Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Employment  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 23.02.2010, 15:13
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Zürich
Posts: 52
Groaned at 1 Time in 1 Post
Thanked 37 Times in 13 Posts
Savski has made some interesting contributions
Short term contract in the UK - What is the best tax option for me?

Hello all,

I'm English and I have been living in Switzerland for two months and looking for work in the I.T sector, but so far without any success. I’ve recently been offered a short term contract from a previous employer in London and I’m on the brink of accepting the offer purely for financial reasons (My Swiss wife and I got married last year and then spent 9 months travelling around South America, so my wallet has incurred a very large dent!). The contract would last between three and five months and I can expect to earn £11k to £18k depending on that contract length.

My question is this: What is the best way of working this contract in terms of tax? The easiest option I can think of is to work under an umbrella company in the UK and pay tax/NI as normal, but I’m wondering if there is a more tax efficient way taking into account that I’m now a Swiss resident. I would be returning to Switzerland for some but not all weekends during the contract term if that makes any difference to suggestions.

Any advice is greatly appreciated!!
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 23.02.2010, 16:19
lux_interior's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: over the hills and far away
Posts: 151
Groaned at 2 Times in 1 Post
Thanked 169 Times in 85 Posts
lux_interior has a reputation beyond reputelux_interior has a reputation beyond reputelux_interior has a reputation beyond reputelux_interior has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Short term contract in the UK - What is the best tax option for me?

<!!! the legality of this advice would likely be hotly contested by the UK tax dept, so any use you make of it is entirely at your own risk !!!>

If you can demonstrate that you are not resident in the UK and that you are submitting a tax return elsewhere, then you can avoid paying UK tax completely.
Firstly, find an off-shore umbrella company. They have a UK company to bill your agency/client but will actually pay you out from a non-UK company. If anyone (eg. agency) wants your address, give your Swiss one. The umbrella company will ask for some confirmation that you're not UK resident and that you intend to manage your own tax affairs. They will then pass the entire billable amount through to you, minus only their commission.
Have your earnings paid into an off-shore account and keep it secret. Don't keep any records of when you're actually in the UK.
You're not likely to be working in the UK long enough to get any attention but if you do later get questioned then say that you declared your earnings in Switzerland. You don't have to show what you declared, just that you filed a return.

This approach worked well for me for several years and I've never had any comeback.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 09.10.2015, 13:12
Newbie 1st class
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Austria
Posts: 11
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Confounded has no particular reputation at present
Re: Short term contract in the UK - What is the best tax option for me?

Dear lux_interior, would you be kind enough to share your more resent experience on this topic (family living in Switzerland, working on a contract in the UK). Thank you
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 09.10.2015, 13:23
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,365
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Short term contract in the UK - What is the best tax option for me?

Quote:
View Post

If you can demonstrate that you are not resident in the UK and that you are submitting a tax return elsewhere, then you can avoid paying UK tax completely.
At the time this was written it was misleading, it's completely incorrect to think that just submitting a tax return to another jurisdiction helps in any way with being UK tax resident. Many people are tax resident in multiple countries.

More recently the HMRC has published a statutory definition of residence, depending on connections to the UK. It's quite complicated.

https://www.gov.uk/government/upload...ted_078500.pdf
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 09.10.2015, 16:09
Newbie 1st class
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Austria
Posts: 11
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Confounded has no particular reputation at present
Re: Short term contract in the UK - What is the best tax option for me?

@fatmanfilms: If I understand it correctly one can be a resident for tax on local (UK) income purposes, but non-domicile for worldwide income. So, if my family lives in Switzerland and I am working on a contract in the UK as an employee of a Swiss contracting company, I only pay tax on the income from that company if I bring it into the UK, right?
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 09.10.2015, 16:22
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,365
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Short term contract in the UK - What is the best tax option for me?

Quote:
View Post
@fatmanfilms: If I understand it correctly one can be a resident for tax on local (UK) income purposes, but non-domicile for worldwide income. So, if my family lives in Switzerland and I am working on a contract in the UK as an employee of a Swiss contracting company, I only pay tax on the income from that company if I bring it into the UK, right?
Possibly....
Where was your father born & did he have a British passport.

If you hold UK domicile by birth it's very difficult to ever loose it.

