Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Employment  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #41  
Old 19.05.2020, 15:05
Karl's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Here
Posts: 1,930
Groaned at 181 Times in 82 Posts
Thanked 2,829 Times in 913 Posts
Karl has a reputation beyond reputeKarl has a reputation beyond reputeKarl has a reputation beyond reputeKarl has a reputation beyond reputeKarl has a reputation beyond reputeKarl has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Finding out minimum salary needed to survive/thrive for family with 4 kids in Vau

140K is doable if you follow these simple rules:

- Don't eat out
- Grocery shop in Germany/France

Nothing much else can be avoided.
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 19.05.2020, 15:12
st2lemans's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Lugano
Posts: 28,278
Groaned at 1,898 Times in 1,440 Posts
Thanked 33,339 Times in 15,906 Posts
st2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Finding out minimum salary needed to survive/thrive for family with 4 kids in Vau

Quote:
View Post
140K is doable if you follow these simple rules:

- Don't eat out
- Grocery shop in Germany/France

Nothing much else can be avoided.
If you follow those rules, even half that is doable.

Tom
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank st2lemans for this useful post:
  #43  
Old 19.05.2020, 15:23
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Zurich
Posts: 12,085
Groaned at 830 Times in 583 Posts
Thanked 16,511 Times in 6,481 Posts
Chuff has a reputation beyond reputeChuff has a reputation beyond reputeChuff has a reputation beyond reputeChuff has a reputation beyond reputeChuff has a reputation beyond reputeChuff has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Finding out minimum salary needed to survive/thrive for family with 4 kids in Vau

Quote:
View Post
If you follow those rules, even half that is doable.

Tom
70k for a family of 6 would be at all comfortable? Really? You are so full of absolute and utter BS that it's actually painful to read your constantly egotistical, attention-seeking and generally factually incorrect posts.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Chuff for this useful post:
The following 2 users groan at Chuff for this post:
  #44  
Old 19.05.2020, 15:51
Belgianmum's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Neuchâtel
Posts: 11,225
Groaned at 168 Times in 151 Posts
Thanked 17,256 Times in 7,352 Posts
Belgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Finding out minimum salary needed to survive/thrive for family with 4 kids in Vau

Quote:
View Post
70k for a family of 6 would be at all comfortable? Really? You are so full of absolute and utter BS that it's actually painful to read your constantly egotistical, attention-seeking and generally factually incorrect posts.
He didn’t say comfortable, he said doable. There’s a difference between the two.
Reply With Quote
The following 5 users would like to thank Belgianmum for this useful post:
  #45  
Old 19.05.2020, 15:55
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Vaud
Posts: 2,331
Groaned at 158 Times in 110 Posts
Thanked 4,592 Times in 1,766 Posts
Mikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Finding out minimum salary needed to survive/thrive for family with 4 kids in Vau

Quote:
View Post
He didn’t say comfortable, he said doable. There’s a difference between the two.
Really, its not an achievable budget. this is not a competition to see who can live on the breadline the most, its about being realistic. for a family of six, a combined income of 70,000CHF, in Switzerland, is too low without running into debt.

Health insurance: 1500
House: 2000 absolute floor for 6 people.
transport: 400
television / telephone: 200
bills: 250
food: 1200

Total: 5550, which is a lower net annual amount than a 70000CHF gross salary. You really cannot get by on that.
Reply With Quote
  #46  
Old 19.05.2020, 16:03
st2lemans's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Lugano
Posts: 28,278
Groaned at 1,898 Times in 1,440 Posts
Thanked 33,339 Times in 15,906 Posts
st2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Finding out minimum salary needed to survive/thrive for family with 4 kids in Vau

Quote:
View Post
Health insurance: 1500 900 (children are cheap, and some give you the 4th for free)
House: 2000 absolute floor for 6 people. 1000 if you own it, maybe less.
Tom
Reply With Quote
  #47  
Old 19.05.2020, 16:54
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Leimbach, Zürich
Posts: 7,766
Groaned at 435 Times in 361 Posts
Thanked 9,476 Times in 4,544 Posts
EdwinNL has a reputation beyond reputeEdwinNL has a reputation beyond reputeEdwinNL has a reputation beyond reputeEdwinNL has a reputation beyond reputeEdwinNL has a reputation beyond reputeEdwinNL has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Finding out minimum salary needed to survive/thrive for family with 4 kids in Vau

Quote:
View Post
Tom
I'll help you a little.

Child allowance minimum of 9.600,- per year.

