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Old 14.09.2019, 18:58
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Pay rise request went wrong

Hello everyone,

I came to Switzerland 2 years ago after a job offer for a junior manager role. In My contract (2years) the salary was in minimum comparing to others in same level and it had a 10% increase after the 1st year (still less than the others).

Those 2 years, although I had a junior manager's contract I had full manager's responsibilities with more clients than others with full manager's contract.

I recently had my performance review which was really good reaching in all the subjects 4 out of 5. During my performance review I had a request for sponsoring a diploma which will help also the company to improve in some subjects and it was accepted.

After my performance review, they offered me a permanent contract as manager and also giving me more projects with the plan to reach a senior position soon.
The salary offer though was the same as the other junior managers getting and 2000 less than what the other managers get (my new role after the promotion they offered).

I found it quite unfair after this performance review and the extra responsibilities they mentioned so I said that I believe I should be valued better and get what all the other managers get or at least more than what the other junior managers.

My supervisor started yelling and telling me that I am disrespectful after an offer for promotion, that I should be grateful for working in this organization and that he takes back everything that he said in my performance review as I showed him who I really am after this request.

I simply said to him that if he believes that I do not deserve what I asked and I am not as good as the others then he can say it and move on.

He told me that I cannot get the salary that the others get because I am 10 years younger than them and I do not have family so we are in different level for Swiss standards.

At the end he took back the contract and he said that he will let me know what he will do because he changed his mind.

Please let me know your thoughts about it as I really don't know how is the system here.
Was I wrong? What is your advise?

Thank you.
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Old 14.09.2019, 19:11
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Re: Pay rise request went wrong

Find another job and tell your manager to please go and masturbate.
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Old 14.09.2019, 19:20
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Re: Pay rise request went wrong

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Find another job and tell your manager to please go and masturbate.
Thank you for your response.

Believe me...I want to... however I am in an industry with 1-2 other options within Switzerland.
So I will either have to leave the country or go to RAV and try to find a job in another industry.

With the salary I get it was impossible to save money and I will have to wait 3 months to get money from RAV as they told me...

So I am in a very difficult situation...
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Old 14.09.2019, 19:57
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Re: Pay rise request went wrong

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With the salary I get it was impossible to save money and I will have to wait 3 months to get money from RAV as they told me...
.
Not of they sack you, you need to start looking for work as you have a fixed contract.
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Old 14.09.2019, 20:00
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Re: Pay rise request went wrong

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Not of they sack you, you need to start looking for work as you have a fixed contract.

I have a 2 year contract which expires end of next month...
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Old 14.09.2019, 20:04
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Re: Pay rise request went wrong

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I have a 2 year contract which expires end of next month...
You need to start looking for work 3 months before your fixed contract ends, 10 jobs a month.
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Old 14.09.2019, 20:08
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Re: Pay rise request went wrong

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I have a 2 year contract which expires end of next month...
Then you have a problem.

Tom
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Old 14.09.2019, 20:14
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Re: Pay rise request went wrong

Thank you all.

What is your opinion about my supervisor's reaction?

Is it true that if you are older and you have family you get more than others in the same position with the same qualifications?
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Old 14.09.2019, 20:19
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Re: Pay rise request went wrong

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Thank you all.

What is your opinion about my supervisor's reaction?

Is it true that if you are older and you have family you get more than others in the same position with the same qualifications?
to be honest, i noticed that some people have kept their jobs purely because they are the sole breadwinner and nobody wanted to cause hardship for their family.
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Old 14.09.2019, 20:25
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Re: Pay rise request went wrong

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to be honest, i noticed that some people have kept their jobs purely because they are the sole breadwinner and nobody wanted to cause hardship for their family.
Lol, apparently my old boss didn't get that memo!
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Old 14.09.2019, 20:27
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Re: Pay rise request went wrong

Playing devil's advocate here - if you're 10 years younger, you (probably) have less experience than others with the same responsibilities. Thus in the Swiss line of thinking you can't expect to be paid exactly the same.

