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Old 28.01.2020, 15:23
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Employment lawyers

Anyone know any good ones? And how much Im likely to have to pay for some initial guidance?
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Old 28.01.2020, 15:43
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Re: Employment lawyers

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Anyone know any good ones? And how much Im likely to have to pay for some initial guidance?

A lot and it's probably a total waste of money, employment lawe ion Switzerland is fairly clear cut, providing both parties stick to the contract which is governed by Code d'Obligations, then thir is not much to do.


Here is very different from UK
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Old 28.01.2020, 15:48
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Re: Employment lawyers

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Anyone know any good ones? And how much I'm likely to have to pay for some initial guidance?
If this is related to the other thread I wouldn't attempt to fight this and hit the job market instead. It's really not worth your effort or time.

(From personal experience, although I "won" it cost me a lot personally.)

If your company has a union and you are a member you can normally get good advice for free. You are unlikely to win in court unless some serious situation or law is broken.

Your other option is to drag it out, and play them at their own game.

Play the performance plan game and find something else in the meantime.

However, players of this "game" will note that it impacts your mental wellbeing and getting a good reference for another position may be difficult. They may attempt to put you in an impossible situation where you cannot achieve whatever goals they set (if hell-bent on pushing you out.)

Ensure that deliverables are SMART and precise do not agree to anything unless it's completely understood. Usually written up by HR lackies so...if they can't understand how can you be expected too?

You could also speak to the RAV (Unemployment office) for general advice.

They're not just there to harass you to apply for jobs when you're unemployed but they know the tactics used by companies to remove staff. They give good advice in Zug anyway. They'll also help you in the local job market. They want you working not on the RAV so it's in their interest to help you!

The final option is cards on the table "pay me off to go away" the cost to them is a good reference and notice period salary + additional for "stress."

The last one, be careful with as you may take a penalty in any claim for RAV.

You find most of the types putting you in this situation would rather end the situation than take the performance plan route. It saves your sanity too but comes with the risk of not finding a job.
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Old 28.01.2020, 15:56
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Re: Employment lawyers

I can give you the same advice for only half the money.

"Start looking around"
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Old 28.01.2020, 15:58
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Re: Employment lawyers

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I can give you the same advice for only half the money.

"Start looking around"
Agree, without a legal insurance that will cover your costs plus an EXCEPTIONALLY good case that is covered within the mandatory social requirements of your employer then it’s really not worth it.

But you are pushing for it, and so I wish you the best of luck.
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Old 28.01.2020, 16:01
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Re: Employment lawyers

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And how much Im likely to have to pay for some initial guidance?
In my case, it was worth it since I was undergoing cancer treatment at the time of my company's layoffs. But normally, it is not...don't waste your money.

I paid 5,000 CHF since I did not have legal insurance at the time. This was for about 15 hours of work max.

Wishing you luck!
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Old 28.01.2020, 16:16
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Re: Employment lawyers

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A lot and it's probably a total waste of money, employment lawe ion Switzerland is fairly clear cut, providing both parties stick to the contract which is governed by Code d'Obligations, then thir is not much to do.


Here is very different from UK
Just a side: You realize that your keyboard has a problem I guess?
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Old 28.01.2020, 16:25
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Re: Employment lawyers

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In my case, it was worth it since I was undergoing cancer treatment at the time of my company's layoffs. But normally, it is not...don't waste your money.

I paid 5,000 CHF since I did not have legal insurance at the time. This was for about 15 hours of work max.

Wishing you luck!

You were sick, very different rules apply



Like you cannot be fired if you're sick or pregnant


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Just a side: You realize that your keyboard has a problem I guess?

I'm dyslexic......
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Old 28.01.2020, 16:26
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Re: Employment lawyers

not quite sure you understand how little rights you have here

you can be fired here at any time for no reason, in fact its better from HR's point of view if no reason is given then they have nothing to worry about.

Just a you're no longer required, don't come in again, you're on gardening leave
for the X months notice period your contract says, and that's it, you're out the door and there is nothing you can do about it.
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Old 28.01.2020, 16:26
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Re: Employment lawyers

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You were sick, very different rules apply



Like you cannot be fired if you're sick or pregnant





I'm dyslexic......
not quite, you can be fired while your sick, it just takes a bit longer
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Old 28.01.2020, 16:28
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Re: Employment lawyers

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I paid 5,000 CHF since I did not have legal insurance at the time. This was for about 15 hours of work max.
Wishing you luck!