And yes it is doable according to the calculator, but it would suck so majorly and is actually so risky that one should really not try it. One should not run into major expenses like 3 of the kids needing braces in the same year and some extra health problems eating up the deductibles of half the family. No restaurants, no ice-cream in town (unless one buys a box at the supermarket) no travel since a car would be too expensive and public transport with 6 is damn expensive.

And owning... Who on earth with 70K and 4 kids owns a house and actually can afford to maintain it? due to lack of money it would just rot away.
__________________
Everything we do before a pandemic will seem alarmist. Everything we do after will seem inadequate

Last edited by EdwinNL; 19.05.2020 at 17:20. Reason: Avoiding appearing utterly drunk.
Reply With Quote
  #48  
Old 19.05.2020, 17:03
st2lemans's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Lugano
Posts: 28,278
Groaned at 1,898 Times in 1,440 Posts
Thanked 33,339 Times in 15,906 Posts
st2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Finding out minimum salary needed to survive/thrive for family with 4 kids in Vau

Quote:
View Post
And owning... Who on earth with 70K and 4 kids owns a house and actually can afford to maintain it?
Someone who bought it before, or with inherited money, and does their own maintenance.

I know several Swiss who have done so.

Tom
Reply With Quote
  #49  
Old 19.05.2020, 17:03
omtatsat's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: CH
Posts: 10,566
Groaned at 1,993 Times in 1,088 Posts
Thanked 4,915 Times in 3,110 Posts
omtatsat omtatsat omtatsat omtatsat omtatsat
Re: Finding out minimum salary needed to survive/thrive for family with 4 kids in Vau

Quote:
View Post
Hi,

We are contemplating moving back to Switzerland (we are both Swiss, but have lived out of the country for the past 7 years, and 4 kids later...

and we are having a hard time finding out realistic info about how much we would potentially need to be earning in order to have any kind of a "good" standard of living (not just barely surviving)...

Does anyone know of any good websites or calculators where you can calculate how much we would need to earn to successfully live there again? When we left my husband had a pretty good salary, he's in IT and would now be at a senior level manager level - we would be looking at jobs for him in the Geneva area...

Its something that is a very sticky point of discussion between us, as I really want to move back, but he is concerned its going to be much more expensive to live there than we think, now with 4 kids...so we are weighing up pros and cons....

Do any of you have any experience in Vaud with lots of kids and what your quality of life has been like if you aren't on a very generous salary? (ie. over 200,000


From what I am looking at in terms of costs we would need to earn a min. of about 140,000 to even barely survive, what with costs to rent, car costs, food etc....is that realistic do you think? Higher or lower???
If you are living in Australia stay there. Australia has so much to offer.
Reply With Quote
  #50  
Old 19.05.2020, 17:04
Belgianmum's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Neuchâtel
Posts: 11,225
Groaned at 168 Times in 151 Posts
Thanked 17,256 Times in 7,352 Posts
Belgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Finding out minimum salary needed to survive/thrive for family with 4 kids in Vau

Quote:
View Post
I'll help you a little.

Child allowance minimum of 9.600,- per month.
I know child allowance in Switzerland is very generous but there is no way they’ll be getting 9600 chf per month.


70 000 chf per year would be very tight indeed but it is doable. Having said that I don’t think the OP would be making the move to Switzerland for that salary so it’s a moot point.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Belgianmum for this useful post:
  #51  
Old 19.05.2020, 17:05
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Finding out minimum salary needed to survive/thrive for family with 4 kids in Vau

2000 for a flat/rental is Zurich/Geneva prices- location, location, location.
Reply With Quote
  #52  
Old 19.05.2020, 17:11
omtatsat's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: CH
Posts: 10,566
Groaned at 1,993 Times in 1,088 Posts
Thanked 4,915 Times in 3,110 Posts
omtatsat omtatsat omtatsat omtatsat omtatsat
Re: Finding out minimum salary needed to survive/thrive for family with 4 kids in Vau

Quote:
2000 for a flat/rental is Zurich/Geneva prices- location, location, location.
4 children. At least 5 room apartment. Minimum 3500-6000
Reply With Quote
  #53  
Old 19.05.2020, 17:19
MusicChick's Avatar
modified, reprogrammed and doctored²
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: La Cote
Posts: 14,589
Groaned at 262 Times in 192 Posts
Thanked 16,881 Times in 8,724 Posts
MusicChick has a reputation beyond reputeMusicChick has a reputation beyond reputeMusicChick has a reputation beyond reputeMusicChick has a reputation beyond reputeMusicChick has a reputation beyond reputeMusicChick has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Finding out minimum salary needed to survive/thrive for family with 4 kids in Vau

Quote:
View Post
70k for a family of 6 would be at all comfortable? Really? You are so full of absolute and utter BS that it's actually painful to read your constantly egotistical, attention-seeking and generally factually incorrect posts.
I would agree with you, if you said it more politely.

