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  #21  
Old 22.02.2017, 09:14
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Re: [Zurich] Mobbing and bullying at a workplace

if you are fired for whatever reason justifierd or not, what do you do about recommandation letter for your next job ?
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  #22  
Old 22.02.2017, 10:34
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Re: [Zurich] Mobbing and bullying at a workplace

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if you are fired for whatever reason justifierd or not, what do you do about recommandation letter for your next job ?
You ask for one and you will get one. Because the employer HAS to make one for you, not matter how shitty your performance was. He even has to write it in a positive way, again no matter how bad you fell out with them...

This is in essence why I and many other managers who hire people completely ignore reference letters. They are full of positive phrases anyways... if you want a reference do you need to call the former employer and have a chat...
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Old 22.02.2017, 11:01
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Re: [Zurich] Mobbing and bullying at a workplace

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Sure, I agree.
It was important for me to post this information, as former EF threads hinted that getting fired is very rare and only extreme cases, such as criminal behavior may trigger it.
So the "news" is: Getting fired in Switzerland is quite common, and no particular reasoning is required.
"Being terminated" is as common here as it is elsewhere. The only difference being that there needs to be no reason for a termination as long as the notice period is being kept (even if that is a garden leave).

But your previous statement that "termination with immediate effect" is common and can be due to mundane reasons is not correct.

The two are not the same.

Complaining about a manager is not enough to justify immediate termination of course. Regular termination - sure, but as said, no reason necessary anyway so your manager might as well decide he doesn't like your haircut and let you go because of that
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Old 22.02.2017, 11:04
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Re: [Zurich] Mobbing and bullying at a workplace

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But your previous statement that "termination with immediate effect" is common and can be due to mundane reasons is not correct.
Where did he state that?

Tom
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Old 22.02.2017, 11:40
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Re: [Zurich] Mobbing and bullying at a workplace

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You ask for one and you will get one. Because the employer HAS to make one for you, not matter how shitty your performance was. He even has to write it in a positive way, again no matter how bad you fell out with them...

This is in essence why I and many other managers who hire people completely ignore reference letters. They are full of positive phrases anyways... if you want a reference do you need to call the former employer and have a chat...
Don't forget the secret code phrases and reading between the lines!
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Old 22.02.2017, 12:23
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Re: [Zurich] Mobbing and bullying at a workplace

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where did he state that?

Tom
#11
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Old 22.02.2017, 12:35
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Re: [Zurich] Mobbing and bullying at a workplace

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Don't forget the secret code phrases and reading between the lines!
I think the "code" is a thing of the past... its embarrassing for everyone, so no normal HR person under the age of 60 would still do this. But reading between the lines is important. If I have nothing good to say about a person but am legally forced to make a positive reference letter... well, you'll positively highlight stuff that should not be worth mentioning. As in "he was really good at arriving on time to meetings"...
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Old 23.02.2017, 22:08
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Re: [Zurich] Mobbing and bullying at a workplace

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I think the "code" is a thing of the past... its embarrassing for everyone, so no normal HR person under the age of 60 would still do this. But reading between the lines is important. If I have nothing good to say about a person but am legally forced to make a positive reference letter... well, you'll positively highlight stuff that should not be worth mentioning. As in "he was really good at arriving on time to meetings"...
Perhaps it should be a thing of the past, but nevertheless someone I know received an interim evaluation recently, and he/she sat down and decrypted it using the proper reference.
He/she was delighted that it was fully coded, and yet in a good way.
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  #29  
Old 23.02.2017, 23:33
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Re: [Zurich] Mobbing and bullying at a workplace

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Perhaps it should be a thing of the past, but nevertheless someone I know received an interim evaluation recently, and he/she sat down and decrypted it using the proper reference.
He/she was delighted that it was fully coded, and yet in a good way.
The good stuff is usually not coded - but just plain German. LOL
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Old 23.02.2017, 23:55
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Re: [Zurich] Mobbing and bullying at a workplace

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The good stuff is usually not coded - but just plain German. LOL
Just a short example. "has carried out his duties to our satisfaction" is a positive-sounding sentence maybe, but the meaning in not positive at all, this is a mediocre rating.
It should be (I'm making this up, this is not a reference guide):
"has carried out all of his duties and has undertaken even further responsibilities to our fullest satisfaction, delight, admiration and joy. We would be happy to see the employee come back in the future".

That should indicate a relatively good performance.

Last edited by oferet; 24.02.2017 at 00:09.
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Old 24.02.2017, 00:08
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Re: [Zurich] Mobbing and bullying at a workplace

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Just a short example. "has carried out his duties to our satisfaction" is a positive-sounding sentence to you maybe, but the meaning in not positive at all, this is a mediocre rating.
It should be (I'm making this up, this is not a reference guide):
"has carried out all of his duties and has undertaken even further responsibilities to our fullest satisfaction, delight, admiration and joy. We would be happy to see the employee come back in the future".

That should indicate a relatively good performance.
Thanks. LOL. I know all the codes. "has undertaken even further responsibilities" would not necessarily be good .... depending on the context.
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