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Old 10.10.2012, 22:50
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Short sick leave without doctor's paper?

In my previous working place, you don't have to give the doctor's certificate in order to take occasional and short sick leaves. Just a call to secretary saying you are sick is fine. The paper is a must only for long sick leaves (>3 days).

Now I changed the employer. Here, every sick leave requires a doctor's paper (even just one day).

I don't know what is the general situation as for this issue in Switzerland? Is my previous employer just exceptional?
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Old 10.10.2012, 22:52
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Re: Short sick leave without doctor's paper?

No, it's only required for more than 3 days.

Less is absurd, and not legal.

Tom
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Old 10.10.2012, 22:58
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Re: Short sick leave without doctor's paper?

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No, it's only required for more than 3 days.

Less is absurd, and not legal.

Tom
Oh. Good to know. Then it's strange for my new employer. I will talk with the colleagues about this...
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Old 10.10.2012, 23:04
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Re: Short sick leave without doctor's paper?

It is legal to ask for a sick note for a 1-day absence, however most companies require it only after 3 days. This is standard. Means your new employer is sub-standard, the worst may be to come...
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Old 11.10.2012, 09:00
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Re: Short sick leave without doctor's paper?

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It is legal to ask for a sick note for a 1-day absence, however most companies require it only after 3 days. This is standard. Means your new employer is sub-standard, the worst may be to come...
Or else he's so fed up with workers always taking time off saying they're sick that he's making sure they really are ill. Unfortunately, some people abuse trust systems like taking sick leave and that makes life difficult for the rest of the employees when employers get fed up and insist on sick notes from a doctor, even if it's only for a day.
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Old 11.10.2012, 09:18
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Re: Short sick leave without doctor's paper?

Doesn't it really come down to insurance, i.e. who is covering the salary during sick leave for more than three days?

Also, if you're pulling a quick one (calling in sick for one day) and have to spend half of it at the doctors, might as well get three days while at it

Besides, these days it is easy enough to get a sick note from most doctors even though there's nothing wrong with you. I haven't done it (in fact haven't had a sick day for the last 5 years - knock on wood) as I suck at lying but know of people who use it quite frequently
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Old 11.10.2012, 10:04
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Re: Short sick leave without doctor's paper?

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No, it's only required for more than 3 days.

Less is absurd, and not legal.

Tom
Absurd, yes, but still leagal to ask to ask for a note after 1 day, the company can also insist you visit a doctor at their expense, (he cannot divulge patient info but can issue a note or not...)

It all depends on the frequency of sick days, too many Mondays in a row tend to piss employers off a little
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Old 11.10.2012, 10:31
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Re: Short sick leave without doctor's paper?

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...Besides, these days it is easy enough to get a sick note from most doctors even though there's nothing wrong with you....
Sad but probably true. I just hope doctors here don't start turning into the types that let the patients dictate what medicines they need. That happens all the time in the U.S. thanks to pharma advertising. It's one thing to inform customers about a product, but a lot of the ads lead people think they have certain ailments and then insist to their docs they need a particular med.
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Old 11.10.2012, 11:20
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Re: Short sick leave without doctor's paper?

I have some problem of my skin and made an appointment with the doctor in the early afternoon. Also my work place is a long commute from my living place (2 hours one way), meaning that appointments in the early afternoon will spoil almost my all-day work time. So I'm inclined to take a sick day off. But considering that it is a skin problem, not like fever or something that directly prevent me from working, the doctor might not give me the "arręt de travail"? But then for employer I need "arręt de travail" for even one-day off...
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Old 11.10.2012, 14:33
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Re: Short sick leave without doctor's paper?

In general you are expected to visit doctors on you fee time and only when it is urgent or not possible in other way can you do it on working hours. So the law. Of course, most employees have no issue with their employees visiting doctors during work. Taking a sick-day for a 2 hours doctors visit is fraud though in my opinion.

I suggest you simply ask the doctor for a confirmation that you had a visit. They have special forms for that usually.
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Old 11.10.2012, 14:49
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Re: Short sick leave without doctor's paper?

