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Old 06.12.2018, 12:29
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Employed with foreign companies but not an ANobAG. Now changing to contractor.

So it's a bit of a convoluted situation, I think I'll need help from a professional. Apologies if this is the wrong place for this thread, feel free to move it to a better-suited place.

Here is the situation:

- In July 2017 I moved to Switzerland with Employer A employing me from Netherlands.
- In November 2017 I got a new job with Employer B employing me from the UK.
- Starting December 2018, Employer B wants to switch to me being a contractor as opposed to an employee.

OK that's not so hard, here's the tricky part:

- I am not an ANobAG, which means I owe the social security from July 2017 till present time.
- I don't yet have accident insurance (besides the one my health insurance offers, but it seems as an ANobAG you need something more than that).
- Employer A is no longer in action. They are still a legal entity, but inactive. Getting a signature for the ANobAG agreement may be difficult/impossible.
- Employer B is not comfortable signing the ANobAG agreement considering they want to move away from employer/employee to employer/contractor, but the ANobAG stuff seems to be geared towards employees not contractors.

For reference, when I say ANobAG agreement I mean the following: https://sozialversicherungen.admin.c.../6283/download

And finally, it seems from what I can tell that it's not actually possible to _just be a contractor_ in Switzerland. You have to be hired by someone to some capacity, which means there's contracting companies (payroll?).

Does anybody have any advice for this issue? Any professional contacts that are affordable? Any contracting/payroll companies that have good reputation?
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Old 06.12.2018, 13:16
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Re: Employed with foreign companies but not an ANobAG. Now changing to contractor.

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So it's a bit of a convoluted situation, I think I'll need help from a professional. Apologies if this is the wrong place for this thread, feel free to move it to a better-suited place.

Here is the situation:

- In July 2017 I moved to Switzerland with Employer A employing me from Netherlands.
- In November 2017 I got a new job with Employer B employing me from the UK.
- Starting December 2018, Employer B wants to switch to me being a contractor as opposed to an employee.

OK that's not so hard, here's the tricky part:

- I am not an ANobAG, which means I owe the social security from July 2017 till present time.
- I don't yet have accident insurance (besides the one my health insurance offers, but it seems as an ANobAG you need something more than that).
- Employer A is no longer in action. They are still a legal entity, but inactive. Getting a signature for the ANobAG agreement may be difficult/impossible.
- Employer B is not comfortable signing the ANobAG agreement considering they want to move away from employer/employee to employer/contractor, but the ANobAG stuff seems to be geared towards employees not contractors.

For reference, when I say ANobAG agreement I mean the following: https://sozialversicherungen.admin.c.../6283/download

And finally, it seems from what I can tell that it's not actually possible to _just be a contractor_ in Switzerland. You have to be hired by someone to some capacity, which means there's contracting companies (payroll?).

Does anybody have any advice for this issue? Any professional contacts that are affordable? Any contracting/payroll companies that have good reputation?

As you so very correctly state "I'll need help from a professional."
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  #3  
Old 06.12.2018, 13:49
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Re: Employed with foreign companies but not an ANobAG. Now changing to contractor.

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And finally, it seems from what I can tell that it's not actually possible to _just be a contractor_ in Switzerland. You have to be hired by someone to some capacity, which means there's contracting companies (payroll?).
Found a GmbH and then be its the sole employee. The GmBH will then be responsible for social security and insurance. You can still use a payroll processor to lessen the administrative burden.
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Old 06.12.2018, 15:37
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Re: Employed with foreign companies but not an ANobAG. Now changing to contractor.

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Found a GmbH and then be its the sole employee. The GmBH will then be responsible for social security and insurance. You can still use a payroll processor to lessen the administrative burden.
For a single person - or even a handful - there's little in administrative burden. Save yourself money by asking your accountant what the deductions should be. If you have to spend less than an hour a month doing payroll, it's just a waste of money to use a payroll company.
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Old 06.12.2018, 16:25
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Re: Employed with foreign companies but not an ANobAG. Now changing to contractor.

Thank you for the advice. I did consider founding a company and hiring myself, but that involves the deposit which I am not able to afford at this moment (especially if I have to pay social contributions and so on retroactively).
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Old 06.12.2018, 20:01
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Re: Employed with foreign companies but not an ANobAG. Now changing to contractor.

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Thank you for the advice. I did consider founding a company and hiring myself, but that involves the deposit which I am not able to afford at this moment (especially if I have to pay social contributions and so on retroactively).
It is not good advice in any case. Simply use a payroll company, you become their employee and they take care of the rest. In doing so it is easier to get loss of income insurance, employment benefits later etc.

