Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Employment  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 15.10.2020, 19:21
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Aargau
Posts: 2,486
Groaned at 11 Times in 10 Posts
Thanked 3,380 Times in 1,515 Posts
Mullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond repute
Pension Law Changes - Unemployment at 58 and older

Effective 1 January 2021, employees, who are 58 and older and who are terminated by the employer, can remain in the employer's pension plan. This is a translation from a City of Zurich Pension Plan webpage which describes the pension law changes:

"For all insured persons from age 58

From 2021 onwards, it will be possible for all insured persons aged 58 or older to remain in the pension fund if the employment relationship is terminated by the employer.

This improvement in the occupational pension scheme for insured persons is linked to the reform of the supplementary benefits and the corresponding changes in the BVG, which will come into force on 1 January 2021.

Continued insurance as an opportunity

This is an opportunity for you as an insured person in the event of unemployment your pension will be retained. Insured persons whose employment relationship was terminated by the employer after 31.07.2020 can remain insured with the pension fund from 1 January 2021.

The new rules apply from 1 January 2021:

  • Insured persons from age 58 can voluntarily decide to remain with the pension fund if the employer terminates the employment relationship and they are not insured through a new employer.
  • The repayment of a WEF ("promotion of home ownership") advance withdrawal is also made easier: Repayments are now possible until retirement.
  • Reclaims of supplementary benefits can be offset directly against pension fund benefits."
https://www.pkzh.ch/content/pkzh/de/...020-23-07.html
Reply With Quote
The following 13 users would like to thank Mullhollander for this useful post:
  #2  
Old 15.10.2020, 19:40
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: schwyz
Posts: 118
Groaned at 9 Times in 8 Posts
Thanked 16 Times in 11 Posts
NewInSchwyz has annoyed a few people around hereNewInSchwyz has annoyed a few people around here
Re: Pension Law Changes - Unemployment at 58 and older

So letís get this straight. The goverment are making it more expensive for companies to fire older people and therefore they will never hire a 50 year old. Thatís the consequences

I just hope the pension funds are well capitalised and donít go bust like in the Uk
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 15.10.2020, 19:50
newtoswitz's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Rapperswil
Posts: 2,375
Groaned at 35 Times in 32 Posts
Thanked 2,735 Times in 1,263 Posts
newtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Pension Law Changes - Unemployment at 58 and older

I'm not sure it would be that much more expensive - I assume the company doesn't have to keep paying, you just don't have to go to the bureaucracy of moving the funds to another account.
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank newtoswitz for this useful post:
  #4  
Old 15.10.2020, 20:16
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 18,688
Groaned at 355 Times in 284 Posts
Thanked 18,399 Times in 9,928 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Pension Law Changes - Unemployment at 58 and older

Quote:
View Post
I'm not sure it would be that much more expensive - I assume the company doesn't have to keep paying, you just don't have to go to the bureaucracy of moving the funds to another account.
Depending on ones risk profile, moving would probably be preferable. I doubled my Swiss pension in 5 years in CHF with fundsmith. What is the earliest age you can vest the benefits, 63 as pillar 1 or earlier?
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank fatmanfilms for this useful post:
  #5  
Old 15.10.2020, 20:35
aSwissInTheUS's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Zurich area
Posts: 12,040
Groaned at 90 Times in 81 Posts
Thanked 18,325 Times in 8,148 Posts
aSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Pension Law Changes - Unemployment at 58 and older

Quote:
View Post
So letís get this straight. The goverment are making it more expensive for companies to fire older people and therefore they will never hire a 50 year old. Thatís the consequences
For the company it is or should not be more expensive as the pension plan itself is normally outside of the companies budget and the contributions is solely defined by the pay roll of the actual active employees.

It just means that the money remains in the pension plan. The main benefit for the employee is that the get an entitlement for a pension instead of the lumpsum once they reach the pension age.


@fatmanfilms: Depends on the pension plan. Some allow withdrawal at age of 58 to 60.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank aSwissInTheUS for this useful post:
  #6  
Old 15.10.2020, 20:50
Jim2007's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Kt. Bern
Posts: 4,123
Groaned at 167 Times in 142 Posts
Thanked 6,451 Times in 2,935 Posts
Jim2007 has a reputation beyond reputeJim2007 has a reputation beyond reputeJim2007 has a reputation beyond reputeJim2007 has a reputation beyond reputeJim2007 has a reputation beyond reputeJim2007 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Pension Law Changes - Unemployment at 58 and older

Quote:
View Post
It just means that the money remains in the pension plan. The main benefit for the employee is that the get an entitlement for a pension instead of the lumpsum once they reach the pension age.

