Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Employment  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 27.10.2019, 23:53
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: basel or Zurich
Posts: 146
Groaned at 1 Time in 1 Post
Thanked 53 Times in 37 Posts
ciao has no particular reputation at present
C permit with non-Swiss contract in Asia and required to pay income tax oversea

Hello,

Is anyone who has an experience of the following situation?

- C permit, non-EU. having a non-Swiss contract (the company has no legal entity in CH) and requiring a full income tax to be paid in the country where the company is located (working days are 183 days (6 months or longer)).

I will call the tax office tomorrow to check but if anyone had similar situation, I would appreciate to get some feedback on how to deal with income tax and whether it's better to have a payroll company or just ANOBAG.

Would Swiss be OK with letting me pay a full income tax to the other country and keep C-permit if I pay social security and necessary contributions?

Thank you for your feedback.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 28.10.2019, 00:13
Treverus's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Work in ZH, live in SZ
Posts: 12,575
Groaned at 370 Times in 300 Posts
Thanked 24,164 Times in 8,743 Posts
Treverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond repute
Re: C permit with non-Swiss contract in Asia and required to pay income tax oversea

Quote:
View Post
Would Swiss be OK with letting me pay a full income tax to the other country and keep C-permit if I pay social security and necessary contributions?

Thank you for your feedback.
Why would the Swiss be OK if you work here but decide to not pay the income taxes that are due? Taxes are due where you work and live, not where your employer prefers to pay them...
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Treverus for this useful post:
  #3  
Old 28.10.2019, 07:50
Medea Fleecestealer's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 23,146
Groaned at 456 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 18,374 Times in 10,208 Posts
Medea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond repute
Re: C permit with non-Swiss contract in Asia and required to pay income tax oversea

Indeed, here you pay tax where you're resident which is Switzerland. It may be that there are some double taxation treaties between the two countries so check on that.

Also depending on the type of work the Swiss may still consider you to be an employee of the company and would expect them to pay the necessary contributions. Some professions need at least 3 clients to be considered self-employed.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 28.10.2019, 11:11
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: basel or Zurich
Posts: 146
Groaned at 1 Time in 1 Post
Thanked 53 Times in 37 Posts
ciao has no particular reputation at present
Re: C permit with non-Swiss contract in Asia and required to pay income tax oversea

Thank you very much for your comments.

For someone in a similar situation, here is the info.

I called the Tax office (Kantonale Steueramt knows better than Stadt) and got confirmed that I don't need to pay any tax (not even the difference) on the income as long as there is double-taxation agreement.
As long as I'm here total 6 months per year, C permit is ok.
AHV (Social insurance) is also not required but if i want, I can fill out the form (call AHV office (there is someone speaking English) and they can send it to you) to give it to your company.

Unemployment insurance doesn't seem to be applicable as the employment is not in CH.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 28.10.2019, 11:21
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Zurich
Posts: 68
Groaned at 9 Times in 6 Posts
Thanked 70 Times in 34 Posts
Danieldreier has earned the respect of manyDanieldreier has earned the respect of manyDanieldreier has earned the respect of many
Re: C permit with non-Swiss contract in Asia and required to pay income tax oversea

If you have a Swiss C residence permit, then you are a tax resident of Switzerland and must pay taxes here. A possible exception applies if the country in which your employer is based has a double taxation treaty with Switzerland AND you are required to pay taxes there. In that case, you may be able to deduct taxes paid in that country from your Swiss tax obligations.

As for social security obligations, ANobAG is a simpler solution for you. In order to register as self-employed, you will normally have to prove that you work for at least 2 different employers. As a self-employed sole proprietorship, you will also have to handle bookkeeping and tax reporting for your business and you cannot participate in unemployment insurance.



With the ANobAG status you benefit from unemployment insurance and the admin work pretty much comes down to paying an annual social security bill.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Danieldreier for this useful post:
  #6  
Old 28.10.2019, 11:31
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: basel or Zurich
Posts: 146
Groaned at 1 Time in 1 Post
Thanked 53 Times in 37 Posts
ciao has no particular reputation at present
Re: C permit with non-Swiss contract in Asia and required to pay income tax oversea

Quote:
View Post
If you have a Swiss C residence permit, then you are a tax resident of Switzerland and must pay taxes here. A possible exception applies if the country in which your employer is based has a double taxation treaty with Switzerland AND you are required to pay taxes there. In that case, you may be able to deduct taxes paid in that country from your Swiss tax obligations.

