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  #41  
Old 19.04.2016, 21:24
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Re: Unemployment benefits - amount / deductions / timing etc.

Isn't there something too that payments are based on the last 6 or 12 months' earnings? In which case if you're away for 3 months your payments would be reduced.

As fatmanfilms says, you need to start job hunting 3 months before your contract end.


"Obligations of an unemployed person
  • You are required to start looking for a new job while you are working out your notice period. If you are employed on a limited term contract, you are required to start looking for work three months before the employment is due to end. If you do not meet this obligation, your benefits may be trimmed.
  • Be sure to keep all documentation related to your job search, such as job offers, applications and rejection letters. You will need to present them to your RAV consultant."
https://www.ch.ch/en/unemployment-ri...d-obligations/
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  #42  
Old 19.04.2016, 21:26
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Re: Unemployment benefits - amount / deductions / timing etc.

12 months, if it's to your benefit.

And thank god that they upped the limit to 148.200

Tom
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  #43  
Old 19.04.2016, 21:27
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Re: Unemployment benefits - amount / deductions / timing etc.

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Isn't there something too that payments are based on the last 6 or 12 months' earnings? In which case if you're away for 3 months your payments would be reduced.

As fatmanfilms says, you need to start job hunting 3 months before your contract end.


"Obligations of an unemployed person
  • You are required to start looking for a new job while you are working out your notice period. If you are employed on a limited term contract, you are required to start looking for work three months before the employment is due to end. If you do not meet this obligation, your benefits may be trimmed.
  • Be sure to keep all documentation related to your job search, such as job offers, applications and rejection letters. You will need to present them to your RAV consultant."
https://www.ch.ch/en/unemployment-ri...d-obligations/
Best thing is to open the rahemnfrist then try & get time off. Most RAV workers brain will explode at the thought.
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  #44  
Old 20.04.2016, 06:50
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Re: Unemployment benefits - amount / deductions / timing etc.

I know quite a few people who went travelling, some for substantially longer (but less than a year!) and even after quitting themselves. Still got some unemployment money after return, though as said only after a longer 'blocking time'.

But fatmanfilms' approach is probably the best one.
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  #45  
Old 20.04.2016, 09:30
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Re: Unemployment benefits - amount / deductions / timing etc.

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You can be punished if you don't make 10 good quality job applications a month during your notice period . Those applications can be world wide & outside your profession if necessary , saying there are no jobs in you field will not work!
Only thing there is that the amount of monthly applications is dependent on the whim of your RAV overlord, for some it is 10 for some even more, I was expected to produce at least 20 a month.
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  #46  
Old 20.04.2016, 14:53
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Re: Unemployment benefits - amount / deductions / timing etc.

Thanks a lot for your answers!

I am already looking for job since 1 month by the way. The idea is to get 3 months holiday only in case I don't find a new job from now till December. But it is good to know that I should register all the documentation regarding my job searching during the last three months of the year.

I just want to be free for three months! Come on... this kind of punishments are not cool xD

Thanks again for your answers
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  #47  
Old 20.04.2016, 18:42
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Re: Unemployment benefits - amount / deductions / timing etc.

"Those applications can be world wide & outside your profession if necessary"


I would like to warn to make applicationsoutside profession. After all, who is applying for jobs that are not in his profession might get Problems to refuse a job that is given by his consultant and not in his profession. Someone over 30 years must not do something which is not in his profession and shouldnt give the RAV additional chance to kick you.
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  #48  
Old 20.04.2016, 20:19
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Re: Unemployment benefits - amount / deductions / timing etc.

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"Those applications can be world wide & outside your profession if necessary"


I would like to warn to make applicationsoutside profession. After all, who is applying for jobs that are not in his profession might get Problems to refuse a job that is given by his consultant and not in his profession. Someone over 30 years must not do something which is not in his profession and shouldnt give the RAV additional chance to kick you.
What Planet did you say you were from?
Heck I had to apply for jobs so far out of my profession and so far down the food chain that I was regarded as unskilled labor.
Think about it, trying to compete with 25 year old burger flippers an failing even that.
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  #49  
Old 20.04.2016, 23:31
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Re: Unemployment benefits - amount / deductions / timing etc.

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What Planet did you say you were from?
Heck I had to apply for jobs so far out of my profession and so far down the food chain that I was regarded as unskilled labor.
Think about it, trying to compete with 25 year old burger flippers an failing even that.

then one has fooled you. nowhere in the regulations ofr unemployment posted the over 30 year olds must take any jobs that are outside of your profession/skills. There are court decisions which confirm that. It is unacceptable in the legal sense. Believe me, i know they offer you that but you should not do it as far you are older 30 years.
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  #50  
Old 20.04.2016, 23:50
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Re: Unemployment benefits - amount / deductions / timing etc.

