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-   -   What’s with all the outsourcing? (https://www.englishforum.ch/employment/292631-what-s-all-outsourcing.html)

Susie-Q 21.06.2019 17:26

What’s with all the outsourcing?
 
Hello,

I work in pharma. I just started in a new company where most work that is not completed by VP’s/Directors is outsourced to India. This includes project managers, market research, communications, publications and even administrative assistants.

I know things have steadily been moving in that direction for years, but now it looks like it will be nothing but senior directors/or higher left in corporations Switzerland before long. Novartis recently announced that some directors will be moved to East Europe. What are us plebs to do?

Squeeeez 21.06.2019 17:45

Re: What’s with all the outsourcing?
 
Start your own company where you can be the CEO who's outsourcing stuff?:msntongue:

EdwinNL 21.06.2019 17:54

Re: What’s with all the outsourcing?
 
You can offer to work for lower salary, you could move to India, you could switch profession, you could get a high ranked job etc.. etc..

Phil_MCR 21.06.2019 18:14

Re: What’s with all the outsourcing?
 
start a swiss german school in Hyderabad

roegner 21.06.2019 18:17

Re: What’s with all the outsourcing?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil_MCR (Post 3077411)
start a swiss german school in Hyderabad

Like in the best exotic Marigold hotel? :D

Chuff 21.06.2019 18:21

Re: What’s with all the outsourcing?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Susie-Q (Post 3077400)
Hello,

I work in pharma. I just started in a new company where most work that is not completed by VP’s/Directors is outsourced to India. This includes project managers, market research, communications, publications and even administrative assistants.

I know things have steadily been moving in that direction for years, but now it looks like it will be nothing but senior directors/or higher left in corporations Switzerland before long. Novartis recently announced that some directors will be moved to East Europe. What are us plebs to do?

Aldi/Lidl are hiring and they pay pretty well for 'stock management technicians'! :msngrin:

On a serious note, cost pressures drive short and long-term outsourcing but the cost benefits are not always as simple as they seem in countries where turnover is very high. Plus, when a country becomes heavily outsourced to it then becomes more competitive and salaries rise, further reducing the cost benefits.

Bratislava (Slovakia) is a case in point where many companies are competing for the workers and even offering sign on bonuses of 10k EUR (like a third of a years salary or so)!

Squeeeez 21.06.2019 18:29

Re: What’s with all the outsourcing?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuff (Post 3077415)
Bratislava (Slovakia) is a case in point where many companies are competing for the workers and even offering sign on bonuses of 10k EUR (like a third of a years salary or so)!

Hmmm... how long do you have to stay to get the 10k?:cool:

ZuriRollt 21.06.2019 18:30

Re: What’s with all the outsourcing?
 
Same in banking (at least IT) and related financial services.
All cost centres have been / are in the process of being outsourced to cheaper locations.

Only profit centres remain. Or at least those that can't be fully automated i.e. requiring a great deal of client contact and interaction will remain (but that will also reduce greatly due to cutting-edge technology already in progress).

Here a link to a report published today on salary development, which is the most honest I've seen in my decades here in CH. It pretty much confirms your post:

https://www.20min.ch/finance/news/st...-Chef-15745853

Apologies, have it only in German, but assume that your English is good.

Susie-Q 21.06.2019 19:07

Re: What’s with all the outsourcing?
 
I was working previously in a major pharma company where they moved my job to the UK since it was too complicated to outsource, but it was cheaper than here. Meanwhile, they report one of their top years ever...

At some point, you would think the government would get involved since a mass exodus of tax paying ex-pats and unemployed citizens is in their midst...but I guess corporations have the final say these days. Now I’m working in a job that requires minimal skills since all project task oriented jobs have moved away...sucks, and I’m actually quite lucky to have what I have.

ZuriRollt 21.06.2019 19:25

Re: What’s with all the outsourcing?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Susie-Q (Post 3077424)
I was working previously in a major pharma company where they moved my job to the UK since it was too complicated to outsource, but it was cheaper than here. Meanwhile, they report one of their top years ever...

At some point, you would think the government would get involved since a mass exodus of tax paying ex-pats and unemployed citizens is in their midst...but I guess corporations have the final say these days. Now I’m working in a job that requires minimal skills since all project task oriented jobs have moved away...sucks, and I’m actually quite lucky to have what I have.

Same here in IT. Made the same experience.
I don't know how large corporations in CH get around the hiring laws, permits etc. Except that they usually form companies in the desired locations.

But you're right...sucks

Mikers 21.06.2019 22:30

Re: What’s with all the outsourcing?
 