Depending on the size and state of the pension fund that may or may not be a good situation.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Jim2007 for this useful post:
  #7  
Old 15.10.2020, 20:53
aSwissInTheUS's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Zurich area
Posts: 12,040
Groaned at 90 Times in 81 Posts
Thanked 18,325 Times in 8,148 Posts
aSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Pension Law Changes - Unemployment at 58 and older

Quote:
View Post
Depending on the size and state of the pension fund that may or may not be a good situation.
One has still the option to transfer it to an other vested benefit account with better performance or depending on the age get the money as an early lumpsum payment which would allow to freely invest the money.
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank aSwissInTheUS for this useful post:
  #8  
Old 15.10.2020, 20:59
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: ZH
Posts: 6,973
Groaned at 65 Times in 52 Posts
Thanked 10,121 Times in 4,145 Posts
doropfiz has a reputation beyond reputedoropfiz has a reputation beyond reputedoropfiz has a reputation beyond reputedoropfiz has a reputation beyond reputedoropfiz has a reputation beyond reputedoropfiz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Pension Law Changes - Unemployment at 58 and older

Quote:
View Post
I'm not sure it would be that much more expensive - I assume the company doesn't have to keep paying, you just don't have to go to the bureaucracy of moving the funds to another account.
That's right. The company does not have to pay any further contritutions.

Contributions comprise a risk portion and a savings portion.

For the risk portion, an ex-employee who elects to remain in the company's pension plan must pay in the employee's and the employer's contribution.

If the ex-employee defaults, then the pension plan can warn and, in the absence of the ex-employee catching up those payments, the ex-employee can be excluded from the pension plan.

In other words, the way to keep the cover is to
a) make sure you don't miss the deadline to declare that you want to continue, and
b) reliably pay in the risk portion, both your own and that which was formally covered by the employer.

For the savings portion, contributions are voluntary.
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank doropfiz for this useful post:
  #9  
Old 15.10.2020, 21:29
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: schwyz
Posts: 118
Groaned at 9 Times in 8 Posts
Thanked 16 Times in 11 Posts
NewInSchwyz has annoyed a few people around hereNewInSchwyz has annoyed a few people around here
Re: Pension Law Changes - Unemployment at 58 and older

can I just ask whether there have been any scandals like big corps pensions blowing up. Similar to BHS or other Uk companies that had massive pension defecits

As more money gets stuffed in my pension I worry that my salary and pension is with one company - Hardly diverisifcation is it

Has the CH goverment ever stepped in and saved a collapsed pension scheme?
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 15.10.2020, 21:54
aSwissInTheUS's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Zurich area
Posts: 12,040
Groaned at 90 Times in 81 Posts
Thanked 18,325 Times in 8,148 Posts
aSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Pension Law Changes - Unemployment at 58 and older

Quote:
View Post
can I just ask whether there have been any scandals like big corps pensions blowing up. Similar to BHS or other Uk companies that had massive pension defecits
Sure: BKV ZŁrich comes to mind. https://www.handelszeitung.ch/die-bvk-affaere

Quote:
View Post
Has the CH goverment ever stepped in and saved a collapsed pension scheme?
Yepp, but it was the canton ZH goverment, or to be more precise the taxpayer. But that was because they were there own PK. Otherwise they have to get their shit together themselves.

But when private pension provider goes bankrupt some of the money is insured by the BVG-Sicherheitsfond risk.http://www.sfbvg.ch/xml_1/internet/E...cation/f68.cfm


https://www.freiburger-nachrichten.c...ht-der-konkurs
https://www.srf.ch/news/schweiz/mill...dal-verwickelt
https://www.handelszeitung.ch/untern...tos-finanziert
__________________
"Okay, I just hope we don't wake up on Mars or something surrounded by millions of little squashy guys."
Reply With Quote
The following 5 users would like to thank aSwissInTheUS for this useful post:
  #11  
Old 15.10.2020, 22:20
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Frick, Aargau
Posts: 428
Groaned at 6 Times in 6 Posts
Thanked 493 Times in 253 Posts
HickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Pension Law Changes - Unemployment at 58 and older

Quote:
View Post
Depending on ones risk profile, moving would probably be preferable. I doubled my Swiss pension in 5 years in CHF with fundsmith. What is the earliest age you can vest the benefits, 63 as pillar 1 or earlier?
By the time you've reached a good age it would quite possibly be financially better to retire simply so you can invest your pillar 2 properly instead of having it languish in a typical Swiss pillar 2 account.
Reply With Quote
The following 5 users would like to thank HickvonFrick for this useful post:
  #12  
Old 16.10.2020, 08:55
newtoswitz's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Rapperswil
Posts: 2,375
Groaned at 35 Times in 32 Posts
Thanked 2,735 Times in 1,263 Posts
newtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Pension Law Changes - Unemployment at 58 and older

Quote:
View Post
Depending on ones risk profile, moving would probably be preferable. I doubled my Swiss pension in 5 years in CHF with fundsmith. What is the earliest age you can vest the benefits, 63 as pillar 1 or earlier?
Can you move your Swiss funds to a non-Swiss-pension provider at that age? I didn't think so?