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then one has fooled you. nowhere in the regulations ofr unemployment posted the over 30 year olds must take any jobs that are outside of your profession/skills. There are court decisions which confirm that. It is unacceptable in the legal sense. Believe me, i know they offer you that but you should not do it as far you are older 30 years.
You bring up some (usually non-existing) legal basis or ruling pretty much in every thread that is related to employment and employment law, whether it's the recommendation to run to a lawyer about every tiny little dispute (even if it's a dispute that is merely in the making) all the way to court rulings that supposedly assert something or other. More often than not you seem to assume that because something is not explicitly stated, it is implicitly assumed and that is not a correct conclusion.

You're doing the same here. Yes it's not explicitly stated anywhere that "people over 30 need to take any job". However, there is absolutely no rule whatsoever to confirm the opposite either. I'd like to see those supposed court rulings that concluded anyone "over 30" only has to take a job in his/her exact field, while getting unemployment money. Yes a PhD in Biochemistry will probably not be told to take a job as a Migros cashier (or so I hope), but there's a million things in between. Yes you may have a certain grace period and get away with a narrow job search for a few months where you can indeed focus on your specific field, whatever that may be. But once you've been on it for a while, they will want to get you off of it no matter what. And understandably so - while it is part of the social system, it is not charity and as with every insurance, they try to keep their cost low. Their duty is not to pay you money and find you the perfect job. Their duty is get you back in the labor market and sooner rather than later.
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  #51  
Old 21.04.2016, 15:14
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Re: Unemployment benefits - amount / deductions / timing etc.

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You bring up some (usually non-existing) legal basis or ruling pretty much in every thread that is related to employment and employment law, whether it's the recommendation to run to a lawyer about every tiny little dispute (even if it's a dispute that is merely in the making) all the way to court rulings that supposedly assert something or other. More often than not you seem to assume that because something is not explicitly stated, it is implicitly assumed and that is not a correct conclusion.

You're doing the same here. Yes it's not explicitly stated anywhere that "people over 30 need to take any job". However, there is absolutely no rule whatsoever to confirm the opposite either. I'd like to see those supposed court rulings that concluded anyone "over 30" only has to take a job in his/her exact field, while getting unemployment money. Yes a PhD in Biochemistry will probably not be told to take a job as a Migros cashier (or so I hope), but there's a million things in between. Yes you may have a certain grace period and get away with a narrow job search for a few months where you can indeed focus on your specific field, whatever that may be. But once you've been on it for a while, they will want to get you off of it no matter what. And understandably so - while it is part of the social system, it is not charity and as with every insurance, they try to keep their cost low. Their duty is not to pay you money and find you the perfect job. Their duty is get you back in the labor market and sooner rather than later.

I would advice to check the law
https://www.admin.ch/opc/de/classifi...159/index.html

and Reglements
http://www.treffpunkt-arbeit.ch/publikationen/gesetze/


Once you are in the situation you must inform yourself. To understand the laws or you will be ripped. Thats very simple.

As bilogist it is reasonable to work as a laboratory technician. It is the same line of job.
As a biologist it is unacceptable to work as operating personnel to control valves or packing products because it is unreasonable.

After few years you are out of job and thats the real damage. No body must accept this older 30 years. Each work creating Problems for your CV is unreasonable. This has been clearly decided by courts and the duty of the RAV is to accept and fullfill the law and regulations out of the SECO. Your right is to kick the a of any rav guy in case he wants to damage your CV
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  #52  
Old 21.04.2016, 15:22
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Re: Unemployment benefits - amount / deductions / timing etc.

So which paragraph in this very very long document are you referring to?
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  #53  
Old 21.04.2016, 16:18
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Re: Unemployment benefits - amount / deductions / timing etc.

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So which paragraph in this very very long document are you referring to?
https://www.admin.ch/opc/de/classifi...index.html#a17

"Der Versicherte, der Versicherungsleistungen beanspruchen will, muss mit Unterstützung des zuständigen Arbeitsamtes alles Zumutbare unternehmen, um Arbeitslosigkeit zu vermeiden oder zu verkürzen. Insbesondere ist er verpflichtet, Arbeit zu suchen, nötigenfalls auch ausserhalb seines bisherigen Berufes. Er muss seine Bemühungen nachweisen können."

No English translation available; synopsis:"required to search for work, if necessary also outside of the profession held to date"
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  #54  
Old 21.04.2016, 20:44
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Re: Unemployment benefits - amount / deductions / timing etc.

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https://www.admin.ch/opc/de/classifi...index.html#a17

"Der Versicherte, der Versicherungsleistungen beanspruchen will, muss mit Unterstützung des zuständigen Arbeitsamtes alles Zumutbare unternehmen, um Arbeitslosigkeit zu vermeiden oder zu verkürzen. Insbesondere ist er verpflichtet, Arbeit zu suchen, nötigenfalls auch ausserhalb seines bisherigen Berufes. Er muss seine Bemühungen nachweisen können."

