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Old 10.07.2017, 00:30
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Any advice would be appreciated

Dear All,
Last month I received a job offer to work as a trainee in an private school for children with learning difficulties. I will be working 42 hours per week.

I have been reading posts in the employment section and I am beyond confused. My net monthly salary after tax deductions will be 2000CHF, I will be paid 1200 CHF as shared accommodation and social insurance will be provided. I am extremely grateful for the opportunity but I can't seem to find other posts discussing salaries in this range. Most people have suggested salary comparison websites yet I have found no roles that state the salary I am being offered, apart from au pair jobs.

I am a law graduate (averaged a C) hoping to go into teaching/social work/ NGO work. I have 6 months experience in a childcare position. The job is essentially a teaching assistant role. According to the terms of my contract, I am not allowed to have any paid or voluntary work alongside my role. I'm guessing this may be because of the work permit.

I adore children and I am excited by the prospect of living in Switzerland. It has been a dream of mine since high school. Apart from English, I speak basic French.

I can't go into specific details about the school as its prohibited in my contract.

Sorry for the lengthy post. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
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Old 10.07.2017, 00:56
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Re: Any advice would be appreciated

Hi. Welcome to the forum.


I'm confused, the offer will mean 2k net a month plus 1200 or 1200 total because they will deduct for accomodation etc?

If 2k net, then a 42 hour week means, after basic maths asumes 500 per week, around 12 chf per hour. If 1200, then that's a little over 7chf per hour. That is obscenely low. Are they also going to pay your mandatory health insurance and pay to relocate you?

And as a trainee teacher, you shouldn't be working 42 hours per week, you should be balancing classroom time with your own training.

If you want to teach, go and get a teaching qualification . You're a graduate, it shouldn't take long.

Where are you from, can I ask?

OK. I see you are in the UK. I would honestly investigate the Teach First/GTP (or equivalent, they keep changing ) if you don't want to go the PGCE route. If CH is really your dream and not teaching, then I guess you have a different motivation.

The offer you outline above, unless good, board, health insurance and some travel allowances are in there, strikes me as something of a joke. I believe, as a rule of thumb, even unskilled, blue collar jobs in CH rend to start at around 25 per hour.

And FYI, teaching and social work may have some overlaps, but they are very different jobs. I doubt either compare to NGOs.

Good luck.

Last edited by RufusB; 10.07.2017 at 01:02. Reason: Added info
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Old 10.07.2017, 01:00
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Re: Any advice would be appreciated

Thanks for the prompt response.

It's going to be 1200 CHF total per month as they will be deducting 800 CHF for my accommodation.

The title is a trainee but really it's a teaching assistant role. I won't be studying alongside my contracted hours.

I'm not financially in a position to go into further study. I was hoping to save some money to start a course next September. I forgot to mention this is a temporary role until June 2018.

I currently live in London.
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Old 10.07.2017, 01:04
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Re: Any advice would be appreciated

They won't be paying my health insurance as according to them it is not mandatory. My social insurance will be covered. To be honest, I'm not really sure what this means.

Lastly, they did not offer a relocation fee. It'll cost me £77 for a ticket to Switzerland, I'll be able to cover it.
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Old 10.07.2017, 01:16
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Re: Any advice would be appreciated

Better legal minds that me will no doubt be ialong in the morning, but AFAIK health insurance is mandatory if you are going to be registered to live and work in Switzerland. There is no NHS set up. You have to have medical insurance and that costs around 200-300 per month. Not per year.

If they are deducting accommodation costs then your salary smacks of little more than a bursary. And you are literally being paid peanuts for an incredibly demanding role. If the title is trainee, then you should be being trained.

Honestly, I know you said you can't discuss more details but I would say that the offer is extremely low and it doesn't sound like you have all the facts. And not many schools require their staff to be "customer facing " for 42 hours per week. I would suggest you find out exactly what other duties you will be expected to perform (social care, on call etc) and nail them down about the accomodation. Would it be part of a private flat share or an "in residence" scenario? If the latter then be wary: extra duties ( unpaid) could sneak in there.

I'm it trying to wee on your strawberries but please go in eyes open. Switzerland is expensive, probably even more so than London in some cases.

And 77 quid or no, tell them you want it reimbursing. Relocation is bloody expensive. Trust me on this.
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Old 10.07.2017, 01:30
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Re: Any advice would be appreciated

Thanks again for your advice.

The accommodation is a shared flat, roughly 20 mins walk from the school. I've been sent pictures, seems like a nice flat.

