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Old 16.06.2020, 20:38
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Quitting

Hello everyone, I have a simple but complicated question

I want to quit my job in a couple of months due to being very tired and saturated of it.
I've thought about it for months already and to be very honest it is what I'm going to do sooner or later.

My german is not very good, I would say I have the A1 level, I can understand and talk about basic stuff.

I'm willing to go to RAF 2 or 3 months without pay as long as they pay me a german course. My question is, even if they take 2 or 3 months to pay me, can I start the german course in the first month that I register with RAF?

Thanks in advance.
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Old 16.06.2020, 23:29
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Re: Quitting

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I'm willing to go to RAF 2 or 3 months without pay as long as they pay me a german course. My question is, even if they take 2 or 3 months to pay me, can I start the german course in the first month that I register with RAF?
Unlikely. They'll need to go through the first round of meetings, send you for language assessment, then assign you onto a course. And even then, it's not guaranteed.

If you've already registered on one it's very unlikely (as in, no chance whatsoever) that they'll pay for it.

Oh, and it's RAV, by the way, not RAF. The German V is often pronounced like an English F.
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Old 16.06.2020, 23:42
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Re: Quitting

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Hello everyone, I have a simple but complicated question

I want to quit my job in a couple of months due to being very tired and saturated of it.
I've thought about it for months already and to be very honest it is what I'm going to do sooner or later.

My german is not very good, I would say I have the A1 level, I can understand and talk about basic stuff.

I'm willing to go to RAF 2 or 3 months without pay as long as they pay me a german course. My question is, even if they take 2 or 3 months to pay me, can I start the german course in the first month that I register with RAF?

Thanks in advance.
The objective is to get you off the RAV as quickly as possible and a German course does not achieve that objective. They usually only put you on a German cause after they are satisfied that it is the only way to get you off the RAV.
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Old 16.06.2020, 23:45
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Re: Quitting

They will put you into any course, as long as you can prove them, that by completing the course, your chances of getting hired will drastically increase. Talk it over with your RAV advisor and see what the options are.
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Old 17.06.2020, 06:54
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Re: Quitting

What permit do you have and what nationality? How long have you been working in Switzerland? That may affect any ability to claim RAV.
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Old 17.06.2020, 09:24
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Re: Quitting

Do I understand this correctly? You are looking to find a way for the Swiss government to pay you not to work and take German classes?
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Old 13.07.2020, 07:27
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Re: Quitting

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They will put you into any course, as long as you can prove them, that by completing the course, your chances of getting hired will drastically increase. Talk it over with your RAV advisor and see what the options are.
I need to move back to the German part of Switzerland. I don't want to go on a French course and the RAV here are insisting on it.
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Old 17.06.2020, 10:04
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Re: Quitting

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Hello everyone, I have a simple but complicated question

I want to quit my job in a couple of months due to being very tired and saturated of it.
I've thought about it for months already and to be very honest it is what I'm going to do sooner or later.

My german is not very good, I would say I have the A1 level, I can understand and talk about basic stuff.

I'm willing to go to RAF 2 or 3 months without pay as long as they pay me a german course. My question is, even if they take 2 or 3 months to pay me, can I start the german course in the first month that I register with RAF?

Thanks in advance.
On one hand, an economic upheaval is on the way. It may not be the best time to quit the job because getting a new one could be more challenging than before.

On the other hand, you should have a work permit obtained because an employer needed some specific skills. Those skills are so important that the the knowledge of local language was not considered when the permit was emitted. If German was not needed before, why is it needed now?

Finally, there are low cost options www.ecap.ch I went there to learn German up to A2 level, 2 evenings per week during 4 months, 270 CHF.
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Old 17.06.2020, 10:56
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Re: Quitting

Have you thought about asking your boss for 80% or even 60% ? Just tell m you need more time for yourself and that you want to follow a German course to get better integrated.

The worst that can happen is that they say no (at which point you can still quit) or get fired (yey !)
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Old 17.06.2020, 10:56
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Re: Quitting

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On one hand, an economic upheaval is on the way. It may not be the best time to quit the job because getting a new one could be more challenging than before.
Absolutely, also this:

https://www.20min.ch/story/hat-jeman...n-905820452627

People who legitimately sign up for RAV aren't even receiving benefits due to a backlog and are going hungry.
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Old 18.06.2020, 08:48
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Re: Quitting

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Absolutely, also this:

https://www.20min.ch/story/hat-jeman...n-905820452627

People who legitimately sign up for RAV aren't even receiving benefits due to a backlog and are going hungry.