No English translation available; synopsis:"required to search for work, if necessary also outside of the profession held to date"

important here is the emphasis on reasonable (zumutbar).
Please do check b 285 below.. "was ist unzumutbar" "was zumutbar"
Thats the guide line of the CH Goverment. All "Arbeitslosenkassen" do have to follow it.
http://www.treffpunkt-arbeit.ch/date..._2014-komp.pdf
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Old 22.04.2016, 09:25
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Re: Unemployment benefits - amount / deductions / timing etc.

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important here is the emphasis on reasonable (zumutbar).
Please do check b 285 below.. "was ist unzumutbar" "was zumutbar"
Thats the guide line of the CH Goverment. All "Arbeitslosenkassen" do have to follow it.
http://www.treffpunkt-arbeit.ch/date..._2014-komp.pdf
Or in Italian:

"Non è considerata adeguata un’occupazione che non tiene convenientemente conto delle capacità dell’assicurato o dell’attività che ha svolto in precedenza. La nozione di «capacità» comprende le capacità fisiche, mentali e professionali. È considerata adeguata un’occupazione che non è all’altezza delle capacità dell’assicurato ma non un lavoro che le superi."

It is not considered adequate of position that does not take into account the abilities and past experience. Abilities include physical, mental, and professional. A position that is below the abilities is adequate, but not one that exceeds them.

I.e. you can be over qualified, but not under-qualified.

Tom
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Old 23.04.2016, 12:44
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Re: Unemployment benefits - amount / deductions / timing etc.

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I know quite a few people who went travelling, some for substantially longer (but less than a year!) and even after quitting themselves. Still got some unemployment money after return, though as said only after a longer 'blocking time'.

But fatmanfilms' approach is probably the best one.
Dont Forget as a result of massive costs 2009-2010 for the ALV generated by the short-time work benefits in 2009-2010 reforms were made and shortened unemployment benefits, reduced for Younger ages and families the benefits, turned massively worse other guide lines. For example, for graduates and newly qualified controlled waiting period was massively set up in to futur so they dont have any realistic chance to get benefits. For long time breakers (Tourist for 2 or 3 years) the minumum controled days got down, the benefit too. So situation 2009 and today is not the same
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Old 23.04.2016, 12:50
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Re: Unemployment benefits - amount / deductions / timing etc.

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Or in Italian:

"Non è considerata adeguata un’occupazione che non tiene convenientemente conto delle capacità dell’assicurato o dell’attività che ha svolto in precedenza. La nozione di «capacità» comprende le capacità fisiche, mentali e professionali. È considerata adeguata un’occupazione che non è all’altezza delle capacità dell’assicurato ma non un lavoro che le superi."

It is not considered adequate of position that does not take into account the abilities and past experience. Abilities include physical, mental, and professional. A position that is below the abilities is adequate, but not one that exceeds them.

I.e. you can be over qualified, but not under-qualified.

Tom
Most in my pfoffession could probably deliver post mail every day. mostly they can read, walk, drive and talk. You can do this 2 years and put this on CV and properly you are out of indutry. Down from 120k to 70k. Thus, it is expected of the RAV not to insist that someone will do this. Clearly indicated in the guide lines. Furthermore no Need to damage the CV as it is not reasonable to come down from Engineer to post mail officer. On the other hand as engineer you can work inside another industry. I do advice every body who got such claims from his RAV Guy to show this guide lines and furthermore not damage their CV. Dont drop your education only for 1 or 2 years of RAV Benefits.
Clearly discribed in the guide lines
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  #58  
Old 16.08.2017, 09:07
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Re: Unemployment benefits - amount / deductions / timing etc.

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Any short term contracts should be accepted, even for just 1 day.
Hey fatmanfilms, Q: If you do contracts as an independent worker, would the potential 400 paid working days of unemployment still apply? In other words, does one paid contract day cancel a one day of unemployment benefit? Or does it merely postpone it for possible use later?
Hope my question is clear. Thanks!
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  #59  
Old 16.08.2017, 10:07
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Re: Unemployment benefits - amount / deductions / timing etc.

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Hey fatmanfilms, Q: If you do contracts as an independent worker, would the potential 400 paid working days of unemployment still apply? In other words, does one paid contract day cancel a one day of unemployment benefit? Or does it merely postpone it for possible use later?
Hope my question is clear. Thanks!
Days are actually irrelevant as it's converted into money, If you can get work at 1k a day you will sae more than 1 days unemployment pay.
The rahemnfrist is never extended however if you have earned the equivalent of 12 months work in the previous 24 months you get a new rahemnfrist
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Old 16.08.2017, 11:26
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Re: Unemployment benefits - amount / deductions / timing etc.

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Days are actually irrelevant as it's converted into money, If you can get work at 1k a day you will sae more than 1 days unemployment pay.
The rahemnfrist is never extended however if you have earned the equivalent of 12 months work in the previous 24 months you get a new rahemnfrist
If you get a new Rahmenfrist, is the amount you are entitled to recalculated?
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