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  #61  
Old 08.01.2020, 20:34
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Re: job offer: 70000 CHF as software engineer, what are your thoughts?

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-Offer me 78k CHF.
-Accomodation included in a hotel the 3 first weeks.
-German course: no.
-Launchs included: no.
It's a good start, similar to mine at the time. You will be able to save a decent amount without starving. Very few jobs offer lunch, German is offered only if the company really wants to grow you in a role requiring it.

From what you wrote about the company and from the salary, it's not a situation that you want to become permanent, so if you take it be prepared to start looking around after a few months. And possibly try to learn German during weekends, if you start relatively soon it won't be too stressful.

I am happy for your negotiation, sleep over it and then follow your instinct
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  #62  
Old 08.01.2020, 20:40
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Re: job offer: 70000 CHF as software engineer, what are your thoughts?

If you get a B Permit you can get a voucher for German classes. I did Deutsch Intensiv under the voucher scheme in Basel when I first got my permit, but I had to ask for the voucher when I went to the immigration department to register with my paperwork like my marriage certificate. My OH missed out on free lessons as he initially came on an L permit.
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  #63  
Old 08.01.2020, 20:55
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Re: job offer: 70000 CHF as software engineer, what are your thoughts?

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If you get a B Permit you can get a voucher for German classes. I did Deutsch Intensiv under the voucher scheme in Basel when I first got my permit, but I had to ask for the voucher when I went to the immigration department to register with my paperwork like my marriage certificate. My OH missed out on free lessons as he initially came on an L permit.
Many thanks. This is the kind of things I would like to hear, how to cut bills.
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  #64  
Old 08.01.2020, 21:05
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Re: job offer: 70000 CHF as software engineer, what are your thoughts?

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Hello again, very interesting discussion, even trolls have apported good answers

This morning I have requested 80K CHF, some benefits for launch and initial accomodation, and a German course. Tomorrow they will answer.

Respect to the doubts generated, I will clarify some points:

-The position is permanent. So I would get the C-perm, I suppose.

-The position is for implementing industrial software, not android apps neither fintech, etc.

-The company that offered this to me is an Italian consultancy, and based on the glassdoor comments, it is the typical meance-meat organization that sells engineers by weight. They don't mind your experience, only mind to have monkeys coding crap faster and cheaper possible. My intention is not to remain in this kind of companies, but put a feet into the country and then we will see.

-I am Senior Engineer (+15 years experience in industrial field + research experience in mathematics, not IT), but really I have been involved intensively in industrial software development since 4 years ago, in an effort for recycling; can I consider myself as Senior for the position? I don't know, but I couldn't imagine that 4 years later I will touch the door of Switzerland; for me it is a great success.

-I have worked in Spain and Italy, and I corrobore the impressions read here: good countries for tourism and retirement, but lamentably it is almost impossible to develop a career as engineer, due to low wages, scarce contracts and in general lack of opportunities; once reached a permanent position of around 30/40KÄ it is very difficult to rise more.

Thanks to all for the answers. Regards.
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Hello again, the result of the negotiation:

-Offer me 78k CHF.
-Accomodation included in a hotel the 3 first weeks.
-German course: no.
-Launchs included: no.

Well, my answer would be yes, but first I would like to comment in my actual job, where I know they need me now with urgency, who knows, maybe they counter-offer an attractive salary increase.
Well done you have made the smart decision and it sounds like you understand the situation perfectly which will really help you to keep the right positive mentality for the first couple of years. You can try of course for more money but don't push them too far over the edge where they get angry and look for someone else. Maybe try and push them for a GA (yearly travel card for Switzerland) as that would be a really useful thing to have.

The moment you get here get to know and research the market see what skills are in demand and work hard to keep your skills up to date and train new ones if needed. Do everything you can to make moving jobs later easier.

Most of all... make sure you relax and explore this amazing country. Meet people and have fun.
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  #65  
Old 08.01.2020, 21:21
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Re: job offer: 70000 CHF as software engineer, what are your thoughts?

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If you get a B Permit you can get a voucher for German classes. I did Deutsch Intensiv under the voucher scheme in Basel when I first got my permit, but I had to ask for the voucher when I went to the immigration department to register with my paperwork like my marriage certificate. My OH missed out on free lessons as he initially came on an L permit.
This may be the case in Basel but itís not the case everywhere. The cantons and to a certain extent the communes vary enormously on the amount of support the offer with regards to learning the language.
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  #66  
Old 08.01.2020, 22:15
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Re: job offer: 70000 CHF as software engineer, what are your thoughts?

