Reference letters [Zeugnis ] - Q&A thread

[fatmanfilms]

	Quote:	mezzaluna
	Dear all, I have just got a refernece letteer from a company in Switzerland but I would like that someone helps me to analyse it in order to see of There is no secret code in that. I will Put some sentencja, it was written in English. If someone can help me and analyse if it is a good reference letteer, I would be glad. Many thanks ! 1.”X.X posseses a good specialist knowledge that she uses confidently in her business” 2. „ She performed her tasks in good quality” 3. „ She communicated in polite and accomondating way” 4. „She left out company voluntary” 5. „ We thank jer for a good work and wish her all the Best personally and profesionally” Many thanks for your input !

It's a poor reference, all are bad news for example of how a good reference would look, the words in capitals must be present.

2) She ALWAYS performs her tasks to the HIGHEST quality & we were ALWAYS TOTALLY satisfied with her work

[mezzaluna]

Ok, all comments are poor or just number 2

[aSwissInTheUS]

	Quote:	mezzaluna
	Dear all, 4. „She left our company voluntary, which we deeply regret. She is always welcome as an employee at our company.

The last part is more often used in case of extended leaves, education, or maternity.

There should be also a note that the reference is not coded and does not contain any misleading or dual barreled wording. (Honestly? It still will. )

[fatmanfilms]

	Quote:	mezzaluna
	Ok, all comments are poor or just number 2

1 is missing GREAT
3 is missing ALWAYS
4 is missing we are VERY SAD that she is leaving us

It should be over the top in compliments with the highest or fullest praise possible in every sentence.

[roegner]

	Quote:	aSwissInTheUS
	There should be also a note that the reference is not coded and does not contain any misleading or dual barreled wording. (Honestly? It still will. )

I have never seen that in a reference. And yes, it clearly still has dubious wording, that is for sure.

[mezzaluna]

Ok, so if I present this reference letteer they will know it s not the very good one ?

[fatmanfilms]

	Quote:	mezzaluna
	Ok, so if I present this reference letteer they will know it s not the very good one ?

Yes, rewrite it yourself & ask them to accept your changes.

[mezzaluna]

I dont think they will do, we Didnt have such a good relations

[fatmanfilms]

	Quote:	mezzaluna
	I dont think they will do, we Didnt have such a good relations

They will negotiate, say it's poor which is against the law & they will improve it, rewrite it as you would like, totally over the top & let them tone it down a little. Keep pressing until you are happy, it's a game they know this too

[Mullhollander]

Assuming the OP registers with RAV, the OP might wish to discuss the reference letter with the RAV adviser. The RAV adviser can then decide to involve the legal experts at Fachstelle impuls to negotiate a more favorable reference letter.

This is a link to Fachstelle impuls:

https://www.sah-zh.ch/impuls/angebote/rav-und-iv.html

[mezzaluna]

Thanks,
Is that really so bad that I have to ask for the New one ?

[fatmanfilms]

	Quote:	mezzaluna
	Thanks, Is that really so bad that I have to ask for the New one ?

DEFINATELY ask for a better one, a much better one, it's very poor indeed.

[HickvonFrick]

	Quote:	fatmanfilms
	DEFINATELY ask for a better one, a much better one, it's very poor indeed.

Mine said I was employed from dd-mm-yyyy (1) to dd-mm-yyyy (2)!

[fatmanfilms]

	Quote:	HickvonFrick
	Mine said I was employed from dd-mm-yyyy (1) to dd-mm-yyyy (2)!

For a very short employment that is allowed.

[amogles]

	Quote:	mezzaluna
	Dear all, I have just got a refernece letteer from a company in Switzerland but I would like that someone helps me to analyse it in order to see of There is no secret code in that. I will Put some sentencja, it was written in English. If someone can help me and analyse if it is a good reference letteer, I would be glad. Many thanks ! 1.”X.X posseses a good specialist knowledge that she uses confidently in her business”

X.X is somewhat lacking in common sense.

confidence can also be a codeword for knowing everything better and rejecting advice.

