Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Employment  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #21  
Old 29.11.2012, 02:44
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Baden
Posts: 31
Groaned at 2 Times in 1 Post
Thanked 15 Times in 10 Posts
davida873 has no particular reputation at present
Re: Top end of IT market - my experience of London vs Zurich

that is what I like...pioneering...not like these pommie whingers....who always complain.....these guys are just too much fun.....worked with many of them ....nice guys/gals really.......but only happy when they are complaining...guess that is just thier nature
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users groan at davida873 for this post:
  #22  
Old 29.11.2012, 03:20
moggy's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Thurgau (& London, UK)
Posts: 1,677
Groaned at 10 Times in 10 Posts
Thanked 966 Times in 617 Posts
moggy has a reputation beyond reputemoggy has a reputation beyond reputemoggy has a reputation beyond reputemoggy has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Top end of IT market - my experience of London vs Zurich

Quote:
View Post
I am 40, married. I expect that for my wife would be really difficult to find a job. Had I been a few years younger, and single, I would have happily taken a punt at it...but now the risks seems to outweigh the potential benefits...
OK, but you did not mention if you have children, ie for advice on tax and expense
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 29.11.2012, 05:29
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Vaud
Posts: 2,459
Groaned at 175 Times in 122 Posts
Thanked 4,947 Times in 1,902 Posts
Mikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Top end of IT market - my experience of London vs Zurich

Quote:
View Post
that is what I like...pioneering...not like these pommie whingers....who always complain.....these guys are just too much fun.....worked with many of them ....nice guys/gals really.......but only happy when they are complaining...guess that is just thier nature
Whine whine whine. Your like a broken record.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Mikers for this useful post:
  #24  
Old 29.11.2012, 05:38
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Vaud
Posts: 2,459
Groaned at 175 Times in 122 Posts
Thanked 4,947 Times in 1,902 Posts
Mikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Top end of IT market - my experience of London vs Zurich

Quote:
View Post
Hello Everybody,

I am employed in London by a large IT consultancy and I have been offered the opportunity to relocate to Zurich.
I work as lead architect in the BPM and Enterprise Architecture space and have a package of around £ 110k (base + car allowance + pension).
I don't speak german, although I am keen of learning it should I move.
After a fair amount of research (a lot of it in this forum!) it seems to me that to have an equivalent purchasing power in Zurich it would make sense to ask for CHF 220k.
On the other hand my company has made it clear that they could not offer any more than 170-180K.
I would love to live in Switzerland, however I am starting to think that there might be less opportunities on the top end the market, maybe because of the fact that the market is much smaller than in the UK.
Also, I wonder how much my limited knwoledge of German would hinder future carreer developments...
Do you think this is a fair assessment? Or have I just made wrong assumptions in "transalting" my salary?

Thanks!!
Still quite a lot of big business here, Nestlé, pmi, private banking arm of lots of large banks. Language won't be a problem as in large corps the language is English anyway. 180k is good but it's not that high at the upper end so I think you could negotiate a bit more, if 110 is your base in England then cash wise you would keep more disposable there, if its your package figure then maybe not. But as was said if your 40 now and a good IT engineer then you should have enough money by now so consider if your primary enjoyment is achieving a high salary, working on complex it systems or going into the mountains or going to the theatre all the normal stuff you weigh up before making this on d of decision.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 29.11.2012, 07:10
Wallabies's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Winterthur
Posts: 3,219
Groaned at 311 Times in 176 Posts
Thanked 3,314 Times in 1,577 Posts
Wallabies has a reputation beyond reputeWallabies has a reputation beyond reputeWallabies has a reputation beyond reputeWallabies has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Top end of IT market - my experience of London vs Zurich

That salary is fine for a family of 4
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Wallabies for this useful post:
  #26  
Old 29.11.2012, 07:26
Wallabies's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Winterthur
Posts: 3,219
Groaned at 311 Times in 176 Posts
Thanked 3,314 Times in 1,577 Posts
Wallabies has a reputation beyond reputeWallabies has a reputation beyond reputeWallabies has a reputation beyond reputeWallabies has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Top end of IT market - my experience of London vs Zurich

Quote:
View Post
@OP
GBP110 to CHF180, is a drop in disposable income you will notice, let me assure you.
CHF180 is not a great salary if you have been earning GBP110 (even living in London)

Zurich is expensive, the most expensive place in the world, London is 20th.