Does lohncomputer also mention the compulsory health insurance? If not, then add another 350-450 to the monthly payments.
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  #67  
Old 09.01.2020, 01:16
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Re: job offer: 70000 CHF as software engineer, what are your thoughts?

It sounds like exploitation to me.
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  #68  
Old 09.01.2020, 12:00
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Re: job offer: 70000 CHF as software engineer, what are your thoughts?

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Does lohncomputer also mention the compulsory health insurance? If not, then add another 350-450 to the monthly payments.
I'm with Assura with complimentary coverage or whatever the translation is (extra ambulance costs, private room in hospital, etc) and I wil pay 250.75 CHF per month during 2020.

For learning deutsch there's www.ecap.ch It's an NGO that charges 260 CHF for A1 to B1 courses. I studied in Baden, but there are many schools around Switzerland.
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  #69  
Old 09.01.2020, 13:03
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Re: job offer: 70000 CHF as software engineer, what are your thoughts?

I would take it.

Living there is much cheaper in general than compared to Zrh/Gva or even BSL.
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  #70  
Old 09.01.2020, 19:28
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Re: job offer: 70000 CHF as software engineer, what are your thoughts?

Last update, as #64 proposed, I have requested the yearly GA card in the contract, but they have denied it.

Last chance, or I take or I leave it, I have till tomorrow morning to accept...
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  #71  
Old 09.01.2020, 21:47
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Re: job offer: 70000 CHF as software engineer, what are your thoughts?

Go for it. The money could be better, but this is just to get your foot in the door. You've negotiated them up from their initial offer. I'd be satisfied with the increase.
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  #72  
Old 10.01.2020, 07:14
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Re: job offer: 70000 CHF as software engineer, what are your thoughts?

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Last update, as #64 proposed, I have requested the yearly GA card in the contract, but they have denied it.

Last chance, or I take or I leave it, I have till tomorrow morning to accept...
Take it and use the chance to change your life. You already told us you are stuck in a place with low prospects and opportunities, so realistically what have you got to lose? New country, fresh start, more opportunities... give your life a reboot and at worst it will be a big injection of new stimulating experiences and some valuable learning.

Last edited by Chuff; 10.01.2020 at 07:27.
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  #73  
Old 10.01.2020, 09:36
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Re: job offer: 70000 CHF as software engineer, what are your thoughts?

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Take it and use the chance to change your life. You already told us you are stuck in a place with low prospects and opportunities, so realistically what have you got to lose? New country, fresh start, more opportunities... give your life a reboot and at worst it will be a big injection of new stimulating experiences and some valuable learning.
Plus if he has no family obligations attached, the worst case scenario is to quit and go back home. He could use this opportunity to enjoy Switzerland, if nothing else better comes out of it.

OP, do you think it will be difficult to get a job if you return? If not, you really have little to none to lose.
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  #74  
Old 12.01.2020, 00:57
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Re: job offer: 70000 CHF as software engineer, what are your thoughts?

In Spain and Italy it is easy to get an engineer job...if you conform with less than 30k €. Yes I could return without excessive problems.
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  #75  
Old 12.01.2020, 21:42
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Re: job offer: 70000 CHF as software engineer, what are your thoughts?

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including a good flat rent of 1381 CHF
I figure Nidwalden should be cheaper than Basel to rent, and you should be able to get a solid apartment for at least 200 less than that - just shop around smartly.
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  #76  
Old 17.01.2020, 15:19
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Re: job offer: 70000 CHF as software engineer, what are your thoughts?

Hi,

The offer is quite low, however if you want a foot in the door I guess it's a good way to start.
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  #77  
Old 17.01.2020, 19:05
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Re: job offer: 70000 CHF as software engineer, what are your thoughts?

I guess itís an okay wage if your from Spain, k.
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  #78  
Old 17.01.2020, 19:24
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Re: job offer: 70000 CHF as software engineer, what are your thoughts?

Probably excellent for you, Peter, irrespective of where you come from
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  #79  
Old 18.01.2020, 08:28
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Re: job offer: 70000 CHF as software engineer, what are your thoughts?

The cost of living is much lower in Spain than other countries so itís a relevant point. But actually, itís a terrible salary as if Peter travels outside the city in Switzerland everything will be expensive. So itís like living in a prison.
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  #80  
Old 18.01.2020, 09:16
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Re: job offer: 70000 CHF as software engineer, what are your thoughts?

Check also how the tax rates are in Nidwalden. For a younger person think also that there is not much happening in Nidwalden and establishing social contacts will be difficult. If you are from Spain it will be quite a culture shock. Getting a GA so you can travel at weekends is a good idea, especially if the company would pay for it. Weekends or just Saturdays in Milano are an option from Nidwalden
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