Health insurance is non negotiable, they are not willing to cover it.

Regarding my contracted hours, it's 42 hours, Mon-Fri. I'm expected to come in before school starts and help with prep for activities for the day. After school, I'll have to help with some more prep, photocopying, filing, printing etc

I'll ask them about reimbursing my flight costs.

I've looked into the PGCE but my degree classification disqualifies me from the grants. I would rather not take any more student loans.

I'm supposed to start this new role in just under 3 weeks. Don't have anything going for me in London. I'm worried because I'm not allowed to take on any other work so I couldn't even get another role in the evenings or on the weekends. Is this a common clause in Swiss employment contracts?
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Old 10.07.2017, 02:02
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Re: Any advice would be appreciated

This is from Swiss Federal government FAQs regarding compulsory health insurance:

"4. Who is exempted from the obligation to obtain insurance in Switzerland?

The following people are exempted on request provided that, throughout the period for which the exemption is valid, they have equivalent insurance coverage for healthcare in Switzerland:
- people who are required to have health insurance under the law of a country with which no agreement has been concluded concerning limitation of the obligation to obtain insurance, insofar as liability to Swiss insurance would impose a double burden;
- people staying in Switzerland for purposes of basic or advanced training, such as students, pupils and trainees, and family members accompanying them;"

See second sub-link in this link for FAQs:https://www.bag.admin.ch/bag/en/home...gspflicht.html

Last edited by Mullhollander; 10.07.2017 at 12:45. Reason: highlighted text and removed less relevant content
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Old 10.07.2017, 02:06
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Re: Any advice would be appreciated

Thank you Mullhollander. I'm grateful for the clarification
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Old 10.07.2017, 07:43
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Re: Any advice would be appreciated

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I will be working 42 hours per week.

Most people have suggested salary comparison websites yet I have found no roles that state the salary I am being offered, apart from au pair jobs.

I can't go into specific details about the school as its prohibited in my contract.
I think the above says it all. You're simply being exploited if you take up this offer.

The average working week in Switzerland is 38 hours a week iirc.

Au pairs should work no more than 30 hours a week.

If the school has such a clause in their contract it suggests to me that they've had staff complaining about them in the past.

You should also check with the cantonal health office to make sure a teaching assistant falls into the exemption categories that Mullholllander listed. Because working that many hours it doesn't sound like you're going to be getting much training out of it. If it doesn't as RufusB says health insurance will cost you around CHF300 a month.
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Old 10.07.2017, 08:07
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Re: Any advice would be appreciated

Holy slavetrade batman. Exploited with a capital "E".
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Old 10.07.2017, 08:12
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Re: Any advice would be appreciated

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The average working week in Switzerland is 38 hours a week iirc.
It's always been 42 anywhere I've worked in Switzerland.

Tom
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Old 10.07.2017, 08:16
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Re: Any advice would be appreciated

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Thanks for the prompt response.

It's going to be 1200 CHF total per month as they will be deducting 800 CHF for my accommodation.

The title is a trainee but really it's a teaching assistant role. I won't be studying alongside my contracted hours.

I'm not financially in a position to go into further study. I was hoping to save some money to start a course next September. I forgot to mention this is a temporary role until June 2018.

I currently live in London.
That is essentially modern slave labour. Horrendous.
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Old 10.07.2017, 08:46
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Re: Any advice would be appreciated

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They won't be paying my health insurance as according to them it is not mandatory for them to pay but it is mandatory for you as a resident.
Added the clarification, monthly cost for health care will be no less than 200 CHF a month, perhaps more subject to details.

I agree with the others, the offer amounts to modern slavery.
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Old 10.07.2017, 09:04
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Re: Any advice would be appreciated

OP - you say your degree classification prevents you from education training grants in the UK - I'm not sure there are many of those anyway now, regardless of your degree. Can I ask the classification? To be blunt, unless it's at least a second class, you're going to struggle getting a position as a teacher trainee anyway. If you could offer Physics (or another STEM subject and were willing to train and work in a city) then it's more likely.

I honestly think this "deal" you are being offered is, as others have said, an exploitative joke. The fact that you can't mention the school even before you sign anything is suspicious. Private schools anywhere are not as regulated as other schools and they are not always that great at staff welfare. Some are, this does not sound like one of them. The "salary" is, as I've said before, an obscene offer for the demands of the role.