Lack of documentation is causing the delays according to this article? Just what documentation are they talking about? I have signed up with RAV on 5 separate occasions and can´t recall that much documentation being required. Perhaps if less people were assigned to pointless interviews and more to processing claims the system would work more quickly.
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Old 17.06.2020, 11:09
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Re: Quitting

If you are motivated enough there are basically free options to learn German through tandems, self study, getting out and about and practicing what you have learned. I went from rusty high school German to B1 before moving to Switzerland principally through self study. The key for me was just making sure to study and practice regularly i.e. everyday even just for 10 - 15 mins in my lunch break. So I wouldn’t make any decision conditional on getting a free RAV course.

Maybe also take a step back and consider whether there are alternatives before you go for the nuclear option and quit without another job lined up e.g. asking for unpaid leave or trying to engineer a change at work. I always find its amazing how much I feel better about work after a good break. I’ve been through plenty of times when I was basically fed up, burnt out and wanted to jack in work and made changes but in retrospect I think it was rarely the job that was the issue but me. I wasn’t disciplined enough to look after myself and not put work ahead of other things that I enjoyed and that helped keep me happy. I was also probably not brave enough to have honest discussions at work that might have improved the situation. Quitting is always an option once you’ve exhausted the options.
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Old 17.06.2020, 12:25
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Re: Quitting

Sorry for my beef, but it always upsets me when people quit jobs and expect the taxpayer (me included) to fork out for a lifestyle change.

I understand you want to change jobs, and I have no problem with that, but first secure a new position in a field you enjoy, and in the meantime learn German to a higher standard as suggested by fellow posters above.

Leave the RAV to those who really need it whose jobs have gone due to the current situation!
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Old 17.06.2020, 13:06
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Re: Quitting

I'm kinda tired of my job as well, it is stressful and not doing my health much good. However it has some positive sides, pays well, allows some work/life balance and is currently quite secure.

But no way would I quit without another position, especially in these times. German courses can be done cheaper than the income drop you'll have on RAV benefits. And don't forget RAV benefits last for around 20 months..after that the music stops and you won't have a chair...
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Old 17.06.2020, 13:20
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Re: Quitting

You poor baby! Tired of having to do what everyone else does and that is WORK to support themselves. You think you are the only one that gets tired having to work every day at a job they might not particularly love. RAV should not be for lazy scroungers who cannot be bothered to work but for people in genuine need who, through no fault of their own, have been made unemployed and need help to support themselves and their families.

Have some self respect, You currently have a job and regular income so if you want to learn German you have 2 options. A. Pay for it yourself. B. Put in some effort and take advantage of the numerous free options.
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Old 17.06.2020, 18:32
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Re: Quitting

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Sorry for my beef, but it always upsets me when people quit jobs and expect the taxpayer (me included) to fork out for a lifestyle change.

I understand you want to change jobs, and I have no problem with that, but first secure a new position in a field you enjoy, and in the meantime learn German to a higher standard as suggested by fellow posters above.

Leave the RAV to those who really need it whose jobs have gone due to the current situation!
What business is it of yours? If the person qualifies for RAV, then so be it. After all, they paid their contributions into the system. Should they remain miserable and start abusing opioids or self-medicate through other means and then become a real fiscal burden to the system by permanently getting social assistance instead?
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Old 17.06.2020, 20:49
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Re: Quitting

Thanks everyone for their messages. I wasn't expecting this to get this much attention and as a matter of fact a couple of you guys missed the real question "My question is, even if they take 2 or 3 months to pay me, can I start the german course in the first month that I register with RAV?"

But since many of you created a different discussion...

Clearly there are 2 different mindsets and types of thoughts on this situation.

The "don't leave the job" or "don't milk the system" mentality which shows a more conservative approach.

And the other mentalitly which is clearly the one I'm trying to go with, which is, if one is not happy with something, he should seek for a better way of life. Is it a risk? Yes it is, but like I mentioned in my topic, I will leave the job sooner or later, it's not my area of interest and not my field of work as well.
Of course it's normal not to like the job or prefer something else, or prefer to be a pop star musician, yea I get it, but I'm still young, I'm in my early 20s and I'm afraid to take wrong decisions, working in a job which is clearly not what I like and it was just a job to save some money doesn't look like the best decision in life.

