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Old 20.04.2017, 13:13
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RAV : change RAV Berater? advice please

I've been assigned a new RAV Berater and I felt really bad after our meeting, he's a real old school guy. He's now forcing me to go to this place called Atelier 93, which is basically doing any kind of time wating basic work for next 3 months 100% of the time.

Question is can I request to have a different RAV Berater and what are possible implications (sanctions) if it doesn't go my way?

I really do not want to go the next 3 months to this place! I would much rather go to Intendise German course. Even if I have to pay mayself level C1 because my writing needs some help still.

Any good advice appreciated
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Old 20.04.2017, 13:16
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Re: RAV : change RAV Berater? advice please

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I've been assigned a new RAV Berater and I felt really bad after our meeting, he's a real old school guy. He's now forcing me to go to this place called Atelier 93, which is basically doing any kind of time wating basic work for next 3 months 100% of the time.

Question is can I request to have a different RAV Berater and what are possible implications (sanctions) if it doesn't go my way?

I really do not want to go the next 3 months to this place! I would much rather go to Intendise German course. Even if I have to pay mayself level C1 because my writing needs some help still.

Any good advice appreciated
AFAIK you cannot change your Berater. Bad luck, friend of mine once also had a nightmarish person.... Just do what he says, bite your teeth and apply for jobs! That will make him happy.

And going to a course might be difficult as you need to be available to work, doing a course means you are not. Unless of course they have approved the course.

Good luck!
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Old 20.04.2017, 13:38
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Re: RAV : change RAV Berater? advice please

It is possible to apply to change RAV advisers. See this RAV link:

http://www.treffpunkt-arbeit.ch/serv...takt_help1/h6/
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Old 20.04.2017, 13:40
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Re: RAV : change RAV Berater? advice please

My advice would be to to use those 3 months of the forced assignment to learn as much German as you can. Convert that time in to your own practical German course.

Learn vocab on the journey to the assignment and back., every day.

There, you will be assigned to some sort of manager and/or assessor. Make it known to him/her that you want to work hard at anything that will improve your German.

If you have a choice, opt for tasks there which involve reading, writing and speaking, German rather than only working with your hands.

If you are assigned Manual work, then talk to all your colleagues in German, as far as possible refusing to speak English (even when someone would like you to help them brush up theirs), ask your boss lots of questions, and insist on writing the instructions down, in German, in your little notebook. Do the same in the lunch canteen.

With determination, you may surprise yourself at how much progress you can make in 3 months. All the best!
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Old 20.04.2017, 13:41
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Re: RAV : change RAV Berater? advice please

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It is possible to apply to change RAV advisers. See this RAV link:

http://www.treffpunkt-arbeit.ch/serv...takt_help1/h6/
Good to know, thanks. That looks quite severe though and not: I want to do a course and my RAV adviser doesn´t allow it - type of thing
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Old 20.04.2017, 13:50
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Re: RAV : change RAV Berater? advice please

I doubt RAV is going to pay you to get your language skills up to C1. If A2/B1 is good enough to get Swiss citizenship then it's good enough for you to get a new job. That's the way they'll see it I believe.

Use your time in the evenings to improve your language skills on top of any chances you get at this workplace. Use Duo Lingo or something similar to help you improve up to the next level.
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Old 20.04.2017, 14:38
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Re: RAV : change RAV Berater? advice please

Hello thanks for your input. I didn't mean that I would ask the RAV to pay the C1 German course, sorry if it came of sounding that way. I meant that I would pay the course myself if they would approve that I could go to it. Then I would not have to go to the other 3 month RAV job.

Thank you to each of you for your inputs. I do not know how to individually say' thanks' on each post. I looked for a link or button but fail to see any.

Still not sure what I will do next...







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My advice would be to to use those 3 months of the forced assignment to learn as much German as you can. Convert that time in to your own practical German course.

Learn vocab on the journey to the assignment and back., every day.

There, you will be assigned to some sort of manager and/or assessor. Make it known to him/her that you want to work hard at anything that will improve your German.

If you have a choice, opt for tasks there which involve reading, writing and speaking, German rather than only working with your hands.

If you are assigned Manual work, then talk to all your colleagues in German, as far as possible refusing to speak English (even when someone would like you to help them brush up theirs), ask your boss lots of questions, and insist on writing the instructions down, in German, in your little notebook. Do the same in the lunch canteen.

With determination, you may surprise yourself at how much progress you can make in 3 months. All the best!
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Old 20.04.2017, 14:46
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Re: RAV : change RAV Berater? advice please

Dont fully understand the problem. Looking at their webpage it looks like they put a lot of focus on the language part. Looks like a good plan to me...
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Old 20.04.2017, 15:27
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Re: RAV : change RAV Berater? advice please

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AFAIK you cannot change your Berater. Bad luck, friend of mine once also had a nightmarish person.... Just do what he says, bite your teeth and apply for jobs! That will make him happy.

And going to a course might be difficult as you need to be available to work, doing a course means you are not. Unless of course they have approved the course.

Good luck!
I did after complaining, then the next one lied to me trying to cover for the 1st one, who then resigned when I pointed this out to her boss who then took me on. I had about 8 after that some good some bad, a couple wanted to practice their English so positively looked forward to our meetings.
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Old 20.04.2017, 15:32
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Re: RAV : change RAV Berater? advice please

thank you for your concern and your input.

The problem to me seems as follows. Looking at their webpage I also have impression they offer language courses, but at the initial meeting today with the person in charge I was informed that I would be expected to be working as an assistant of some sort to help other people there with basic computer skill issues.
Or driving a car around to pick up old clothes.