I also doubt you honestly fall under the exemption clause for health insurance. You'd need an awful lot of guarantees in writing, if you ask me. What legal insurances would they offer you - SEN education generally involves being a lot more "Hands on" that mainstream education. I'm sorry to say it and am genuinely not implying anything but in this day and age it has to be a consideration. There's no such thing as a DBS check in CH, or a teaching union you can join - I taught for a while in CH and this always bothered me.

6 months experience in childcare will not prepare you for this role. Teaching can be tough. Teaching special needs kids - although undeniably rewarding some times - is exhausting, both mentally and physically. You can never be "off".

The fact that you are being asked to prep and clear up is worrying too. When would you get your "training" or reflecting time?

However, you're a grown up. The ultimate decision falls on you - but please don't grab it just because you think you can't get anything else.

You say you want to study further - get a bar job or similar. With enough hours you'll make a similar amount and still have some time to live.

If you do take the role:

Get everything in writing - make copies and keep a set in the UK.
Ideally get them to pay your fare in AND your fare out. If not, make sure you have an account with enough to get you home PLUS extra.

Never be alone with a student. If that's unavoidable, keep the classroom door open or move to a communal area

If they can prove to you without doubt that you are exempt from Swiss health insurance, either take out a UK private insurance or at least get comprehensive travel insurance for the first month or so. Also, get IN WRITING, confirmation of how you would access any medical care without Swiss health insurance.

Is the contract for the full Academic year? Get your PAID time off information in writing. Find out IN WRITING whether or not there ever might possibly be (you see where I'm going) the slimmest outside chance that you could be called upon to work extra duties at weekends or in the evenings. And what the compensation for this may be.

Get, in writing, information about the accommodation. How many would share? If it's more than 3 of you (unless it's a bloody big apartment) I'd be concerned. Do you get meals paid for during the working day? For that "salary" I would hope for at least a subsidy.


This offer worries the hell out of me, to be honest, and personally I would run away. But as I said earlier, you are an adult and the ultimate decision is obviously yours. We are just a bunch of well-meaning strangers on the interweb. Just go in eyes open - it's not all chocolate and picturesque mountains.

IF THERE IS AN "OPEN" CLAUSE ALONG THE LINES OF "FULFIL ANY DUTIES FOR THE ROLE AS DIRECTED BY YOUR LINE MANAGER/SCHOOL PRINCIPAL" DO NOT SIGN - ASK FOR ITS REMOVAL. Your "offer" is bad enough - this could see you chained to a classroom on weekends and evenings too. This could have you changing adult diapers or administering medication. Obviously I do not know the extent of the SEN in this school but I know how they can operate, given enough rope.

This is going to sound ironic at best, but I honestly wish you well with your decision - and your future. If you want to teach, then take your existing qualifications to a company like Teach First and have a conversation with someone who is NOT out to squeeze every last drop from you. There will be a way - it may just take more time. Also, please don't think that "there's nothing else so I may as well teach." Teachers are ultimately a bunch of gin-swilling masochists. We love what we do - we have to otherwise it can just be too hard.

Last edited by RufusB; 10.07.2017 at 09:13. Reason: Afterthought re contract.
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Old 10.07.2017, 09:15
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Re: Any advice would be appreciated

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Added the clarification, monthly cost for health care will be no less than 200 CHF a month, perhaps more subject to details.

I agree with the others, the offer amounts to modern slavery.
Urs Max - Can I ask (for my own edification really), for those who are genuinely exempt, how do they access health care? Do they still get a KK card with a number from, say, the local gemeinde or Kanton but just don't pay any premiums? What happens to medical bills?
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Old 10.07.2017, 09:21
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Re: Any advice would be appreciated

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The average working week in Switzerland is 38 hours a week iirc.
Nope, it's 42 or 42.5. It has never been below 40 hours/week.



She's not an au-pair, it's not a full-time job - it's a traineeship. It has an educational purpose, similar to an internship. In theory anyway, and let's not get into how and to what extent this may or may not be abused.

It's a normal salary for an internship in a way and to an extent - our massive international corporation pays the same or even a bit less. Most others do as well - I know because I know the benchmarks, having done this for many years (and no, salaries haven't gone up, really, at best maybe 100.- a month).

HOWEVER: this is for interns during their studies, as well as recent graduates/trainees with an undergraduate/Bachelors for the first 4-6 months post-graduation, after which the salary doubles (as we all know, an undergraduate degree in Switzerland doesn't enjoy the same status as it does elsewhere). Trainees with a Masters degree post-graduation earn more immediately - the salary should double or at times even triple, depending on the industry and field.