Are you guys trying to say that if one starts a career in the wrong path they can't change? Once a housekeeper always a housekeeper?
I need german to pursue the career I want.

For the ones that asked, I have B, I'm from an european country and I work in this job for almost 2 years. I'm in my early 20's. I came to switzerland to save some money to invest in my life or pursue further education. I like switzerland as a country, so I decided to stay longer.

I don't want to "milk" RAV actually, that's why I mentioned I don't even mind not getting paid the first 3 months as long as they pay me the german course from the beginning. I think this is what many people didn't understand, I don't want RAV's money, I want their help to improve my german so I can find a better job in my field. I don't want to stay there for 1 year like many people do.
I think 3, 4 or 5 months would be extremely useful for my german.

For the ones that suggest me trying to learn german for free or in my free time, well, trust me I tried. People are different but in my case I can't seem to focus much on learning while I'm working full time. I tried it for years already, back in my country I was studying 2 times per week while working, and I was even in a 1 day per week german course here in switzerland for as long as 1 year. Did it help? yes, but it's definitly not enough and its a slow process. I like to study so I know if I go to an intesive course I will manage to learn way faster.

And like lost_inbroad said, if I do stay in this job for much longer, I will probably be miserable, which I already am, kinda.
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Old 20.06.2020, 07:15
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Re: Quitting

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What business is it of yours? If the person qualifies for RAV, then so be it. After all, they paid their contributions into the system. Should they remain miserable and start abusing opioids or self-medicate through other means and then become a real fiscal burden to the system by permanently getting social assistance instead?
The system is not a pension. Its not done so that all of us can cash out when we want to. It a safety net meant to help people who are really in need. If OP was not made redundant in the crisis then perhaps he is not that? There are lots of people in that situation and its insensitive to post like this.
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Old 29.06.2020, 05:15
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Re: Quitting

I'd like to add to what others have said about mid 2020 not being the best of times to resign from a job. These are not just the grumblings of boring, preachy old folk who don't understand what it is like to be young and feeling bored and trapped, but a stark reality of the way Swiss unemployment rates have changed since the start of the Corona crisis. Here are just a few examples from the German-speaking Swiss press. Unemployment figures are up, to an unprecedented degree.

https://www.solothurnerzeitung.ch/so...beit-138121861
Solothurn: unemployment increased to 3%, 2260 firms on short work

https://www.nfz.ch/2020/05/die-zahl-...l-markant.html
Fricktal: significant increase in unemployed, way beyond seasonal fluctuations

https://hallowil.ch/leiterin-des-rav...gt-rasant.html
Wil: rapid increase in registrations at RAV

https://www.ag.ch/de/aktuelles/medie...846%20Personen.
Aargau: steep increase in unemployed and job-seekers

https://www.srf.ch/news/wirtschaft/f...uf-3-4-prozent
SRF news: in May, an increase to 3 to 4 percent
  • Knapp 156'000 Menschen waren demnach im Mai als arbeitslos gemeldet – das sind 2585 mehr als noch im April 2020, wie das Staatssekretariat für Wirtschaft (Seco) bekannt gibt.
  • Gegenüber dem Vorjahresmonat (Mai 2019) erhöhte sich die Arbeitslosigkeit um 54'628 Personen. Dies entspricht einem Plus von 53.9 Prozent.
  • According to the State Secretariat for Economic Affairs (Seco), just under 156,000 people were registered as unemployed in May - 2585 more than in April 2020.
  • Compared to the same month last year (May 2019), unemployment rose by 54,628 people. This corresponds to an increase of 53.9 percent.


To go back to your original question:
Quote:
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I want to quit my job in a couple of months due to being very tired and saturated of it.
I've thought about it for months already and to be very honest it is what I'm going to do sooner or later.

My german is not very good, I would say I have the A1 level, I can understand and talk about basic stuff.

I'm willing to go to RAF 2 or 3 months without pay as long as they pay me a german course. My question is, even if they take 2 or 3 months to pay me, can I start the german course in the first month that I register with RAF?

Thanks in advance.
The short answer is "no".
  1. If you start a German course before your file has be processed and your level of unemployment benefits determined, then those course fees will have to come out of your pocket.
  2. If you resign from your current job, then the RAV will count that as a reason to give you "penalty days". During that time, you are not eligible for any benefits... also not course fees.

The RAV, like everything else in Switzerland, is cantonal and municipal, which can influence the way things are done.