I was going to say about Fr 300 an hour/letter
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Old 28.01.2020, 16:54
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Re: Employment lawyers

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Anyone know any good ones? And how much Im likely to have to pay for some initial guidance?
There is very little actual labour law in Switzerland and consequently there is little motivation to specialise in this area. So basically pick anyone you like and go with them, expect to pay any thing up to 6k for the pleasure and don't expect a positive outcome because you have very few rights.
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Old 28.01.2020, 18:01
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Re: Employment lawyers

In Basel the Arbeitsamt offers free legal advice and maybe there's something like that near you. Although it does very much depend on who is on on the day. They told me about another free (ish) legal advice place and there they gave me a list of local lawyers and recommended a couple from the list.
I didn't need to use any lawyer in the end (not yet anyway) so I can't say how much it would cost.
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Old 29.01.2020, 08:44
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Re: Employment lawyers

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not quite, you can be fired while your sick, it just takes a bit longer
Yes you absolutely can be fired while sick. I had proof that they forced me to work while sick and hired the lawyer to show I wouldn't go down without a fight...it worked and I was able to heal mostly in peace.

My doctors and lawyers all said that if a case does go to court (which is rare), the judge usually sides with the employee. You just have to have a good case to present...
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Old 29.01.2020, 09:23
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Re: Employment lawyers

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My doctors and lawyers all said that if a case does go to court (which is rare), the judge usually sides with the employee. You just have to have a good case to present...
Had a former colleague who was in a similar position and the judge indeed sided with her in two courts.
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Old 29.01.2020, 11:43
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Re: Employment lawyers

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My doctors and lawyers all said that if a case does go to court (which is rare), the judge usually sides with the employee. You just have to have a good case to present...
Courts generally do side with the person who has a good case.
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Old 29.01.2020, 15:47
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Re: Employment lawyers

My contribution: make sure that you have legal insurance before bad stuff happens.
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Old 29.01.2020, 15:51
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Re: Employment lawyers

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Courts generally do side with the person who has a good case.
Well, don’t believe that they are hostile to the employee in most cases. But I do know that the Arbeitsgericht (Labour Court) works within very limited legal liability amounts which can be awarded in Switzerland. In-fact it more or less comes down to a spreadsheet calculation. It will rarely go above a couple of times your monthly salary when being awarded, so don’t go looking for big settlements. And you will still need a lawyer.

Larger companies prefer to settle out-of-court, and as long as your case is really good, you have a good lawyer, and the case proves an actual breach of standard labour law within Switzerland (or legally documented company internal policies), then this can be the best way.

Personally I wouldn’t go near it without legal insurance and a lot of nerves.
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Old 30.01.2020, 10:08
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Re: Employment lawyers

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Anyone know any good ones? And how much Im likely to have to pay for some initial guidance?

Legal insurance. It normally covers labour law.



Note that there usually a waiting time of (~ 3 months if i remember correctly) before the legal insurance can step in a dispute. However, I believe once you purchase a policy you are entitled for legal advice via the phone (you can confirm that with the provider of your choice), where you basically talk to a labour law attorney and can ask for advice over the phone.


Cost:



While it depends on which policy you take, roughly speaking... a policy for one year would be the cost of 1 hour consultation with a lawyer.
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Old 30.01.2020, 13:37
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Re: Employment lawyers

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Legal insurance. It normally covers labour law.



Note that there usually a waiting time of (~ 3 months if i remember correctly) before the legal insurance can step in a dispute. However, I believe once you purchase a policy you are entitled for legal advice via the phone (you can confirm that with the provider of your choice), where you basically talk to a labour law attorney and can ask for advice over the phone.


Cost:
.





While it depends on which policy you take, roughly speaking... a policy for one year would be the cost of 1 hour consultation with a lawyer.

I‘ve always been with Protekta for private legal insurance, and pay about CHF 140 per year.

For this I’m covered for legal costs of up to CHF 1 million in the case of a dispute. I can choose my lawyer, according to the needs of the case.

You also need to be aware that the legal insurance you take out depends on the type of case, so a transport insurance for driving won‘t cover other types of legal insurance etc.

It‘s clear, as in most insurance policies, that there is a waiting period before filing a claim after initiating the insurance, and that the dispute cannot have been in progress when taking out the insurance.

https://www.protekta.ch/de
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