Needless to say this particular sector will hardly be paying Investment Banking/Consulting salaries. Nevertheless, assuming your degree is an acknowledged one, I'd say the salary is on the low side, but in no way unusual. How long is this traineeship supposed to last? Any pay raise expected in at most 6 months?
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Old 10.07.2017, 09:25
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Re: Any advice would be appreciated

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Urs Max - Can I ask (for my own edification really), for those who are genuinely exempt, how do they access health care? Do they still get a KK card with a number from, say, the local gemeinde or Kanton but just don't pay any premiums? What happens to medical bills?
Beats me (how that works with those exempted). I would expect for them to get access like everybody else, just that the insurance info differs, but that's just a guess.

As for the bills and payment, that depends on the insurance. Some (KPT is the one I know) have the bills sent to them, pay, and invoice the Franchise plus 10% from the patient (clawback if you will). Other insurers have the bills sent to the patient, have him pay, after which the patient is to send the bills to the insurer. The insurance pays the patient (back) what it considers to be its share.

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Nope, it's 42 or 42.5. It has never been below 40 hours/week.
Actual hours worked was 41h20min on average in 2014, counting only those with a fulltime job.

Actual hours worked on average by all employees are significantly less because more than a third works less than fulltime. That average should be well below 40 hours.
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Old 10.07.2017, 09:36
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Re: Any advice would be appreciated

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Nope, it's 42 or 42.5. It has never been below 40 hours/week.



She's not an au-pair, it's not a full-time job - it's a traineeship. It has an educational purpose, similar to an internship. In theory anyway, and let's not get into how and to what extent this may or may not be abused?
Yes, it is. And I don't know for sure but I'm betting Swiss teachers aren't contracted for as many as 42 hours per week (I know they will work more it's expected and necessary, but I'm talking contract. My full-time UK contract stipulates 25 "contact" periods per week and I'm required to be on the premises to fulfil all my other duties for a minimum of 32 hours per week - legally speaking the hour lunch break is protected and mine to do as I wish with but it doesn't always work liek that. I'll still be in school nearer 43 hours per week and probably working another 12-15, but my salary ultimately reflects this). Even the OP said it's more like a TA role - there must be something in the paper work (or a conversation the OP has had) that suggests this.

This does not sound like an internship - it sounds like a revolving door scheme to get as many unsuspecting but well-meaning graduates to work themselves to the bone for bugger all reward - or additional qualifications.

That's a point, actually - OP, as a trainee, what qualification or similar could you reasonably be expecting to get at the end of your contract? Would it/your experience be recognised elsewhere?
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Old 10.07.2017, 09:44
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Re: Any advice would be appreciated

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Yes, it is. And I don't know for sure but I'm betting Swiss teachers aren't contracted for as many as 42 hours per week (I know they will work more it's expected and necessary, but I'm talking contract. My full-time UK contract stipulates 25 "contact" periods per week. I'll still be in school nearer 43 hours per week and probably working another 12-15, but my salary ultimately reflects this). Even the OP said it's more like a TA role - there must be something in the paper work (or a conversation the OP has had) that suggests this.

This does not sound like an internship - it sounds like a revolving door scheme to get as many unsuspecting but well-meaning graduates to work themselves to the bone for bugger all reward - or additional qualifications.
I don't disagree and yes, it does appear shady. What I'm saying is that for traineeships - whether real or pretend - the conditions are not unusual at all.

However, as far as OP saying it's more like a TA role - that's her perspective, I've seen plenty of interns/trainees claim they were "project managers" and essentially doing so much more than everyone when they were really not.

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That's a point, actually - OP, as a trainee, what qualification or similar could you reasonably be expecting to get at the end of your contract? Would it/your experience be recognised elsewhere?
This for me is the bigger issue too. With a law degree (what's that mean? Bachelors? Masters?) doing a "teaching traineeship" will get her nowhere. I understood this is not part of any education whatsoever (in which case it would be absolutely ok anyway, no questions asked), but a random employment which she hopes will lead somewhere else. However, it will give her no additional qualifications at all, and is unlikely to be a segue into anything else.
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Old 10.07.2017, 09:48
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Re: Any advice would be appreciated

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...According to the terms of my contract, I am not allowed to have any paid or voluntary work alongside my role. I'm guessing this may be because of the work permit.
Nope. There are no such restrictions for EU citizens.

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Is this a common clause in Swiss employment contracts?
Yes. Usually says "without permission" may not engage in other work.
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