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I have some problem of my skin and made an appointment with the doctor in the early afternoon. Also my work place is a long commute from my living place (2 hours one way), meaning that appointments in the early afternoon will spoil almost my all-day work time. So I'm inclined to take a sick day off. But considering that it is a skin problem, not like fever or something that directly prevent me from working, the doctor might not give me the "arręt de travail"? But then for employer I need "arręt de travail" for even one-day off...
I had that problem in the UK with appointments for other medical matters, so either made them 1st think in the morning or last at night, my employer used to allow me to make my time up on other day/s.

What I would like to ask the forum, as it is not required a medical certificate for 1 or 2 days. If an employee does this regularly, does the employee have to pay for those 1 or 2 days off?
is there a maximum in a year?
can the employer deduct from vacation days

This affects a friend of me, who works shifts and often is requested to work on days off as someone calls in sick
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Old 11.10.2012, 15:56
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Re: Short sick leave without doctor's paper?

Usually the insurance that the company has (is not mandatory!) kicks in after a waiting period of 30 days. This means that anything below that is carried fully by the employer.

In the first year of employment, the employer needs to grant 3 weeks of fully paid sick-days in total in a year and from 2 year onwards, 8+ weeks (Zürcher Skala).


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What I would like to ask the forum, as it is not required a medical certificate for 1 or 2 days. If an employee does this regularly, does the employee have to pay for those 1 or 2 days off?
is there a maximum in a year?
can the employer deduct from vacation days

This affects a friend of me, who works shifts and often is requested to work on days off as someone calls in sick

Last edited by Tilia; 11.10.2012 at 17:51.
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Old 11.10.2012, 16:02
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Re: Short sick leave without doctor's paper?

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Usually the insurance that the company has (is not mandatory!) kicks in after a waiting period of 30 days. This means that anything below that is carried fully by the employer.

In the first year of employment, the employer needs to grant 3 weeks of fully paid sick-days in total in a year and from 2 year onwards, 6 weeks.
Source?
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Old 11.10.2012, 16:04
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Re: Short sick leave without doctor's paper?

my employer permits 1 hour of time to visit the doctor. If you're sick then you can do 3 days before a sicknote.

Perhaps you want to balance the books with a vacation day and keep yourself honest?

Edit: I believe after the 89th day, the insurance kicks in and the employee is no longer paid by the employer but the insurance company.
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Old 11.10.2012, 16:07
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Re: Short sick leave without doctor's paper?

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Usually the insurance that the company has (is not mandatory!) kicks in after a waiting period of 30 days. This means that anything below that is carried fully by the employer.

In the first year of employment, the employer needs to grant 3 weeks of fully paid sick-days in total in a year and from 2 year onwards, 6 weeks.
Your reply remind me something. In my working contract there is something like:
The sick days off during my first year service will be 100% paid.
during my second year service will be 90% paid......

I don't understand this. Does it mean that after the first year if I am sick then I lose 10% of the salary? Why?
Or maybe I misunderstood the contract? Anyway it's in German is very hard to follow...
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Old 11.10.2012, 17:48
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Re: Short sick leave without doctor's paper?

That is a strange contract... Never heard of something similar. What they usually say is that after the 3 weeks resp. 8+ weeks, then the only reimburse what the insurance pays which is usually 80%.

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Your reply remind me something. In my working contract there is something like:
The sick days off during my first year service will be 100% paid.
during my second year service will be 90% paid......

I don't understand this. Does it mean that after the first year if I am sick then I lose 10% of the salary? Why?
Or maybe I misunderstood the contract? Anyway it's in German is very hard to follow...
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Old 11.10.2012, 17:51
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Re: Short sick leave without doctor's paper?

Here eg. I have also edited my post above to be more correct.

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Source?
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Old 12.10.2012, 10:27
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Re: Short sick leave without doctor's paper?

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Here eg. I have also edited my post above to be more correct.
Thanks for clarifying. Makes more sense now.
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