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Old 21.08.2019, 19:31
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RAV Rahmenfrist question

Hi all - hoping someone can help with a question.

My wife became unemployed at end of March 2017 and registered for the RAV - she made claims payments until September 2017 at which point she started contracting. She contracted until February 2019, claimed RAV for 1 month in March 2019 and then took another contract from 1st April 2019.

The current contract ends in November 2019 and currently there is no job.

As I understand it with the RAV the first Rahmenfrist benefit period ran from 1st April 2017 to 31st March 2019. If on 1st December she doesn't have a job, the Rahmenfrist contribution period will look back 2 years from 30th November 2019 to 1st December 2017 and calculate she has 23 months of employment in that 2 year period and she will qualify for almost the full number of potential days of benefit payments - it makes no difference as to whether in those prior 24 months she was in the Rahmenfrist for the benefit period from the previous claim.

She has received different advice and will not qualify as the Rahmenfrist contribution period, only begins when the previous benefit period has ended so she would only have 6 months of contributions. I'm pretty sure this advice is incorrect.

Can anyone confirm one way or the other?
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Old 22.08.2019, 07:59
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Re: RAV Rahmenfrist question

Of course, the advice is not correct, she will get 24 months. I was in a similar situation some months ago, and i also received this.
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Old 22.08.2019, 10:50
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Re: RAV Rahmenfrist question

Any work throughout a Rahemnfrist counts to the next Rahemnfrist. Thats why there are unemployment insurance deductions from salary.
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Old 22.08.2019, 11:13
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Re: RAV Rahmenfrist question

If you have worked for over a year, it is counted as a new RAV unemployment insurance deductions. If you are employed for over a year and for less than two years, it is granted 260 days and if worked for over two years it’s granted 400 days, that’s if you fall into category above age of 25 and below age of 55. Example of unemployment benefits duration in canton of Aargau, which shouldn’t be that different from the other neighboring cantons.
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File Type: jpeg 34B0C905-D30A-4079-8227-8E3FDF156B9D.jpeg (47.2 KB, 104 views)

Last edited by jacek; 22.08.2019 at 12:13. Reason: Typos
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Old 08.01.2020, 14:30
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Re: RAV Rahmenfrist question

This query is for a friend. He’s 57, and one of those who completed school, did an apprenticeship, worked all his life long, and then made the mistake of resigning (to get away from changed and increasingly health-endangering employment circumstances) without having first found another job.

He’s done all the RAV paperwork, and is seriously looking for work, and wants to work, and as a result he took whatever employment he could find. Unfortunately, those jobs didn’t work out, so he is now once again unemployed, and the clock is ticking frighteningly.

The query is about the number of days during which he may draw unemployment benefits, the so-called “Rahmenfrist”. He’s in the Canton of Zurich.
FIRST PHASE
In company X, he worked from 18.9.2000 to 31.3.2018.
He resigned.

SECOND PHASE
He was unemployed (registered) from 01.04.2018 to 14.05.2018.

THIRD PHASE
He found a job in company Y, and worked from 14.05.2018 to 20.07.2018.
That’s just over 2 months.
His employer terminated the contract.

FOURTH PHASE
He was unemployed (registered) from 21.07.2018 to 08.04.2019.

FIFTH PHASE
He found a job in company Z, and worked from 09.04.2019 to 20.07.2019.
That’s just over 3 months.
His employer terminated the contract.

SIXTH PHASE
He has been unemployed (registered) from 21.04.2019 until now.
On 28.11.2019, the Arbeitslosenkasse (unemployment office) set out his
“Rahmenfrist” as follows:
Rahmenfrist: 02.04.2018 bis 01.04.2019

Höchstanspruch Taggelder
(maximum number of days to draw unemployment benefits) 520 Days

Bezogene Taggelder
(number of days on which unemployment benefits have been drawn) 197.7 Days

Restanspruch Taggelder
(remaining number of days on which unemployment benefits can be drawn) 322.3 Days

He has been told by his RAV advisor that payments will end on 30. March 2020.
His question is about the apparent contradiction between the number of days and the Rahmenfrist.

As I understand it, there are two types of Rahmenfrist: one for the contributions, and another for the benefits.
Rahmenfrist for Contributions:
As of 01.04.2018, he had clearly fulfilled the Rahmenfrist for having contributed during at least 12 months during the previous 24 months.

Rahmenfrist for Benefits:
Because he is over age 55, he’s entitled to 520 days. These “Taggelder” are counted as Mondays to Fridays, so that 520 benefit-days stretch over 728 calendar days.
As of 02.04.2018, he ought to have had 24 months (i.e. up until 30.03.2020 or 01.04.2020) during which he’d be allowed to draw benefits.
Why, then, is his Rahmenfrist set as ending on 01.04.2019 and not on 01.04.2020?

He thought that working would be credited to him as a good attempt at mitigating the costs of being unemployed, and that having worked would extend the number of days on which he could claim benefits, if he still needed to (which he now does). Is that an error in his thinking?

Since he twice took on a job within that original Rahmenfrist (Third Phase and Fifth Phase, above), he didn’t, in fact, draw all the Taggelder to which he would have been entitled. Presumably that’s why he still has those “322.3 remaining days”.
These “Taggelder” are counted as Mondays to Fridays, so that 332.2 benefit-days stretch over 464.8 calendar days.
In that case, as of 28.11.2019, he would be allowed to draw benefits up until 7.3.2021.

Is the RAV advisor correct in saying that – even though he still has all those days listed as remaining, on which he’d be allowed to draw benefits – payments will end on 30.3.2020?
  • If so, why? How does the calculation work, to generate that result?
  • If not, could someone please recommend what this man should do next?

I'm hoping someone who understands these matters will be able to set it out so that the man can follow the logic and then at least understand why he has to accept the end as 30th March 2020 or else, if it is possible to contest that end date, to help empower him to do so.

Thank you very much.
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Old 08.01.2020, 14:52
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Re: RAV Rahmenfrist question

He will need to start a new Rahmenfrist after this one runs out (it runs for two years).

But, as he hasn't worked 12 months in the past 24, he won't get one.

Sorry.

Tom
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Old 08.01.2020, 15:46
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Re: RAV Rahmenfrist question

But why does the Rahmenfrist he has, end a year earlier than it was supposed to?
Why is he not allowed to draw benefits on the days which are declared as his "Restanspruch"?
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Old 08.01.2020, 15:52
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Re: RAV Rahmenfrist question

This document lists exceptions that can allow a two-year Rahmenfrist (qualified period) to extended. See para. B40 (German):

https://www.koordination.ch/fileadmi...-b/ale_b35.pdf
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Old 08.01.2020, 16:01
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Re: RAV Rahmenfrist question

Quote:
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But why does the Rahmenfrist he has, end a year earlier than it was supposed to?
"Rahmenfrist: 02.04.2018 bis 01.04.2019"

Looks like a typo, should be:

"Rahmenfrist: 02.04.2018 bis 01.04.2020"

Tom
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Old 08.01.2020, 21:54
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Re: RAV Rahmenfrist question

Yes, Tom, I think you must be right, since 01.04.2019 is in the past, that must be a typo.


Thanks, Mullhollander, I'll pass that attachment on. I admit, I haven't had time to read it... but I still wonder how those 322 days (Restanspruch) seem to just go up in smoke. I realise I must be missing some fundamental piece of basic knoweldge in this.
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