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Old 13.09.2021, 09:43
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Moving to Switzerland and maintain UK employment

Hello,

As I am moving to Switzerland with a job offer in Zurich, my partner who is currently employed by a US/UK company has to resolve her situation.

Please note we are both EU citizens.

The company is happy for her to continue working in Switzerland but she has to basically sort the taxes herself.

There are obviously two routes that she can take:

1) Continue employment with UK contract, pay UK taxes and declare Tax Credit under the double taxation treaty between UK/Switzerland.

From what I understand, she won't be paying extra taxes due to the higher rate of taxation in the UK, but will need to pay social contribution herself in Switzerland (besides AHV, not sure which are and how much that could add up to)

2) Self-employment sending invoice to UK (and getting paid in GBP?)

I am really not sure how complex/long this route is, and if Switzerland is allowed to work for a single employer abroad.

Could you advise what is the simpler form of self-employment as her salary is fairly low for Swiss standards, so she would prefer the peace of mind versus complexity/higher gain?

Mostly because she will be self-employed only for the time of finding a longer-term job-based in Switzerland.

How does that translate in requesting a permit? If she arrives to Switzerland while she is still employed, and wants to transition to self-employment, what will need to be declared to the migration authorities?
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Old 13.09.2021, 10:28
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Re: Moving to Switzerland and maintain UK employment

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1) Continue employment with UK contract, pay UK taxes and declare Tax Credit under the double taxation treaty between UK/Switzerland.
This can only be done (and indeed must be done) if tax residency is maintained. Check HMRC rules on tax residency. If you move here for the long term, have no real ties to the UK and don't go there much, then she probably won't be tax resident - and thus not liable for UK taxes.

Furthermore, the Swiss will want their tax first, since she is living here!

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2) Self-employment sending invoice to UK (and getting paid in GBP?)
Unlikely to be permitted, since self-employment is resisted by the authorities with only one client. Payment is in whatever currency is agreed. Search ANOBAG on this site (use google-> anobag site:englishforum.ch ).
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Old 13.09.2021, 10:30
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Re: Moving to Switzerland and maintain UK employment

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Hello,

As I am moving to Switzerland with a job offer in Zurich, my partner who is currently employed by a US/UK company has to resolve her situation.

Please note we are both EU citizens.

The company is happy for her to continue working in Switzerland but she has to basically sort the taxes herself.

There are obviously two routes that she can take:

1) Continue employment with UK contract, pay UK taxes and declare Tax Credit under the double taxation treaty between UK/Switzerland.

From what I understand, she won't be paying extra taxes due to the higher rate of taxation in the UK, but will need to pay social contribution herself in Switzerland (besides AHV, not sure which are and how much that could add up to)

2) Self-employment sending invoice to UK (and getting paid in GBP?)

I am really not sure how complex/long this route is, and if Switzerland is allowed to work for a single employer abroad.

Could you advise what is the simpler form of self-employment as her salary is fairly low for Swiss standards, so she would prefer the peace of mind versus complexity/higher gain?

Mostly because she will be self-employed only for the time of finding a longer-term job-based in Switzerland.

How does that translate in requesting a permit? If she arrives to Switzerland while she is still employed, and wants to transition to self-employment, what will need to be declared to the migration authorities?

1) You are taxed where you are officially resident, not where you work


2) You are NOT self-employed if you work for just one company
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Old 13.09.2021, 10:35
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Re: Moving to Switzerland and maintain UK employment

What if she uses a Payroll Umbrella Company in Switzerland?

She would be an employee on record, with the umbrella company charging invoices to the UK company?

And what are the risks for her if she becomes a contractor? Seems to me like the violations is on the company's side, not the contractor's
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Old 13.09.2021, 10:38
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Re: Moving to Switzerland and maintain UK employment

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What if she uses a Payroll Umbrella Company in Switzerland?

She would be an employee on record, with the umbrella company charging invoices to the UK company?

She would be an employée of the payroll company, same if you set up a Sarl or an SA company, you are emloyed by that company to do a contract for another company or person.
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Old 13.09.2021, 12:16
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Re: Moving to Switzerland and maintain UK employment

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She would be an employée of the payroll company, same if you set up a Sarl or an SA company, you are emloyed by that company to do a contract for another company or person.
It seems to be possible, I have spoken with Accruity and Helvetic Payroll and they both offer the service for 400-500 CHF monthly.

They can generate an employment contract in Switzerland which would also help her with the B Permit, manage the deduction from her gross salary and send invoices to the company supplied.

Finger crossed her employer will agree.
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Old 13.09.2021, 13:02
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Re: Moving to Switzerland and maintain UK employment

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What if she uses a Payroll Umbrella Company in Switzerland?

She would be an employee on record, with the umbrella company charging invoices to the UK company?

And what are the risks for her if she becomes a contractor? Seems to me like the violations is on the company's side, not the contractor's
Bear in mind that the money from the UK company will be subject to Swiss employers social contributions as well as employees contributions.

You should try to get as close as possible to a gross amount equivalent to her current salary + the NI employers contribution they're currently paying.
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Old 28.09.2021, 21:37
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Re: Moving to Switzerland and maintain UK employment

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You should try to get as close as possible to a gross amount equivalent to her current salary + the NI employers contribution they're currently paying.
Good point. And see if you can get net employer's pension contributions paid too.
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Old 29.09.2021, 08:53
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Re: Moving to Switzerland and maintain UK employment

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This can only be done (and indeed must be done) if tax residency is maintained. Check HMRC rules on tax residency. If you move here for the long term, have no real ties to the UK and don't go there much, then she probably won't be tax resident - and thus not liable for UK taxes.
Not really. Income will be earned as a UK employee in UK, the UK tax residency is automatic and she is liable for UK taxes.
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Old 29.09.2021, 09:14
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Re: Moving to Switzerland and maintain UK employment

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Not really. Income will be earned as a UK employee in UK, the UK tax residency is automatic and she is liable for UK taxes.
Wrong. Unless by "in UK" you mean she is in the UK, which she won't be.