PM if you like.
Zurich most expensive city in world BS try scandanvia or even most Australian cities challenge Zurich on costs. There is also plenty of chamce to take an apartment outside the main city area and then the cost is ok. Compare to england yes its quite a bit more expensive but compared gloabally to some benchmark cities its not.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 29.11.2012, 08:07
FriendlyKiwi's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Shoppinzentrum
Posts: 1,782
Groaned at 19 Times in 15 Posts
Thanked 914 Times in 551 Posts
FriendlyKiwi has a reputation beyond reputeFriendlyKiwi has a reputation beyond reputeFriendlyKiwi has a reputation beyond reputeFriendlyKiwi has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Top end of IT market - my experience of London vs Zurich

At 180k income you will pay around the following taxes:

Zürich Tax around 2200 / month (paid yearly)
Social contributions 5.15% or 772.50 (deducted monthly)
Loss of employment insurance 1.10% or 165 (deducted monthly)
Health Insurance around 800 / month for 2 people (paid monthly)
These add to 3937 or 26.25% of your monthly pay

From a 15k month package that makes takehome pay about 11k a month (actually higher because at that salary level you must lodge an annual tax return, there is no PAYE here)

You can live modestly on 6k a month (including rent, food, power, internet, putting something aside for ski holidays), which leaves you with 5k a month (60k a year) disposable income for saving, retirement plans, etc

So the salary is an excellent salary and can easily fund a nice lifestyle in this wonderful country.

You should consider the offer an opportunity not to be missed.
All large corporates have English as corporate language and you can easily survive here on English only.


If you believe what people say with 50% tax in the UK then the 110k GBP (164k CHF) results in the following available monthly income:
GB: 110k GBP = 164k CHF = 13.6k monthly less 50% tax = 6.8k available monthly income for living
CH: 180k CHF = 15k monthly less 26.25% tax = 11k available monthly income for living
__________________
Warning: may contain traces of nuts.

Last edited by FriendlyKiwi; 29.11.2012 at 08:29. Reason: improved mathematics :)
Reply With Quote
The following 6 users would like to thank FriendlyKiwi for this useful post:
  #28  
Old 29.11.2012, 08:27
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Vaud
Posts: 2,459
Groaned at 175 Times in 122 Posts
Thanked 4,947 Times in 1,902 Posts
Mikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Top end of IT market - my experience of London vs Zurich

Quote:
View Post
Zurich most expensive city in world BS try scandanvia or even most Australian cities challenge Zurich on costs. There is also plenty of chamce to take an apartment outside the main city area and then the cost is ok. Compare to england yes its quite a bit more expensive but compared gloabally to some benchmark cities its not.
Luanda in Angola is the most expensive city to live in in the world.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 29.11.2012, 11:06
adrianlondon's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Basel
Posts: 9,131
Groaned at 170 Times in 153 Posts
Thanked 25,643 Times in 6,892 Posts
adrianlondon has a reputation beyond reputeadrianlondon has a reputation beyond reputeadrianlondon has a reputation beyond reputeadrianlondon has a reputation beyond reputeadrianlondon has a reputation beyond reputeadrianlondon has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Top end of IT market - my experience of London vs Zurich

Quote:
View Post
that is what I like...pioneering...not like these pommie whingers....who always complain.....these guys are just too much fun.....worked with many of them ....nice guys/gals really.......but only happy when they are complaining...guess that is just thier nature
All you've posted to this thread are a bunch of bitter, depressed whinges. Sorry your life is a mess and didn't work out, but that's no reason to put others off moving to Switzerland (which even you should realise has less Brits than the UK anyway).
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank adrianlondon for this useful post:
  #30  
Old 29.11.2012, 16:20
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Zurich
Posts: 482
Groaned at 1 Time in 1 Post
Thanked 267 Times in 168 Posts
gourmet is considered knowledgeablegourmet is considered knowledgeablegourmet is considered knowledgeable
Re: Top end of IT market - my experience of London vs Zurich

Quote:
View Post
At 180k income you will pay around the following taxes:

Zürich Tax around 2200 / month (paid yearly)
Social contributions 5.15% or 772.50 (deducted monthly)
Loss of employment insurance 1.10% or 165 (deducted monthly)
Health Insurance around 800 / month for 2 people (paid monthly)
These add to 3937 or 26.25% of your monthly pay

From a 15k month package that makes takehome pay about 11k a month (actually higher because at that salary level you must lodge an annual tax return, there is no PAYE here)

You can live modestly on 6k a month (including rent, food, power, internet, putting something aside for ski holidays), which leaves you with 5k a month (60k a year) disposable income for saving, retirement plans, etc

So the salary is an excellent salary and can easily fund a nice lifestyle in this wonderful country.

You should consider the offer an opportunity not to be missed.
All large corporates have English as corporate language and you can easily survive here on English only.