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Dont fully understand the problem. Looking at their webpage it looks like they put a lot of focus on the language part. Looks like a good plan to me...
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Old 20.04.2017, 15:35
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Re: RAV : change RAV Berater? advice please

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I did after complaining, then the next one lied to me trying to cover for the 1st one, who then resigned when I pointed this out to her boss who then took me on. I had about 8 after that some good some bad, a couple wanted to practice their English so positively looked forward to our meetings.
This is at least my 5th since 14 months. I also had some very friendly ones one of which also wanted to practice her english and talk about New York trips.

I have yet to complain, this is first time I really think about doing it but want to proceed with caution because new territory for me.
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Old 20.04.2017, 15:42
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Re: RAV : change RAV Berater? advice please

Putting focus on language doesnt mean a language course though. Training others on computers seems like an excellent opportunity to learn and practice German.

Quite frankly, if you have been unemployed 14 months there shoulfdhave been enough time to study German from a text book. So makes perfect sense to now get out there and learn it through immersion.

Give it a chance!

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thank you for your concern and your input.

The problem to me seems as follows. Looking at their webpage I also have impression they offer language courses, but at the initial meeting today with the person in charge I was informed that I would be expected to be working as an assistant of some sort to help other people there with basic computer skill issues.
Or driving a car around to pick up old clothes.
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Old 20.04.2017, 15:47
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Re: RAV : change RAV Berater? advice please

Thank you again.

I was 5 Months in Intensive German Course last year and I speak it on a daily basis. Problem is that my writing and speaking is pretty good but far from perfect and while I have no problems to help others, I still fail to see how I will benefit from speaking German with other Non native German speakers who can't correct my mistakes and moreover I will probably pick up some of their mistakes. In my line of work, 'Pretty Good German' aint really good enough
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Old 20.04.2017, 16:13
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Re: RAV : change RAV Berater? advice please

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This is at least my 5th since 14 months. I also had some very friendly ones one of which also wanted to practice her english and talk about New York trips.

I have yet to complain, this is first time I really think about doing it but want to proceed with caution because new territory for me.
How much work have you done in the last 14 months? If none your benefits will run out in 4 months & you can see why the RAV are now expecting you to do something.
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Old 20.04.2017, 16:19
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Re: RAV : change RAV Berater? advice please

I agree with folks saying you should take it. I actually see that as a networking opportunity, refusing might be seen as uncooperative. Try it and if it is a disaster, contact your RAV couch with some more concrete arguments, in writing. Flat out refusing before you try might be unwise for you. I know people who did this 3mo stint and then got offered a job by the exact agency who took them in for three months as a trial.
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Old 20.04.2017, 16:34
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Re: RAV : change RAV Berater? advice please

Every two months, my RAV advisor just asks me how I'm feeling, suggests I take some of my "don't need to be available for work" days and then wishes me good luck. To be honest, I'd find it interesting if he allocated me some random weird job for a few weeks.
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Old 20.04.2017, 18:29
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Re: RAV : change RAV Berater? advice please

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Every two months, my RAV advisor just asks me how I'm feeling, suggests I take some of my "don't need to be available for work" days and then wishes me good luck. To be honest, I'd find it interesting if he allocated me some random weird job for a few weeks.
They used to have AEP's (Arbeits-Einsatz-Programm). For me it was a way to get my nose into branches I would never get into even with my wild CV. (Over qualified hada hada ...). I did one, it's a six month thing and it was really interesting.
They probably still got this? That was before RAV, when communities had their own consultants.
They don't seem to offer them to everybody, my advisor was really embarrassed when he did and all surprised when I said "groovy, temporary job, love it". It also prolonged the draw time of dole. Ask for it?

Last edited by curley; 20.04.2017 at 23:25. Reason: typo
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Old 20.04.2017, 18:33
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Re: RAV : change RAV Berater? advice please

That (what Curley said) and it is a way to get some recent work experience into your CV.
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Old 20.04.2017, 23:23
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Re: RAV : change RAV Berater? advice please

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Thank you again.

I was 5 Months in Intensive German Course last year and I speak it on a daily basis. Problem is that my writing and speaking is pretty good but far from perfect and while I have no problems to help others, I still fail to see how I will benefit from speaking German with other Non native German speakers who can't correct my mistakes and moreover I will probably pick up some of their mistakes. In my line of work, 'Pretty Good German' aint really good enough
Good on you that you do speak German on a daily basis.

The trick with such a programme (or, indeed, any group at all) is to identify who, there, does speak reasonable German. It is likely that there will be at least one German from Germany, or one Swiss person of Swiss German mother tongue.

By all means speak the German you can to the other non-native speakers, but keep writing everything down and then take your notebook over to those mother-tongue German speakers and asking them to correct your errors.
Write and re-write what they teach you.

Build a repertoire of really good, solid phrases and sentences.

As you do your teaching/explaining, keep telling your pupils that you are going to risk doing so a bit more slowly than you could in your mother-tongue, because you want to consult your notebook, so as to be sure you speak out the sentences correctly. It is unlikely that anyone would object to that.

If you are sent out to collect old clothes, insist on first writing down all the instructions in your book, plus all the phrases you'll need to deal with people en route, and insist that your notes get corrected before you leave, so that you can practice saying them, over and over, while you're out driving.

You may not naturally be a note-book kind of person, and my suggestion may sound tedious, but my point is that you can, by your own determination, influence the focus of this 3-month assignment, at least to some extent.
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Old 21.04.2017, 08:59
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Re: RAV : change RAV Berater? advice please

Hmm! Memories of Little miss Cutesweet at the RAV in Basel and the playmate of the month mosh-pit in Widnau´s RAV.

You just got unlucky OP.
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