality of life, etc - and it is a very difficult thing to do. Impossible, at times. But THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO with the OP's question, I just cannot understand how you can attack him like this.
I am so grateful for all the staff did for my parents- even though one of them was a ***** and I helped in her getting the sack.

It is a very hard and demanding job for a very poor wage, and I am sure most of us would not be able to do it.

90% of the staff in the OAP homes and ancillary staff in hospitals travel over from France every day - as wages are too low for those living in CH.

Have you ever spent a day working in an OAP home, a week, a month... try it for years? How many of us could do it?

Somebody else recently asked if CHF73.000 (can't remember exact figure) is enough to live in Zurich- and most replied that it would be a struggle. Not very good at maths - but I think the above salary is a lot less than that.

Last edited by Odile; 07.12.2011 at 14:35.
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Old 07.12.2011, 15:06
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Re: Wages as Qualified Nurse!

Well as I said accidents happen-no matter how much security one takes. And that's THE truth. And when you look for someone to blame the first you shoot off at is the carer. It's always this mentality-" who's to blame". One cannot sit next to them 24 hours a day.

These people live in a elderly people's home-it's not mental house where people are tied to their beds or their wheelchair. Most of the people we look after are liable to have accidents. One cannot simply strap all of them to their beds or wheelchair. It's also called quality of life.

It's again a case of ( some ) people giving opinions about things they have no experience with.


Did I say " tough luck she's dead". No thats your invention! And I consider your statement obnoxious. Wheelchairs don't normally have straps. It's with the agreement of the person or relatives that we constrain them.

We have 80 elderly to look after and 6 people working so if you think that we can provide private care then you are mistaken. And if one wants private care then one pays for it. Point your finger at the management not the carer.
Or the relatives who ( maybe) come by once a month.




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How about "with their own agreement"? That's why wheelchairs have straps, and having worked with disabled folks in a former life, I can say they make damn sure they're strapped in before they move about in a wheelchair and handbike.

You on the other hand sound like a jaded person, whose answer is "yeah, whateveaaah" when patients or relatives (or your superiors) complain. And fair enough, it's a tough job with not very much reward and constant cost pressure.

But telling relatives that their elderly that "accidents do happen, tough luck, sorry she's dead" is not good enough - how about "accidents like this should not happen, we apologise for not strapping her in and will make sure it will not happen again, and we're sorry for your loss"? That would be a good start.
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Old 07.12.2011, 15:14
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Re: Wages as Qualified Nurse!

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I'm sorry you grandmother died Nil. Mine also died because of negligence - the carers left the window open while she slept and she died of pneumonia a couple of days later. Worse than that, one of the last things she told us when we rushed her into the hospital was "the carer, she stole my ring".

Sorry for the rant.
Why does someone have to shoulder the blame when an old person dies in an old people's home. Why not just accept the fact that their time is up and it's time to go?

Carers usually open the windows during the night because the rooms are overheated and it can get incredibly difficult to breathe if the door is closed. It is debatable as to whether sleeping near an open window causes penumonia. Pneumonia is a very common cause of death in old people and is usually caused by being inactive and an ill-functioning immune system.

As to the "stolen ring", many old people accuse people of stealing their possessions when they have mislaid them themselves and this is probably one of the earliest signs of dementia.

And yes, I have worked as a carer in old people's homes, in case you ask.
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Old 07.12.2011, 15:43
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Re: Wages as Qualified Nurse!

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As to the "stolen ring", many old people accuse people of stealing their possessions when they have mislaid them themselves and this is probably one of the earliest signs of dementia.
Yes, when my mother in law was in a home a few months ago, she was paranoid of people stealing her stuff, but it took my wife a while to convince to deposit her rings and such (and the carers agreed that it was best as well), as every time she couldn't find something she thought it was stolen!

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