If she is not resident for tax in the UK and is not physically working there, there is no UK tax to pay. Tax is due (in most countries, and definitely the UK and Switzerland) where the work is physically carried out.

See here, and practically every other discussion on the matter.
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Old 29.09.2021, 09:35
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Re: Moving to Switzerland and maintain UK employment

Notalltjere is correct but this requires your company to give you a work contract which says you can work outside of the Uk which won’t happen

Good luck trying to claim back the tax from hmrc once it’s been late deducted
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Old 29.09.2021, 10:43
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Re: Moving to Switzerland and maintain UK employment

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Notalltjere is correct but this requires your company to give you a work contract which says you can work outside of the Uk which won’t happen

Good luck trying to claim back the tax from hmrc once it’s been late deducted
Also not true. I know people who've worked quite happily in this way, getting paid gross from their UK employer and paying social via a payroll company.

Oh, and if HMRC did deduct, it's just a matter of filling in a tax return. NI that's deducted in error can also be recovered, but it's a bit more convoluted. This part has been discussed at length on www.contractoruk.com forums. With proper knowledgeable UK accountants.
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Old 29.09.2021, 14:48
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Re: Moving to Switzerland and maintain UK employment

Thank you everyone, we've realised the best solution was to use a Payroll Umbrella company as they take care of everything for CHF 350/m
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Old 29.09.2021, 14:56
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Re: Moving to Switzerland and maintain UK employment

Just to press this subject one last time

If someone is non resident Uk tax payer and then signs a Uk contract which requires him to be onsite when the client requires it and he only ends up being in the Uk 30 days in a tax year you are suggesting that he can recover all the tax deductions and elect to get paid in Switzerland if he lives there?

I looked at this in detail and it does not fly so I would be curious for your understanding. I am well aware of contractor forum which I read regularly
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Old 29.09.2021, 17:14
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Re: Moving to Switzerland and maintain UK employment

Having read this thread and your other thread about moving to ZH i would recommend NOT to complicate your life with these 'schemes'.
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Old 30.09.2021, 17:49
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Re: Moving to Switzerland and maintain UK employment

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Wrong. Unless by "in UK" you mean she is in the UK, which she won't be.

If she is not resident for tax in the UK and is not physically working there, there is no UK tax to pay. Tax is due (in most countries, and definitely the UK and Switzerland) where the work is physically carried out.

See here, and practically every other discussion on the matter.
We may be talking about two different situations, but if you are employed by a UK company and are non-UK resident, you will still pay taxes on UK income (e.g. salary paid by the UK employer).

I am not sure how these payroll umbrella companies work, but I would (intuitively) say OP's partner would be employed by a Swiss company and therefore not pay any UK taxes on this specific income (if indeed non-UK resident).

Source
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Old 01.10.2021, 09:04
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Re: Moving to Switzerland and maintain UK employment

The missus is in exactly this situation. She has remained in UK employment working from Switzerland for the last couple of years. She pays full UK taxes on UK income. She completes a Swiss tax return every year, but doesn't pay any additional Swiss taxes.

We did look at the contract route, and were recommended Accurity to process the payroll. Seemed fairly uncomplicated, but my wife in the end preferred to keep existing arrangements for greater security.
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Old 01.10.2021, 09:53
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Re: Moving to Switzerland and maintain UK employment

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Just to press this subject one last time

If someone is non resident Uk tax payer and then signs a Uk contract which requires him to be onsite when the client requires it and he only ends up being in the Uk 30 days in a tax year you are suggesting that he can recover all the tax deductions and elect to get paid in Switzerland if he lives there?
No. Any substantive work carried out in the UK is taxable and NI'd in the UK. It does not have to be through PAYE. You should not be on UK payroll if you are not tax resident in the UK.

Non substantive work includes: meetings, training... It's a grey area, but it's no different from a US colleague coming over here and staying for a couple of weeks before heading back.

As a contractor, contracting with a UK company, I visited a few days a year. There was no tax charge arising from that. Another time, I was working for a UK company for three months with mon-fri commuting. Then the money I earned was taxable and NIable in the UK.
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Old 01.10.2021, 09:56
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Re: Moving to Switzerland and maintain UK employment

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We may be talking about two different situations, but if you are employed by a UK company and are non-UK resident, you will still pay taxes on UK income (e.g. salary paid by the UK employer).
No. You will pay tax on UK income. That is UK income generated while you are in the UK physically. Business meetings, workshops, training and suchlike, not included.

If in doubt talk to an expert in UK tax law and accounting, who has international experience.
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Old 01.10.2021, 09:59
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Re: Moving to Switzerland and maintain UK employment

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The missus is in exactly this situation. She has remained in UK employment working from Switzerland for the last couple of years. She pays full UK taxes on UK income.
This is probably not the correct thing to do, but international tax is a very grey area and often misunderstood. The fact is, if you are not physically working (excluding training, workshops, business meetings) in the UK, you are not liable to pay tax there. NI is not due either.

If you want clarity, talk to an expert.

Final point: the UK operates self-assessment. That means you need to interpret the rules and act accordingly. If HMRC investigate, and find you've got it wrong then you'll be liable to pay any shortfall. Or you may get a refund. Even then, it will only be an opinion on the interpretation of the law. Until it comes before a judge - it will never be certain. Hence many people saying "well I do this, I do that, and they've never complained." Well yes. That's because they've not checked.
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