If you believe what people say with 50% tax in the UK then the 110k GBP (164k CHF) results in the following available monthly income:
GB: 110k GBP = 164k CHF = 13.6k monthly less 50% tax = 6.8k available monthly income for living
CH: 180k CHF = 15k monthly less 26.25% tax = 11k available monthly income for living
this is roughly correct but you have forgotten the NI charge in the UK which at that salary is roughly around 10% (off the top of my head). Also in CH, it is a wealth tax system, so if you have properties; then your asset (including cars etc) will be taxed on their value as well. You will have to take that into account, it is not as straight forward as PAYE as in UK.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank gourmet for this useful post:
  #31  
Old 29.11.2012, 16:24
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
No capital gains tax here, important for people earning lots of money!
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank fatmanfilms for this useful post:
  #32  
Old 29.11.2012, 18:04
symphara's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: omw to Zurich via California
Posts: 119
Groaned at 10 Times in 7 Posts
Thanked 150 Times in 54 Posts
symphara has earned the respect of manysymphara has earned the respect of manysymphara has earned the respect of many
Re: Top end of IT market - my experience of London vs Zurich

Quote:
View Post
If you believe what people say with 50% tax in the UK then the 110k GBP (164k CHF) results in the following available monthly income:
GB: 110k GBP = 164k CHF = 13.6k monthly less 50% tax = 6.8k available monthly income for living
CH: 180k CHF = 15k monthly less 26.25% tax = 11k available monthly income for living
There are plenty of tax calculators on the net. I think that an annual 110k GBP gives 5700 GBP a month net pay (assuming a tax code of 747L, which is the 'normal' 2011-2012 code). So this is about 8500CHF a month.

Also it should be noted that pension (*) is NOT included in the normal taxes in the UK, plus if you want any quality services you have to pay for private health insurance and private schooling for your children too, out of taxed income, for which you receive no tax credits. (*) State pension is included but that is a negligible amount for private sector employees.

I'm not entirely sure that rents are more expensive in Zurich. London's nice areas are very expensive. Sure enough, if you want to live in a 30sqm flat in Forest Hill you'll get by cheaply, but a nice 100+sqm in a nice area will be a lot of money, easily the equivalent of 3k+ CHF.

I'd personally take the deal, move to Zug and commute
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 29.11.2012, 18:24
poptart's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Boston
Posts: 1,785
Groaned at 33 Times in 28 Posts
Thanked 3,013 Times in 1,242 Posts
poptart has a reputation beyond reputepoptart has a reputation beyond reputepoptart has a reputation beyond reputepoptart has a reputation beyond reputepoptart has a reputation beyond reputepoptart has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Top end of IT market - my experience of London vs Zurich

Quote:
View Post
If you believe what people say with 50% tax in the UK then the 110k GBP (164k CHF) results in the following available monthly income:
GB: 110k GBP = 164k CHF = 13.6k monthly less 50% tax = 6.8k available monthly income for living
CH: 180k CHF = 15k monthly less 26.25% tax = 11k available monthly income for living
Well, it's about 12k net (at 180k chf) but, you forget two things.... cost of living is significantly higher AND the likelihood of his wife finding a job, particularly without German if she is not in certain high-demand areas like biotech, IT, etc., is minimal at best, so you have to calculate the loss of that income as well.

I always wondered how much some spouses made as there were women with three kids, all in private (22k+ per year) school driving new rovers and wearing fur coats. Making 12k per month minus rent, healthcare ins., tuition, and food doesn't really leave a lot for new rovers or fur coats. Heck, I could barely bring myself to pay the 70-90 CHF for a decent slice of beef. And I think we ate out 10 times in the year we were there, maximum, and none of them were in the 'fancy' category since the run of the mill was expensive enough.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank poptart for this useful post:
  #34  
Old 29.11.2012, 18:48
eng_ch's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Up where the air is clear
Posts: 1,767
Groaned at 4 Times in 4 Posts
Thanked 1,786 Times in 904 Posts
eng_ch has a reputation beyond reputeeng_ch has a reputation beyond reputeeng_ch has a reputation beyond reputeeng_ch has a reputation beyond reputeeng_ch has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Top end of IT market - my experience of London vs Zurich

TBH it's a problem I (and I'm sure many others) would like to have. I'm just saying...
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank eng_ch for this useful post:
  #35  
Old 29.11.2012, 19:04
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Top end of IT market - my experience of London vs Zurich

Quote:
View Post
Well, it's about 12k net (at 180k chf) but, you forget two things.... cost of living is significantly higher AND the likelihood of his wife finding a job, particularly without German if she is not in certain high-demand areas like biotech, IT, etc., is minimal at best, so you have to calculate the loss of that income as well.