Obviously at retirement you can withdraw the funds and invest them wherever you like.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 16.10.2020, 09:19
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 18,688
Groaned at 355 Times in 284 Posts
Thanked 18,399 Times in 9,928 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Pension Law Changes - Unemployment at 58 and older

Quote:
View Post
Can you move your Swiss funds to a non-Swiss-pension provider at that age? I didn't think so?

Obviously at retirement you can withdraw the funds and invest them wherever you like.
If you leave the country & not working or become 'self employed' almost certainly yes.
You are leaving the pension due to 'not working'
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 16.10.2020, 09:22
newtoswitz's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Rapperswil
Posts: 2,375
Groaned at 35 Times in 32 Posts
Thanked 2,735 Times in 1,263 Posts
newtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Pension Law Changes - Unemployment at 58 and older

Quote:
View Post
If you leave the country & not working or become 'self employed' almost certainly yes.
You are leaving the pension due to 'not working'
Leaving the country is a bit extreme, although given the crap growth of a Swiss pension fund could easily pay for itself within a year!
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 16.10.2020, 19:18
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Aargau
Posts: 2,486
Groaned at 11 Times in 10 Posts
Thanked 3,380 Times in 1,515 Posts
Mullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Pension Law Changes - Unemployment at 58 and older

To add to the above, VZ VermŲgenszentrum makes these comments on this pension law changes (translated):
  • You can only continue the risk insurance against death and disability or also the old-age savings. However, you must pay the premiums yourself - including those of your employer.
  • If the continued pension coverage lasts for more than two years, you usually have to draw your pension fund money as a periodic pension payment (Rente) and can no longer have it paid out as a lump sum (Kapital).
  • Moreover, in such a case, you are no longer allowed to withdraw or pledge your savings to finance home ownership.
Full article is at p. 17 at this link (German):

https://www.vermoegenszentrum.ch/new...rtcutVznews123
Reply With Quote
The following 6 users would like to thank Mullhollander for this useful post:
  #16  
Old 17.10.2020, 15:01
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Zurich
Posts: 4,757
Groaned at 236 Times in 139 Posts
Thanked 5,312 Times in 2,431 Posts
ZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Pension Law Changes - Unemployment at 58 and older

Have my big bank exit agreement discussion at age 58 end of this month. If I’m allowed within this agreement to pass on any info (which I doubt), then I will keep you guys up-to-date.

This has been very useful - thank you!
Just as a note, my exit (at my own wish) is scheduled post January 2021. So I should fall within the parameters of the original post.

Last edited by ZuriRollt; 17.10.2020 at 15:18. Reason: Addendum
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank ZuriRollt for this useful post:
  #17  
Old 17.10.2020, 15:05
roegner's Avatar
Moderately Dutch
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Zurich
Posts: 10,248
Groaned at 346 Times in 288 Posts
Thanked 12,087 Times in 5,853 Posts
roegner has a reputation beyond reputeroegner has a reputation beyond reputeroegner has a reputation beyond reputeroegner has a reputation beyond reputeroegner has a reputation beyond reputeroegner has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Pension Law Changes - Unemployment at 58 and older

Quote:
View Post
Have my big bank exit agreement discussion at age 58 end of this month. If Iím allowed within this agreement to pass on any info (which I doubt), then I will keep you guys up-to-date.

This has been very useful - thank you!
Good luck anyway, hope it works out well for you
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 17.10.2020, 15:48
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Zurich
Posts: 4,757
Groaned at 236 Times in 139 Posts
Thanked 5,312 Times in 2,431 Posts
ZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Pension Law Changes - Unemployment at 58 and older

Quote:
View Post
Good luck anyway, hope it works out well for you
As Iím working for a big bank (they are risk adverse), itís pretty transparent and initially seems in-line with any new entitlement pension regulations per 2021. Iím OK with it.

But I wonít know until end of month.
Reply With Quote
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Pension enquiry - Defined Benefit Pension vs Defined Contribution Pension PeterSoliman Finance/banking/taxation 21 05.09.2018 11:34
Company increasing pension contributions as you get older ipoddle Finance/banking/taxation 24 14.05.2018 13:11
Q on unemployment / pension / and childcare buchs Employment 23 20.09.2013 08:04
Paid unemployment benefits being reclaimed by unemployment office johnmayer Employment 6 21.09.2012 08:11
Working conditions/RAV calculation for unemployment pension/ quiting job lucy_sg Employment 5 19.03.2008 20:01


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 23:48.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0