I don't get why expats and locals constantly get compared. I can see and live it every day. That's why I pointed out to OP actually that I thought they had a family here to come back to, since their calculation might be different.

Absolutely all local families I know here have some sorts of help from other generations. If it is not financial, ie inheritance or putting down the downpayment for a morgage and then just paying the morgage themselves, or helping kids with birthday/xmas/bike/cell money, paying some courses (like ballet and horse-riding my buddy and her brothers got paid by grandparents), paying for tutors, musical instruments, helping out with other fees, etc. Then it is not monetary, too - baby sitting, child care at least one evening a week, or an afternoon, etc. This all has an impact on the budget and quality of life here.

Then - the cost of life is so different in the boonies (quiet, beautiful and remote) where of course, are very low chances for reliable jobs for new comers or you spend your day in traffic commuting, tbh. and the cost of life in GE, VD (expensive as GE but different job market offers) and ZH.

Tom in Ticino is going to logically present different scenario, his life quality might represent his resourcefulness, thriftiness or the fact that where he lives and his local family the life might just cost less than GE, VD, ZH...etc. If you start renting now, your rents are high. Those who started decades ago or bought, they live so much cheaper now, pay a fraction.

So, why the friction? Yes, locals and expacts will definitely come accross different expenses. It is interesting though, that it is not always true, depends on how resourceful one is, forward thinking, integrating with local languages, other many factors. I like the challenge.

But there is no competition on who can survive on less. It is more important to help echother, we bring skillsets, we learn new ones here..swap services, take care of eachothers' kids, learn how to save and where to not save. Personal responsibility is valued here, it is expected both from locals and expats, I like how democratically. Moving somewhere with 4 kids (and maybe 5 dependants) and not thinking about pension, though, might be viewed by the system as irresponsible.

But if OP asks a question on salary and we answer yes, there are locals (with networks built over generations) who live on little...I don't think that it helps too much. They also have their own challenges. But it is also good to know if OP is coming to a familiar situation here (they lived here before, speak the langauge, can both get good jobs?) or to a place where there is already family, potential jobs, etc. Minimum salary of one adult or two? Will OP's husband pay her pension and insurances, trips home?
__________________
"L'homme ne peut pas remplacer son coeur avec sa tete, ni sa tete avec ses mains." J.H. Pestalozzi

“The only difference between a rut and a grave is a matter of depth.” S.P. Cadman

Last edited by MusicChick; 19.05.2020 at 18:48.
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank MusicChick for this useful post:
  #54  
Old 19.05.2020, 17:22
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Leimbach, Zürich
Posts: 7,766
Groaned at 435 Times in 361 Posts
Thanked 9,476 Times in 4,544 Posts
EdwinNL has a reputation beyond reputeEdwinNL has a reputation beyond reputeEdwinNL has a reputation beyond reputeEdwinNL has a reputation beyond reputeEdwinNL has a reputation beyond reputeEdwinNL has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Finding out minimum salary needed to survive/thrive for family with 4 kids in Vau

Quote:
View Post
I know child allowance in Switzerland is very generous but there is no way they’ll be getting 9600 chf per month.


70 000 chf per year would be very tight indeed but it is doable. Having said that I don’t think the OP would be making the move to Switzerland for that salary so it’s a moot point.
9.600,- minimum a year, my bad.

Quote:
2000 for a flat/rental is Zurich/Geneva prices- location, location, location.
We'd wish, in or near town you'll only find a total dump for such prices and so many rooms.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank EdwinNL for this useful post:
  #55  
Old 19.05.2020, 17:26
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Leimbach, Zürich
Posts: 7,766
Groaned at 435 Times in 361 Posts
Thanked 9,476 Times in 4,544 Posts
EdwinNL has a reputation beyond reputeEdwinNL has a reputation beyond reputeEdwinNL has a reputation beyond reputeEdwinNL has a reputation beyond reputeEdwinNL has a reputation beyond reputeEdwinNL has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Finding out minimum salary needed to survive/thrive for family with 4 kids in Vau

Quote:
View Post
Someone who bought it before, or with inherited money, and does their own maintenance.

I know several Swiss who have done so.

Tom
Even if one does their own maintenance, it is simply not sustainable in the long run. Short run and only needing some wood and paint and a few screws yeah sure. Long run where roof needs work, windows need replacement, a kitchen needs replacement, or electrics needs updating simply is a no go on such budget.