I always wondered how much some spouses made as there were women with three kids, all in private (22k+ per year) school driving new rovers and wearing fur coats. Making 12k per month minus rent, healthcare ins., tuition, and food doesn't really leave a lot for new rovers or fur coats. Heck, I could barely bring myself to pay the 70-90 CHF for a decent slice of beef. And I think we ate out 10 times in the year we were there, maximum, and none of them were in the 'fancy' category since the run of the mill was expensive enough.
I think rent in Central London Zone 1 will be way higher than ZH.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank fatmanfilms for this useful post:
  #36  
Old 29.11.2012, 19:55
poptart's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Boston
Posts: 1,785
Groaned at 33 Times in 28 Posts
Thanked 3,013 Times in 1,242 Posts
poptart has a reputation beyond reputepoptart has a reputation beyond reputepoptart has a reputation beyond reputepoptart has a reputation beyond reputepoptart has a reputation beyond reputepoptart has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Top end of IT market - my experience of London vs Zurich

Quote:
View Post
I think rent in Central London Zone 1 will be way higher than ZH.
Well, at 110k quid, he doesn't live in zone 1 so I guess that's not so much a loss.
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 29.11.2012, 19:57
Phil_MCR's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Basel
Posts: 14,750
Groaned at 284 Times in 189 Posts
Thanked 18,639 Times in 7,827 Posts
Phil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Top end of IT market - my experience of London vs Zurich

Quote:
View Post
At 180k income you will pay around the following taxes:

Zürich Tax around 2200 / month (paid yearly)
Social contributions 5.15% or 772.50 (deducted monthly)
Loss of employment insurance 1.10% or 165 (deducted monthly)
Health Insurance around 800 / month for 2 people (paid monthly)
These add to 3937 or 26.25% of your monthly pay

From a 15k month package that makes takehome pay about 11k a month (actually higher because at that salary level you must lodge an annual tax return, there is no PAYE here)

You can live modestly on 6k a month (including rent, food, power, internet, putting something aside for ski holidays), which leaves you with 5k a month (60k a year) disposable income for saving, retirement plans, etc

So the salary is an excellent salary and can easily fund a nice lifestyle in this wonderful country.

You should consider the offer an opportunity not to be missed.
All large corporates have English as corporate language and you can easily survive here on English only.


If you believe what people say with 50% tax in the UK then the 110k GBP (164k CHF) results in the following available monthly income:
GB: 110k GBP = 164k CHF = 13.6k monthly less 50% tax = 6.8k available monthly income for living
CH: 180k CHF = 15k monthly less 26.25% tax = 11k available monthly income for living
50% is about the marginal rate of tax. actual effective rate will probably be around 38%.
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 29.11.2012, 20:01
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Top end of IT market - my experience of London vs Zurich

Quote:
View Post
Well, at 110k quid, he doesn't live in zone 1 so I guess that's not so much a loss.
I lived in zone 1 for the 10 years before I came here, not sure how you can make that assumption.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank fatmanfilms for this useful post:
  #39  
Old 29.11.2012, 20:04
Phil_MCR's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Basel
Posts: 14,750
Groaned at 284 Times in 189 Posts
Thanked 18,639 Times in 7,827 Posts
Phil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Top end of IT market - my experience of London vs Zurich

Quote:
View Post
Well, it's about 12k net (at 180k chf) but, you forget two things.... cost of living is significantly higher AND the likelihood of his wife finding a job, particularly without German if she is not in certain high-demand areas like biotech, IT, etc., is minimal at best, so you have to calculate the loss of that income as well.

I always wondered how much some spouses made as there were women with three kids, all in private (22k+ per year) school driving new rovers and wearing fur coats. Making 12k per month minus rent, healthcare ins., tuition, and food doesn't really leave a lot for new rovers or fur coats. Heck, I could barely bring myself to pay the 70-90 CHF for a decent slice of beef. And I think we ate out 10 times in the year we were there, maximum, and none of them were in the 'fancy' category since the run of the mill was expensive enough.
well, when moving here, there's probably quite a high chance of divorce, so there could be some savings on the spouse front...

live in pfaffikon and then pay only 30k in taxes.
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank Phil_MCR for this useful post:
  #40  
Old 29.11.2012, 20:05
Phil_MCR's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Basel
Posts: 14,750
Groaned at 284 Times in 189 Posts
Thanked 18,639 Times in 7,827 Posts
Phil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Top end of IT market - my experience of London vs Zurich

Quote:
View Post
I lived in zone 1 for the 10 years before I came here, not sure how you can make that assumption.
agreed. you can get all kinds of places in zone 1. from dirt cheap dive, to billionaire's pad.
Reply With Quote
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Switzerland to benefit from the end of London? Phil_MCR Finance/banking/taxation 3 04.11.2011 14:35
Road Rage, just had my first swiss experience of it :) bigblue2 Complaints corner 53 14.09.2011 09:52


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 01:25.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0