Do I understand correctly they gave you a new title and agreed to pay for some classes? No pay rise at all? Or just not as much of a pay rise as you wanted?

If you really are out of a contract and non-EU, that's a pain.
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Old 14.09.2019, 20:29
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Re: Pay rise request went wrong

maybe you should just get married and have kids to secure your pay rise
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Old 14.09.2019, 20:31
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Re: Pay rise request went wrong

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Thank you all.

What is your opinion about my supervisor's reaction?

Is it true that if you are older and you have family you get more than others in the same position with the same qualifications?
Totally unprofessional reaction. Did you keep a copy of your original evaluation ?

If the industry in your profession is like this in CH, do you really want to stay here ?

Normally yes, over roughly the first 10 years of your working life salary will go up significantly, after which it flattens out. Family should not matter, but experience does.
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Old 14.09.2019, 20:37
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Re: Pay rise request went wrong

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Playing devil's advocate here - if you're 10 years younger, you (probably) have less experience than others with the same responsibilities. Thus in the Swiss line of thinking you can't expect to be paid exactly the same.

Do I understand correctly they gave you a new title and agreed to pay for some classes? No pay rise at all? Or just not as much of a pay rise as you wanted?

If you really are out of a contract and non-EU, that's a pain.
No they don't have more experience...in managerial position.
And they actually came after me at this organization...

They just had a better negotiation at the beginning I guess.
Or it is maybe I am the only woman in managerial position?
I really don't know the reason....but when i asked they told me it is just the age and that i was single.

I was junior manager until now and they offered me managers position with 800 pay rise which is still what the other junior managers get and 2000 less of what the other managers get..
They also told me that they will give me more projects with the plan to be senior manager within a year but with the same salary.


I am an EU.
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Old 14.09.2019, 20:41
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Re: Pay rise request went wrong

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Totally unprofessional reaction. Did you keep a copy of your original evaluation ?

If the industry in your profession is like this in CH, do you really want to stay here ?

Normally yes, over roughly the first 10 years of your working life salary will go up significantly, after which it flattens out. Family should not matter, but experience does.
Yes I do have a copy ....and the assistant HR has it too...but it does not have his signature.

I really want to stay in this country...but if these procedures and reactions are common in Switzerland...then I should reconsider it....
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Old 14.09.2019, 20:43
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Re: Pay rise request went wrong

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maybe you should just get married and have kids to secure your pay rise
I will update the tinder profile then
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Old 14.09.2019, 21:04
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Re: Pay rise request went wrong

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Find another job and tell your manager to please go and masturbate.

It's spelled that way, but it's pronounced "go f_ĮK himself."


Edit: wow, the auto-censor on EF is pretty sensitive. Even an * won't find your way clear....
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Old 14.09.2019, 21:07
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Re: Pay rise request went wrong

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Normally yes, over roughly the first 10 years of your working life salary will go up significantly, after which it flattens out. Family should not matter, but experience does.

While family should not matter officially, I have seen a lot of restructurings in Switzerland and having a family counts a lot. There is a real desire not to put a man who is a breadwinner (yes, it is sexist) out of a job if it can be avoided. Given the choice between Peter Muller with a young child and wife at home, and Jean Dupont, the bachelor who crosses the border every day as a frontalier, they'll protect Peter ever time.
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Old 14.09.2019, 21:07
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Re: Pay rise request went wrong

Please don't tell me that you've been offered a new title, pay rise and paid education and that you felt it wasn't enough…. ?

You should have gracefully accepted, pounced on the opportunity, then shown them your work and studies are worth it. Within two years you could have taken another step on the career ladder.
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Old 14.09.2019, 21:18
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Re: Pay rise request went wrong

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Please don't tell me that you've been offered a new title, pay rise and paid education and that you felt it wasn't enough…. ?

You should have gracefully accepted, pounced on the opportunity, then shown them your work and studies are worth it. Within two years you could have taken another step on the career ladder.
Yes I am telling you....it was not enough...

I am wondering how would you feel if your assistant was taking same salary as yours...

It is not always the title and the promotion...but how much they value you....at least for me....
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