Now surely you know somebody who did it all with ease 600 years ago, 12 children and even managed to save up decent money while going shopping in Italy and doing 3 holidays a year, while enjoying dozens of handy friends around and a friendly bakery who just give them the bread if there was no cash for a week, and a mum around the corner who let them use her car for free.
__________________
Everything we do before a pandemic will seem alarmist. Everything we do after will seem inadequate
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank EdwinNL for this useful post:
  #56  
Old 19.05.2020, 17:26
omtatsat's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: CH
Posts: 10,566
Groaned at 1,993 Times in 1,088 Posts
Thanked 4,915 Times in 3,110 Posts
omtatsat omtatsat omtatsat omtatsat omtatsat
Re: Finding out minimum salary needed to survive/thrive for family with 4 kids in Vau

Quote:
View Post
I'll help you a little.

Child allowance minimum of 9.600,- per year.

And yes it is doable according to the calculator, but it would suck so majorly and is actually so risky that one should really not try it. One should not run into major expenses like 3 of the kids needing braces in the same year and some extra health problems eating up the deductibles of half the family. No restaurants, no ice-cream in town (unless one buys a box at the supermarket) no travel since a car would be too expensive and public transport with 6 is damn expensive.

And owning... Who on earth with 70K and 4 kids owns a house and actually can afford to maintain it? due to lack of money it would just rot away.
Child allowance only for those with low income-max CHF 42,000 ( taxaxable income ). Switzerland is really NOT generous with such help.
Reply With Quote
  #57  
Old 19.05.2020, 17:33
st2lemans's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Lugano
Posts: 28,278
Groaned at 1,898 Times in 1,440 Posts
Thanked 33,339 Times in 15,906 Posts
st2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Finding out minimum salary needed to survive/thrive for family with 4 kids in Vau

Quote:
View Post
Even if one does their own maintenance, it is simply not sustainable in the long run. Short run and only needing some wood and paint and a few screws yeah sure. Long run where roof needs work, windows need replacement, a kitchen needs replacement, or electrics needs updating simply is a no go on such budget.
For electrics, we did RAVI last year, we are good for the next 19!

Roof, lift, etc. are included in the 1k/year (we have a fund).

Tom
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users groan at st2lemans for this post:
  #58  
Old 19.05.2020, 17:38
Belgianmum's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Neuchâtel
Posts: 11,225
Groaned at 168 Times in 151 Posts
Thanked 17,256 Times in 7,352 Posts
Belgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Finding out minimum salary needed to survive/thrive for family with 4 kids in Vau

Quote:
View Post
Child allowance only for those with low income-max CHF 42,000 ( taxaxable income ). Switzerland is really NOT generous with such help.
Everyone who has kids gets child allowance irrespective of income unless they are self employed.
They receive it for kids up to age 26 (I think) as long as they are pursuing an education and that includes apprenticeships.
Reply With Quote
  #59  
Old 19.05.2020, 17:38
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Leimbach, Zürich
Posts: 7,766
Groaned at 435 Times in 361 Posts
Thanked 9,476 Times in 4,544 Posts
EdwinNL has a reputation beyond reputeEdwinNL has a reputation beyond reputeEdwinNL has a reputation beyond reputeEdwinNL has a reputation beyond reputeEdwinNL has a reputation beyond reputeEdwinNL has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Finding out minimum salary needed to survive/thrive for family with 4 kids in Vau

Quote:
View Post
Child allowance only for those with low income-max CHF 42,000 ( taxaxable income ). Switzerland is really NOT generous with such help.
That limit is only for unemployed people, people with a job have no upper-limit on income.
Reply With Quote
  #60  
Old 19.05.2020, 17:40
Belgianmum's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Neuchâtel
Posts: 11,225
Groaned at 168 Times in 151 Posts
Thanked 17,256 Times in 7,352 Posts
Belgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Finding out minimum salary needed to survive/thrive for family with 4 kids in Vau

Quote:
View Post
That limit is only for unemployed people, people with a job have no upper-limit on income.
I think you mean self employed people, unemployed people get child allowance just the same as other employed people.
Reply With Quote
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Salary needed for family of 4 to live comfortably in Zurich Juntilhas Employment 73 18.06.2016 10:27
salary needed for a family of 5 in Basel kaatrina Family matters/health 193 06.12.2013 10:45
Please help: Minimum Salary needed for Spouse Visa application getting approved? acase Permits/visas/government 9 01.07.2010 15:34
Can I survive with this salary? aperez Daily life 65 11.05.2010 09:44
Salary needed for family of 4 to live comfortably in Basel sbstreett Family matters/health 73 20.04.2010 15:01


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 05:45.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0