	Quote:	mezzaluna
	2. „ She performed her tasks in good quality”

But not in terms of quantity.

	Quote:	mezzaluna
	3. „ She communicated in polite and accomondating way”

she could be dishonest and did not share her thoughts.

	Quote:	mezzaluna
	4. „She left out company voluntary” 5. „ We thank jer for a good work and wish her all the Best personally and profesionally” Many thanks for your input !

this is pretty much meaningless bla bla as far as I know. Not good and not bad.

[Bossa Nova]

Looking for some advice here. I have to write a letter for someone who has some excellent technical proficiencies, but also had some problems that made working with them in a team setting challenging. Their employment was terminated in the form of us not renewing their contract. Nice person, very smart, but poor communicator and unreliable in terms of meeting deadlines and work attendance.

Any advice as to how I word this? Do I just confirm that Person X was employed from dates A to B? Normally I would mention why the employment period ended, but I am not sure what to say in this case.

[Aeneas]

	Quote:	bossie
	Looking for some advice here. I have to write a letter for someone who has some excellent technical proficiencies, but also had some problems that made working with them in a team setting challenging. Their employment was terminated in the form of us not renewing their contract. Weeks before the end they had stopped showing up to work anyways. They might excel in a certain work environment, but didn't really perform satisfactorily for our needs. Nice person, very smart, but poor communicator and unreliable in terms of meeting deadlines and work attendance.

As a rule you describe the person like that in whatever positive or neutral manner as you can and where there are negatives, you simply omit them. So essentially, if you omit topics like how he works in a team environment or is his observance, or absence thereof, of deadlines, you essentially have your reference:

• List what his responsibilities and technologies he worked with.
• Comment on his being "very skilled technically, with a deep understanding of the underlying technologies".
• Say what things he did to your satisfaction or better and simply omit any mention of anything that he didn't do to your satisfaction.
• If he was on a renewable contract, simply say he left because you chose not to renew it. There's no reason to give a reason.

That's probably as fair as you can be to him. If he didn't bother showing up at the end, I doubt he'll have much of a leg to stand on anyway. Finally run it past whatever legal council your company has, just to be safe.

[newtoswitz]

	Quote:	bossie
	Looking for some advice here. I have to write a letter for someone who has some excellent technical proficiencies, but also had some problems that made working with them in a team setting challenging. Their employment was terminated in the form of us not renewing their contract. Nice person, very smart, but poor communicator and unreliable in terms of meeting deadlines and work attendance. Any advice as to how I word this? Do I just confirm that Person X was employed from dates A to B? Normally I would mention why the employment period ended, but I am not sure what to say in this case.

So to sum up - nice person, good knowledge, but useless as an employee? How long were they there, six months or so?

I'd say a basic "Person X was employed as (role) from date A to date B" is about the most you can really offer without either lying, massive omission or giving them bad rep.

[Bossa Nova]

	Quote:	Aeneas
	As a rule you describe the person like that in whatever positive or neutral manner as you can and where there are negatives, you simply omit them. So essentially, if you omit topics like how he works in a team environment or is his observance, or absence thereof, of deadlines, you essentially have your reference: List what his responsibilities and technologies he worked with. Comment on his being "very skilled technically, with a deep understanding of the underlying technologies". Say what things he did to your satisfaction or better and simply omit any mention of anything that he didn't do to your satisfaction. If he was on a renewable contract, simply say he left because you chose not to renew it. There's no reason to give a reason.

Thanks, this is a great description of what to do. I've only ever handed out glowing references before and was a bit worried that I didn't have much to say for this person, who is in all fairness quite competent and might thrive in a more structured environment.



I'll make a detailed list of tasks they performed and make it clear they were completed satisfactorily, as opposed to "to our complete satisfaction". Will likely just list dates of employment with no other details regarding why employment ended.