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Old 13.05.2017, 01:16
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Fired. What's my situation in Switzerland

Hi there! I lost my job some time ago and I don't have new job in line up. I have read useful threads here but not all my questions are answered.
For example, this one is full of information regarding unemployment benefits:
https://www.englishforum.ch/employme...t-payable.html

My story was similar to: https://www.englishforum.ch/employme...signation.html

I have worked a few years here for one company but I got into disagreement with my boss. At some point the expectations bar was raised very high, beyond possibility and I found it very hard to manage the situation. The company started to hire more and more specialists of making the work more efficient: agile specialists, etc. Of course none of these efforts helped but introduced more disturbance, delays and micromanagement-like culture. Recently, my boss demonstrated understanding and we started a prompt process of hiring new people to the team. I was pressed to make it happen, in the end I agreed to hire 'anyone' even though I was not happy as I knew it would require effort to teach them a lot before they will become productive. Once we sent the offers, I was called by my boss to learn that I am fired because he is not happy with me - that's all. That was very harsh, no prior discussion about that nor any chance to walk it over peacefully. My boss just made the decision and deliberately 'used me' to proactively fill the gap which will happen after my leave...

I'm sharing that to let know anyone what is possible to happen in CH. I doubt it is possible in any other EU country.

My questions in this situation:
1. Do I really have to give the notice to leave my apartment according to the swiss rules If I decide to leave the country? You know, 3 months ahead at the end of every quarter except December.
2. The fact that I was fired, is it any problem for other employers here in Switzerland? I didn't managed to get yet into any final interview to find it out but I didn't state in my applications that I am on notice period/left the job already.


Next month my unemployment begins. At this point I will start looking for a new job world wide, so far I was focused only on Switzerland, preferring the canton of my residence. Future is unknown but I am sure I will find a good new job within half a year at max if I start looking worldwide again. In Switzerland it may take a lot longer I know that I have the right to stay here for the next 18 months and claim unemployment benefits which will be quite huge in my case, same as I can get as a salary in other EU countries typically but staying on unemployment would be depressing - it is a bit already.

Another point of slight stress it the possible delay before I could start receiving unemployment benefits. I have quite expensive apartment here. With the money put here for a 3 months rent I could rent an apartment in Barcelona for a whole year!
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Old 13.05.2017, 02:06
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Re: Fired. What's my situation in Switzerland

I doubt it is possible in any other EU country.

Yes it is.

1. Do I really have to give the notice to leave my apartment according to the swiss rules If I decide to leave the country? You know, 3 months ahead at the end of every quarter except December.

Yes of course, why do you think you would be exempt from that? Leaving the country would be your decision and any landlord couldn't care less. However, check what is stipulated in your contract as many these days allow notice to be given by the end of any month. Alternatively, find a replacement tenant and you can go whenever you want. If you have a semi-decent apartment that doesn't cost an arm and a leg, you will find one, esp. in Geneva (similar situation as in Zurich)

2. The fact that I was fired, is it any problem for other employers here in Switzerland? I didn't managed to get yet into any final interview to find it out but I didn't state in my applications that I am on notice period/left the job already.

No. You weren't fired with immediate effect because you messed up significantly. Being terminated is quite standard and happens to pretty much everyone at some point in their lives. Don't lie about the fact that you were terminated, though, it's easy for a potential employer to find out the truth.

Another point of slight stress it the possible delay before I could start receiving unemployment benefits. I have quite expensive apartment here. With the money put here for a 3 months rent I could rent an apartment in Barcelona for a whole year!

I'm assuming you wouldn't earn the same salary in Barcelona as you do here though.

Since you were terminated, you face a very small number of waiting days. Unless of course you used to earn a lot of money (I think 125k is the cut-off), then that waiting period is longer (20 days). Simply cause it's assumed that in that case, you have some savings.

Did you register with RAV immediately after you were given notice? I read you did not as you say you will "start looking for jobs next month". That's not how it works though, you need to register as soon as you know you will lose your job and start applying during the notice period as well, otherwise you may be "punished" for a certain number of days (how many depends on personal circumstances) during which you will not receive any unemployment benefits.


Fingers crossed you find a new job soon!
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Old 13.05.2017, 10:52
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Re: Fired. What's my situation in Switzerland

Unless you've been looking for jobs since the day you were received notice, expect about 5 days per month delay in addition to the 20 days, so if you only start looking on the day uou actually stop working, expect around 35 days delay.

Tom
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Old 13.05.2017, 11:03
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Re: Fired. What's my situation in Switzerland

Do your best to get a decent letter of reference. There are laws protecting you regarding the content. The unemployment office can help you on this one.
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Old 13.05.2017, 11:11
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Re: Fired. What's my situation in Switzerland

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Do your best to get a decent letter of reference. There are laws protecting you regarding the content. The unemployment office can help you on this one.

A little depends on the reason the company fired her, there is usually 2 sides to a story.....

If it was for gross misconduct, in the eyes of the company then the letter of reference will be very brief

As she has been with the company for "several years" their may a be a little more to hear about the reasons for firing.
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Old 13.05.2017, 12:50
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Re: Fired. What's my situation in Switzerland

OK, thank all of you so much! Now I know everything I need.

I can see that I will have to dance a bit about accepting a new offer abroad because most certainly it will be paid much less so keeping the swiss rent even for a short time would be a nightmare.