Don’t worry too much, big firms are moving some stuff overseas but the Swiss economy as a whole still needs a lot of IT people - in Switzerland. Focus on being motivated and positive and have some business awareness and you’ll be fine.

MusicChick 21.06.2019 23:09

Re: What’s with all the outsourcing?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Susie-Q (Post 3077400)
Hello,

I work in pharma. I just started in a new company where most work that is not completed by VP’s/Directors is outsourced to India. This includes project managers, market research, communications, publications and even administrative assistants.

I know things have steadily been moving in that direction for years, but now it looks like it will be nothing but senior directors/or higher left in corporations Switzerland before long. Novartis recently announced that some directors will be moved to East Europe. What are us plebs to do?

Move to EE? Is it that scary? ;)

What is the antonym for a "brain-drain"?
Although if people are complaining about Swiss German being tough..

Today only 22.06.2019 01:04

Re: What’s with all the outsourcing?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Susie-Q (Post 3077424)
I was working previously in a major pharma company where they moved my job to the UK since it was too complicated to outsource, but it was cheaper than here. Meanwhile, they report one of their top years ever...

At some point, you would think the government would get involved since a mass exodus of tax paying ex-pats and unemployed citizens is in their midst...but I guess corporations have the final say these days. Now I’m working in a job that requires minimal skills since all project task oriented jobs have moved away...sucks, and I’m actually quite lucky to have what I have.


You don't seem to understand, it is not what money thy made in past year that the direction worry about, it's where the company may or may not be in 5 years time.


Long term planning....;)

Susie-Q 22.06.2019 09:41

Re: What’s with all the outsourcing?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Today only (Post 3077486)
You don't seem to understand, it is not what money thy made in past year that the direction worry about, it's where the company may or may not be in 5 years time.


Long term planning....;)

They’re doing just fine, trust me. ;)

Today only 22.06.2019 09:54

Re: What’s with all the outsourcing?
 
Sure they are because certain measures were taken 5 years ago, just as they will be doing fine in 5 years time as certain measures are being taken now. ;)


The fact they are "doing just fine" is not down to luck but management who have to take tough decisions.

John_H 22.06.2019 10:25

Re: What’s with all the outsourcing?
 
These things come and go .. Outsource / Insource / Changesource / repeat..

I've been in same big company for 11/12 years, I've seen work going to Singapore until it became too expensive, then Latvia, then India etc etc.. Currently alot is moving back to the UK, Manchester .. Then Glasgow is the next big thing.

Some people have followed the role and done very well out of it, moving from place to place and being promoted each time.

Susie-Q 22.06.2019 11:07

Re: What’s with all the outsourcing?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Today only (Post 3077505)
Sure they are because certain measures were taken 5 years ago, just as they will be doing fine in 5 years time as certain measures are being taken now. ;)


The fact they are "doing just fine" is not down to luck but management who have to take tough decisions.

In some cases, yes this is true. But in most cases, it is 100% pure greed and done to make “shareholders happy”. Many people that were fired over the past two years, were asked to “reapply” for their jobs.

k_and_e 22.06.2019 11:43

Re: What’s with all the outsourcing?
 
Most jobs that are off-shored or near-shored will be replaced by automation and robotics in the near future anyway, so I don't think it is a big loss. It's just a huge risk for the countries that are now building their economies on such jobs.

Today only 22.06.2019 14:17

Re: What’s with all the outsourcing?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Susie-Q (Post 3077523)
In some cases, yes this is true. But in most cases, it is 100% pure greed and done to make “shareholders happy”. Many people that were fired over the past two years, were asked to “reapply” for their jobs.

What do you really think is the purpose of a company is ?

Stop thinking anything different other than return on shareholder investement

Sonnenbrand 22.06.2019 14:49

Re: What’s with all the outsourcing?
 
The Swiss company my wife works for has been sending dozens and dozens of jobs to Bratislava over the last 3-4 years. It seems great that they in theory or on paper are going to save some money... the reality of it is that workers will work for 6-12 months and demand large unreasonable/unjustified promotions, jump ship to go down the street for 100-200 euros more a month or often times hire in and immediately become pregnant and utilize their 3 years time off with a guaranteed job when they come back.

Same kind of story with the workers in Bangladesh as well. For many of them it will be their first real job in an office setting and at first are eager to work and contribute, many of them later on become very upset when they are not promoted within the first year and cite they now have some ground-breaking 6-12 months of experience... they then leave and go to another international company. :msncrazy:

As am American, I have seen this "offshoring" going on for 20-30 years in the USA and in the last 5 years the work has started to come back to the U.S. for one reason or another.


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