As for social security obligations, ANobAG is a simpler solution for you. In order to register as self-employed, you will normally have to prove that you work for at least 2 different employers. As a self-employed sole proprietorship, you will also have to handle bookkeeping and tax reporting for your business and you cannot participate in unemployment insurance.

With the ANobAG status you benefit from unemployment insurance and the admin work pretty much comes down to paying an annual social security bill.
Thank you for your feedback! Very appreciate it. Yes, because there is a double taxation treaty, I was told by the tax office that I don't need to pay any tax on the income (only pay tax on other assets if I have any house etc in CH). Yes, I will check with a Payroll company for ANobAG. If you have any recommendation for a payroll company (I saw other thread from 2016 so I'm checking Helvetic and Payrollplus.ch), I would appreciate to get the information.

Thank you again.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 28.10.2019, 12:00
Jim2007's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Kt. Bern
Posts: 5,445
Groaned at 327 Times in 244 Posts
Thanked 8,941 Times in 3,919 Posts
Jim2007 has a reputation beyond reputeJim2007 has a reputation beyond reputeJim2007 has a reputation beyond reputeJim2007 has a reputation beyond reputeJim2007 has a reputation beyond reputeJim2007 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: C permit with non-Swiss contract in Asia and required to pay income tax oversea

Quote:
View Post
Thank you for your feedback! Very appreciate it. Yes, because there is a double taxation treaty, I was told by the tax office that I don't need to pay any tax on the income (only pay tax on other assets if I have any house etc in CH). Yes, I will check with a Payroll company for ANobAG. If you have any recommendation for a payroll company (I saw other thread from 2016 so I'm checking Helvetic and Payrollplus.ch), I would appreciate to get the information.

Thank you again.
The information you have been given is almost certainly incorrect. An employee of the local tax office or a payroll company do not have the training nor the experience in international tax law to give you the advice you need.

For instance, with very few exceptions the only people exempt from paying taxes under double tax agreements are diplomats, some state pensioners, employees of some NGOs and a few others. Everyone else ends up paying taxes based on residency and obtaining tax relief based on the rules set out in the double tax agreement.

Likewise with social security payments, you need expert advice as being exempt from paying in has consequences for your future benefits as well.
__________________
"There is no passion to be found playing small - in settling for a life that is less than the one you are capable of living." - Nelson Mandela
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Jim2007 for this useful post:
  #8  
Old 28.10.2019, 12:03
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: basel or Zurich
Posts: 146
Groaned at 1 Time in 1 Post
Thanked 53 Times in 37 Posts
ciao has no particular reputation at present
Re: C permit with non-Swiss contract in Asia and required to pay income tax oversea

Quote:
View Post
The information you have been given is almost certainly incorrect. An employee of the local tax office or a payroll company do not have the training nor the experience in international tax law to give you the advice you need.

For instance, with very few exceptions the only people exempt from paying taxes under double tax agreements are diplomats, some state pensioners, employees of some NGOs and a few others. Everyone else ends up paying taxes based on residency and obtaining tax relief based on the rules set out in the double tax agreement.

Likewise with social security payments, you need expert advice as being exempt from paying in has consequences for your future benefits as well.
Thank you Jim2007. May I ask if you know any expert on this matter? I can contact him/her. Yes it's quite complicated...
Reply With Quote
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Are permit F holders required to pay full tax while working at the UN oscaar Daily life 11 21.06.2018 19:22
C Permit and accepting non Swiss work contract? SwissSara Permits/visas/government 6 10.09.2017 19:40
pay u.s. income tax on swiss medical insurance? aceelee Finance/banking/taxation 1 29.03.2016 11:40
non-EU with B-permit, where to pay tax when I live in Germany grey_md Finance/banking/taxation 2 30.09.2007 15:20
Starting a Swiss firm with foreign income, what a re tax and legal implications? dcribb Business & entrepreneur 9 12.07.2007 13:07


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 12:47.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0