Is there more to the story? Not really. I have started work here in a small company. Then ca three years ago the company was acquired. My salary doubled and everyone was happy. Things started to slowly change. My relationship with the senior management, once very close, become more and more formal. You know, the corporate pressure was coming top down. I received more and more demand up to the point that it really reached the possibility. I had no options but to 'push' back and then the friction was growing between the top and me through my boss. I guess that in some future the team will be moved to the northern UK where the mother company is located now. It's politics Recently the situation was uneasy for me, for my boss and many other people around.

One more question:
What does it mean 'immediate termination'? It happened to me immediately... I just received the letter given to me personally by my boss. The letter states merely the fact that the reason of the dismissal was presented to me verbally and follows with the formalities when my contract will end precisely, etc. I was released from doing my work during the notice period and I have obligation to inform the employer if I start another job during the notice period, which did not happened obviously.
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Old 13.05.2017, 13:20
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Re: Fired. What's my situation in Switzerland

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Did you register with RAV immediately after you were given notice? I read you did not as you say you will "start looking for jobs next month". That's not how it works though, you need to register as soon as you know you will lose your job and start applying during the notice period as well, otherwise you may be "punished" for a certain number of days (how many depends on personal circumstances) during which you will not receive any unemployment benefits.
This is what the OP stated:

Quote:
Next month my unemployment begins. At this point I will start looking for a new job world wide, so far I was focused only on Switzerland, preferring the canton of my residence.
So one can infer OP already started looking - and presumably has to produce evidence of this at the RAV.

Cheers,
Nick
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Old 13.05.2017, 13:38
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Re: Fired. What's my situation in Switzerland

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What does it mean 'immediate termination'? It happened to me immediately... I just received the letter given to me personally by my boss. The letter states merely the fact that the reason of the dismissal was presented to me verbally and follows with the formalities when my contract will end precisely, etc. I was released from doing my work during the notice period and I have obligation to inform the employer if I start another job during the notice period, which did not happened obviously.
Immediate = pack your bags and go with no notice period or any form of pay. Only allowed under severe circumstances.

You were terminated with regular notice period, but simply put on garden leave. Perfectly legal and allowed any time.
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Old 13.05.2017, 13:46
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Re: Fired. What's my situation in Switzerland

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OK, thank all of you so much! Now I know everything I need.

I can see that I will have to dance a bit about accepting a new offer abroad because most certainly it will be paid much less so keeping the swiss rent even for a short time would be a nightmare.

Is there more to the story? Not really. I have started work here in a small company. Then ca three years ago the company was acquired. My salary doubled and everyone was happy. Things started to slowly change. My relationship with the senior management, once very close, become more and more formal. You know, the corporate pressure was coming top down. I received more and more demand up to the point that it really reached the possibility. I had no options but to 'push' back and then the friction was growing between the top and me through my boss. I guess that in some future the team will be moved to the northern UK where the mother company is located now. It's politics Recently the situation was uneasy for me, for my boss and many other people around.

One more question:
What does it mean 'immediate termination'? It happened to me immediately... I just received the letter given to me personally by my boss. The letter states merely the fact that the reason of the dismissal was presented to me verbally and follows with the formalities when my contract will end precisely, etc. I was released from doing my work during the notice period and I have obligation to inform the employer if I start another job during the notice period, which did not happened obviously.
Your salary doubled, so you should have been able to save at least half of your pay rise or 25% of your salary for 3 years. 1 months wait for RAV benefits should not cause you too much grief.
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Old 13.05.2017, 14:11
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Re: Fired. What's my situation in Switzerland

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Your salary doubled, so you should have been able to save at least half of your pay rise or 25% of your salary for 3 years. 1 months wait for RAV benefits should not cause you too much grief.
I saved a lot. There are two points, one I won't be happy to just loose my savings, second I simply don't want to stay on unemployment.
I feel better to know how to proceed with option B, which is to get a job outside of Switzerland.

Thanks for the hint of documenting job search. I wasn't applying like crazy for anything advertised but I have found a few matches. I may be lucky to count at least 10 per month. I need to check my email box. I hope an email is enough to prove the application? Most of the time I didn't even got any real response, just receipt acknowledge.
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Old 13.05.2017, 14:33
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Re: Fired. What's my situation in Switzerland

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I saved a lot. There are two points, one I won't be happy to just loose my savings, second I simply don't want to stay on unemployment.
I feel better to know how to proceed with option B, which is to get a job outside of Switzerland.

Thanks for the hint of documenting job search. I wasn't applying like crazy for anything advertised but I have found a few matches. I may be lucky to count at least 10 per month. I need to check my email box. I hope an email is enough to prove the application? Most of the time I didn't even got any real response, just receipt acknowledge.
Email is a start, but some additional letters sent by snail mail will go down well. Attempt to telephone the companies who did not respond, being able to show you have tried to get a response is important as it shows your application was serious.
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Old 13.05.2017, 20:05
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Re: Fired. What's my situation in Switzerland

I didn't wanted to start yet another thread about RAV. There's plenty of them already but indeed you pointed me to quite valuable information.

Thank you. I will meet the RAV agent soon. Let's stop talking about it
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Old 13.05.2017, 21:16
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Re: Fired. What's my situation in Switzerland

"b. Move abroad, register with that country's job service and draw from RAV for three months. You then would normally collect unemployment compensation in that country. Applies to EU/ EFTA countries. More information is at this brochure at this link"

In case anyone else reading, you must first have claimed and received RAV payment for a month in Switzerland before going to another country to claim for three months.
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