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10.05.2021, 18:53
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| | Re: German as a mother tongue? | Quote: | |  | | | Are you really going with this logic ? Not quite sure what Planet you live on, but clearly not the same one as me. | | | | | That's how Oxford dictionary defines it and a JD should not be Open to Interpretation. It should be precise, the Natives are know for exactly that aren't they ?
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10.05.2021, 18:54
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| | Re: German as a mother tongue? | Quote: | |  | | | But, we live in a country with 25% foreigners. How can you tell what language someone speaks by the skin? Also consider people is fluent in 2, 3 or 4 languages.
. | | | | | That’s a good point. In Switzerland many have at least one language as a second language, that they have learned either as a choice or mandatorily at school. So it‘s not uncommon that Swiss put on their CV that they are bi-lingual or multi-lingual. For example, as mentioned, daughter has 2 „Muttersprachen“ which came from her parents since birth.
In addition, she‘s (in my eyes at least) quite fluent in French and pretty good in Spanish from years of mandatory or chosen advanced studies and exams at school. Swiss German is something „additional“.
But she would never say that one of those is her „Muttersprache“, or even apply for a job requiring this. It‘s true - it‘s common for Swiss people to have additional languages, but how do you weed-out what‘s really usable for the job?
Have you ever heard a Swiss German speaking French, after a lifetime of obligatory and plus chosen additional school years? It‘s often kinda special, like many Swiss Germans speaking English as well infact ...
Kinda like many Americans speaking German
It has nothing to do with skin colour...
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10.05.2021, 18:57
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| | Re: German as a mother tongue? | Quote: | |  | | | Management level is not affected by that. If perfect local language is needed, a local is sent to work with the customer. But, who earns more? Management or the one talking to the customer in the common Mutterspräche?
The managers I've met have a good language portfolio but only 1 or 2 at Muttersprache level. The rest are only small talk level in the language of employees, and of course not writing at all. | | | | | Alas, for small companies this is certainly NOT the case!
Current problem for us is that I am one of the two remaining German speakers, the Italians are all at A0!
Tom
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10.05.2021, 18:58
| Junior Member | | Join Date: Feb 2020 Location: Zurich
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| | Re: German as a mother tongue? | Quote: | |  | | | To be honest if I'd read it I would just assume by "mother tongue" they simply mean the level of German - i.e. it needs to be perfect.
I speak a language that is not my mother tongue, but I learned it very well by living in that country for 15 years. I speak at the level where folks do not believe that I did not learn it as a kid, so on my CV I simply put the level at "mother tongue" because C2 does not really give it justice. | | | | | Assumption ? why ? is there a deficiency in the English or German language that lends itself for assumptions ? Although done in good faith it's a lie.
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10.05.2021, 19:00
|  | Moderately Dutch | | Join Date: May 2011 Location: Zurich
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| | Re: German as a mother tongue? | Quote: | |  | | | That's how Oxford dictionary defines it and a JD should not be Open to Interpretation. It should be precise, the Natives are know for exactly that aren't they ? | | | | | So? No idea what your native language is…. Not everyone cares about what the Oxford dictionary has to say about Muttersprachler.
And what is a JD???
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10.05.2021, 19:02
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| | Re: German as a mother tongue? | Quote: | |  | | | That’s a good point. In Switzerland many have at least one language as a second language, that they have learned either as a choice or mandatorily at school. | | | | | And it normally sucks.
Most Swiss I know only speak one language at the mother-tongue level, though I have certainly known several who could do 4 or 5 (usually from Grischun)
Tom
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10.05.2021, 19:02
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| | Re: German as a mother tongue? | Quote: | |  | | | Assumption ? why ? is there a deficiency in the English or German language that lends itself for assumptions ? Although done in good faith it's a lie. | | | | | Yes there is. Is your previous name here Omtatsat??
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10.05.2021, 19:18
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| | Re: German as a mother tongue? | Quote: | |  | | | yes there is. Is your previous name here omtatsat?? | | | | | drum roll...............
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10.05.2021, 19:22
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| | Re: German as a mother tongue? | Quote: | |  | | | So? No idea what your native language is…. Not everyone cares about what the Oxford dictionary has to say about Muttersprachler.
And what is a JD??? | | | | | Thankfully in a court of law (even non English ones) no one if going to come to you to decipher any text. Guess where they will go though.
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10.05.2021, 19:24
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| | Re: German as a mother tongue? | Quote: | |  | | | Thankfully in a court of law (even non English ones) no one if going to come to you to decipher any text. Guess where they will go though. | | | | | You might want to decipher what you said? No clue what you want to say.