If you had money then there are some “tricks” you could do, but since you have not, it would not be worth the effort.
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Old 06.12.2018, 20:17
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Re: Employed with foreign companies but not an ANobAG. Now changing to contractor.

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It is not good advice in any case. Simply use a payroll company, you become their employee and they take care of the rest. In doing so it is easier to get loss of income insurance, employment benefits later etc.

If you had money then there are some “tricks” you could do, but since you have not, it would not be worth the effort.
Yes it looks like that's the best idea from now on.

But there is still the first part of the problem (debt accrued since 2017 to social security). Know anybody that may be well versed in this stuff?
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Old 06.12.2018, 21:14
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Re: Employed with foreign companies but not an ANobAG. Now changing to contractor.

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Yes it looks like that's the best idea from now on.

But there is still the first part of the problem (debt accrued since 2017 to social security). Know anybody that may be well versed in this stuff?
The starting point might be: do you have the money to pay up? What kind of permit do you have?
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Old 06.12.2018, 21:19
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Re: Employed with foreign companies but not an ANobAG. Now changing to contractor.

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The starting point might be: do you have the money to pay up? What kind of permit do you have?
Yes I do. I'm sure I can pay up no problem.

I've a 1 year B permit, the second one.
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Old 06.12.2018, 22:07
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Re: Employed with foreign companies but not an ANobAG. Now changing to contractor.

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Found a GmbH and then be its the sole employee. The GmBH will then be responsible for social security and insurance. You can still use a payroll processor to lessen the administrative burden.
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It is not good advice in any case. Simply use a payroll company, you become their employee and they take care of the rest. In doing so it is easier to get loss of income insurance, employment benefits later etc.

If you had money then there are some “tricks” you could do, but since you have not, it would not be worth the effort.
Maybe a bit off topic, but I guess funding a GmbH incurs more financial burden than just being a contractor: you need to rent a place for the company, pay some administrative stamps on behalf of the company, perhaps pay some taxes pertaining to the company itself...

and AFAIK, when you fund GmbH you don't have the right for unemployment benefits but when you are a contractor you are protected.
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Old 06.12.2018, 22:12
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Re: Employed with foreign companies but not an ANobAG. Now changing to contractor.

A starting point might be to apply for self-employment status with AKSO Solothurn. They would then likely make a determination to decline the application and invoice your employer from 2017. This is the application form:

https://www.akso.ch/fileadmin/akso/d...elfirm-r_7.pdf

Another possibility would be to contact AKSO directly and advise them of the situation without going through the application step.
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Old 06.12.2018, 22:32
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Re: Employed with foreign companies but not an ANobAG. Now changing to contractor.

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Maybe a bit off topic, but I guess funding a GmbH incurs more financial burden than just being a contractor: you need to rent a place for the company, pay some administrative stamps on behalf of the company, perhaps pay some taxes pertaining to the company itself...

and AFAIK, when you fund GmbH you don't have the right for unemployment benefits but when you are a contractor you are protected.
Yes I think setting up a company incurs some overhead costs. Unemployment benefits I don't care much for though, my profession allows me to find a new job within a month as it's in high demand and I save up for my own unemployment. I never depend on government systems for money (which is why ideally I wouldn't even give them the money for it).

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A starting point might be to apply for self-employment status with AKSO Solothurn. They would then likely make a determination to decline the application and invoice your employer from 2017. This is the application form:

https://www.akso.ch/fileadmin/akso/d...elfirm-r_7.pdf

Another possibility would be to contact AKSO directly and advise them of the situation without going through the application step.
Yes I think I will have to talk with them once again. I spoke with them yesterday but it was with the understanding that I'd be an employee, I absolutely forgot to speak as a contractor or somebody who will no longer be an employee.

If possible I'd like to avoid billing my employers, since they've already paid their dues on this in my eyes.
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Old 07.12.2018, 03:04
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Re: Employed with foreign companies but not an ANobAG. Now changing to contractor.

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I've a 1 year B permit, the second one.
Did you not have to submit something in order to get the permit?

I would have thought that if your paper was not up today there would be a problem getting a renewal.
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Old 07.12.2018, 09:09
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Re: Employed with foreign companies but not an ANobAG. Now changing to contractor.

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Did you not have to submit something in order to get the permit?

I would have thought that if your paper was not up today there would be a problem getting a renewal.
Not at all. I just needed to show the contract I had with the companies.

At no point has the government contacted me to tell me I need to pay social contributions or asked me to do so. I realized I have to do it.
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Old 07.12.2018, 10:55
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Re: Employed with foreign companies but not an ANobAG. Now changing to contractor.

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Maybe a bit off topic, but I guess funding a GmbH incurs more financial burden than just being a contractor: you need to rent a place for the company
No, you don't. You can have it registered at your home address.
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