In general, the RAV offices have stringent requirements for their registered unemployed people, to send about 10 job applications per month, to appear for interviews with the assigned officer, etc., and as others have said, a lot depends upon the officer, and especially upon their sense of how motivated you are to get back to work.

Having said that, things are rather different now in these Corona-related exceptional circumstances. Many RAVs have a backlog that they can't yet cope with, and which they're now working through. Some RAVs have announced that, until further notice, they will permit registered persons to submit fewer applications. Many are not yet seeing the insured persons in their offices. In time, however, they will.

Such factors, taken together, mean that the RAVs are going to have to re-think its way of doing things. Whether or a RAV will cover the costs of a course is unlikely to be a decision that any RAV will be able to take quickly. And besides, with so many more currently registered people, and possibly more as the economy wobbles, I think it's likely that the extent to which any particular RAV has a budget (or influences a federal office which does) for paying for courses at all… will drop.

So here's my vote for: "Don't resign…. Yet."
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Old 13.07.2020, 01:11
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Re: Quitting

Thanks everyone for their answers, I read every single one of them, sadly I couldnt answer for a while.

I have been having terrible days and avoiding coming online since I have noticed I am feeling very depressed lately, not only due to work factors but due to life problems outside of work..

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I'd like to add to what others have said about mid 2020 not being the best of times to resign from a job. These are not just the grumblings of boring, preachy old folk who don't understand what it is like to be young and feeling bored and trapped, but a stark reality of the way Swiss unemployment rates have changed since the start of the Corona crisis. Here are just a few examples from the German-speaking Swiss press. Unemployment figures are up, to an unprecedented degree.

https://www.solothurnerzeitung.ch/so...beit-138121861
Solothurn: unemployment increased to 3%, 2260 firms on short work

https://www.nfz.ch/2020/05/die-zahl-...l-markant.html
Fricktal: significant increase in unemployed, way beyond seasonal fluctuations

https://hallowil.ch/leiterin-des-rav...gt-rasant.html
Wil: rapid increase in registrations at RAV

https://www.ag.ch/de/aktuelles/medie...846%20Personen.
Aargau: steep increase in unemployed and job-seekers

https://www.srf.ch/news/wirtschaft/f...uf-3-4-prozent
SRF news: in May, an increase to 3 to 4 percent
  • Knapp 156'000 Menschen waren demnach im Mai als arbeitslos gemeldet – das sind 2585 mehr als noch im April 2020, wie das Staatssekretariat für Wirtschaft (Seco) bekannt gibt.
  • Gegenüber dem Vorjahresmonat (Mai 2019) erhöhte sich die Arbeitslosigkeit um 54'628 Personen. Dies entspricht einem Plus von 53.9 Prozent.
  • According to the State Secretariat for Economic Affairs (Seco), just under 156,000 people were registered as unemployed in May - 2585 more than in April 2020.
  • Compared to the same month last year (May 2019), unemployment rose by 54,628 people. This corresponds to an increase of 53.9 percent.


To go back to your original question:


The short answer is "no".
  1. If you start a German course before your file has be processed and your level of unemployment benefits determined, then those course fees will have to come out of your pocket.
  2. If you resign from your current job, then the RAV will count that as a reason to give you "penalty days". During that time, you are not eligible for any benefits... also not course fees.

The RAV, like everything else in Switzerland, is cantonal and municipal, which can influence the way things are done.

In general, the RAV offices have stringent requirements for their registered unemployed people, to send about 10 job applications per month, to appear for interviews with the assigned officer, etc., and as others have said, a lot depends upon the officer, and especially upon their sense of how motivated you are to get back to work.

Having said that, things are rather different now in these Corona-related exceptional circumstances. Many RAVs have a backlog that they can't yet cope with, and which they're now working through. Some RAVs have announced that, until further notice, they will permit registered persons to submit fewer applications. Many are not yet seeing the insured persons in their offices. In time, however, they will.

Such factors, taken together, mean that the RAVs are going to have to re-think its way of doing things. Whether or a RAV will cover the costs of a course is unlikely to be a decision that any RAV will be able to take quickly. And besides, with so many more currently registered people, and possibly more as the economy wobbles, I think it's likely that the extent to which any particular RAV has a budget (or influences a federal office which does) for paying for courses at all… will drop.

So here's my vote for: "Don't resign…. Yet."
I understand, but due to life problems and early signs of depression I feel like I must quit in the near future. When is the best time to do so? I will try to keep the job for as long as I mentally can, trust me
 

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