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10.05.2021, 19:28
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| | Re: German as a mother tongue? | Quote: | |  | | | Assumption ? why ? is there a deficiency in the English or German language that lends itself for assumptions ? Although done in good faith it's a lie. | | | | | Where do you come up with this racist rubbish?
Tom
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10.05.2021, 19:31
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| | Re: German as a mother tongue? | Quote: | |  | | | Thankfully in a court of law (even non English ones) no one if going to come to you to decipher any text. Guess where they will go though. | | | | | Just noticed that you‘re from Chigwell (guess that‘s the UK) - which Swiss position are you looking at?
Sometimes it helps to just put in your covering letter for a position in Switzerland, for which you are qualified for a position in Switzerland with work permits etc. that although German is not your mother tongue, you are completely and utterly fluent in German and have absolutely no problem with Swiss German either? Forgot to mention, that you also need to apply for a position that no Swiss person is available to fill (if you‘re not Swiss)...
Last edited by ZuriRollt; 10.05.2021 at 19:41.
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10.05.2021, 19:41
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| | Re: German as a mother tongue? | Quote: | |  | | | You might want to decipher what you said? No clue what you want to say. | | | | | English not your mother-tongue?  I guess the company advertising the job wants to avoid such things like the mis-understandings that are present on this forum every day.
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10.05.2021, 19:47
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| | Re: German as a mother tongue? | Quote: | |  | | | English not your mother-tongue? I guess the company advertising the job wants to avoid such things like the mis-understandings that are present on this forum every day. | | | | | I can think of plenty of mother tongue English couples who constantly misunderstand what the other one said | The following 5 users would like to thank fatmanfilms for this useful post: | | 
10.05.2021, 19:47
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| | Re: German as a mother tongue? | Quote: | |  | | | Just noticed that you‘re from Chigwell (guess that‘s the UK) | | | | | It has a particular reputation but I wouldn't want to be racist | The following 3 users would like to thank Landers for this useful post: | | 
10.05.2021, 19:47
|  | Moderately Dutch | | Join Date: May 2011 Location: Zurich
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| | Re: German as a mother tongue? | Quote: | |  | | | Thankfully in a court of law (even non English ones) no one if going to come to you to decipher any text. Guess where they will go though. | | | | | | Quote: | |  | | | English not your mother-tongue? I guess the company advertising the job wants to avoid such things like the mis-understandings that are present on this forum every day. | | | | | Would be glad to get a translation 😀
No, not a native speaker in that language (as most know). No one if going to come does not sound like the Queens English?
I do understand though what was asked for in the advert 😀
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10.05.2021, 19:53
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| | Re: German as a mother tongue? | Quote: | |  | | | Would be glad to get a translation ��
No, not a native speaker in that language (as most know). No one if going to come does not sound like the Queens English?
I do understand though what was asked for in the advert �� | | | | | Have to admit that I understood your post, but not Marogs. But I‘m from nature naive, and always critised for speaking (almost) queens English. My Mom was from Liverpool, so she opted to take elocution lessons. Took me years to tone it down in Bromley.
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10.05.2021, 20:20
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| | Re: German as a mother tongue? | Quote: | |  | | | You are overthinking this. A lot. When the add says "mother tongue" did the Swiss who wrote this not at all differentiate between any of your terms... he used an online dictionary to find out what "Muttersprachler" is in English.
I just had a call where the customer basically complained that he has to speak standard German with me instead of his dialect... with me replying that I understand Swiss German... so yes, that's a big thing around here. Better get over it as you wont change the Swiss on that point. | | | | | The ad was in German and it said "Muttersprachler".
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10.05.2021, 20:42
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| | Re: German as a mother tongue? | Quote: | |  | | | The ad was in German and it said "Muttersprachler". | | | | | The key bit missing in this discussion: for what job was the ad?
English is not my first language, so I simply accept that I will never be a Radio Host on the bbc... and I think it’s ok if the SRF does the same. If they were hiring a chef or a cleaner is it more debatable...
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10.05.2021, 20:44
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| | Re: German as a mother tongue? | Quote: | |  | | | The irony in all this is that probably is that the offer OP read was a low paid job. The higher you go in salary or more specialized the job, the less important the language skills. The perfect knowledge of local language is needed when you deal only with locals that only know 1 language which are low income on average. So, not a lot of money can be made from such customers. | | | | | This.
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