Any money you earn from working in the UK would be taxable, plus any foreign income remitted. If you failed to declare the earnings from the UK employment it would be intentional tax evasion. The revenue has got very hot on such avoidance measures.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 09.10.2015, 16:25
Newbie 1st class
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Austria
Posts: 11
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Confounded has no particular reputation at present
Re: Short term contract in the UK - What is the best tax option for me?

@fatmanfilms: I do not hold a UK domicile.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 09.10.2015, 16:27
Newbie 1st class
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Austria
Posts: 11
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Confounded has no particular reputation at present
Re: Short term contract in the UK - What is the best tax option for me?

Dear Savski, I would be grateful if you could share you experience on contracting in the UK while still having your family live in Switzerland. How did it work out for you in the end? How did you arrange your affairs, such as: tax (both in the UK and Switzerland), umbrella company vs ltd, UK company vs Swiss, etc. Thank you
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 09.10.2015, 16:28
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,365
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Short term contract in the UK - What is the best tax option for me?

Quote:
View Post
@fatmanfilms: I do not hold a UK domicile.
Then you could be taxed on a remittance basis, however after 7 years you have to pay £30,000 in tax per year, rising to £50,000 in tax per year after 12 years.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 09.10.2015, 16:30
Newbie 1st class
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Austria
Posts: 11
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Confounded has no particular reputation at present
Re: Short term contract in the UK - What is the best tax option for me?

Regardless of income actually earned?
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 09.10.2015, 16:39
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,365
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Short term contract in the UK - What is the best tax option for me?

Quote:
View Post
Regardless of income actually earned?
Yes...... Or you can just pay tax on your world wide earnings & capital gains at normal UK rates.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 09.10.2015, 16:42
Mullhollander's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Aargau
Posts: 2,850
Groaned at 11 Times in 10 Posts
Thanked 4,134 Times in 1,782 Posts
Mullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Short term contract in the UK - What is the best tax option for me?

If you continue to live in Switzerland, return regularly, work less than 183 days in 12 months abroad and you are not paid by the operation in the UK, the below says that you should be taxed in Switzerland where you are domiciled. If you don't meet these criteria, you should pay taxes where you work, i.e., UK. See this for details:

Wochenaufenthaltsort
  • Im internationalen Verhältnis
    • Person mit unbeschränkter Steuerpflicht in der Schweiz und Erwerbstätigkeit im Ausland
      • = Person arbeitet in einem andern Staat und kehrt regelmässig an den schweizerischen Wohnort zurück
      • Grundsatz
        • Besteuerung nach dem Arbeitsortsprinzip gemäss OECD-MA
        • = bei unselbständig erwerbender Person hat das Besteuerungsrecht des Wohnsitzstaates hinter jenes des Arbeitsort-Staates zu treten
      • Ausnahme
        • Monteurklausel
        • (kumulative) Voraussetzungen für Besteuerung durch die Schweiz
          • Fortbestand des steuerlichen Wohnsitzes in der Schweiz
          • Person hält sich nicht länger als 183 Tage innerhalb von 12 Monaten während des betreffenden Steuerjahres im Arbeitsort-Staats auf
          • Lohn wird von Arbeitgeber bezahlt, der nicht im Arbeitsort-Staat Sitz hat
          • Lohn wird nicht von Betriebsstätte bezahlt, die der Arbeitgeber im Arbeitsort-Staat hat
http://www.wohn-sitz.ch/steuerdomizil-wochenaufenthalt
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 09.10.2015, 16:45
Newbie 1st class
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Austria
Posts: 11
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Confounded has no particular reputation at present
Re: Short term contract in the UK - What is the best tax option for me?

Quote:
View Post
Yes...... I don't understand what is your real question.
You said that "after 7 years you have to pay £30,000 in tax per year, rising to £50,000 in tax per year after 12 years."

So, would one have to pay this tax even if one no-longer works after 7 years and there is no more income from anywhere (say retire and live on savings)?
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 09.10.2015, 16:45
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,365
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Short term contract in the UK - What is the best tax option for me?

Quote:
View Post
If you continue to live in Switzerland, return regularly, work less than 183 days in 12 months abroad and you are not paid by the operation in the UK, the below says that you should be taxed in Switzerland where you are domiciled. If you don't meet these criteria, you should pay taxes where you work, i.e., UK. See this for details:

Wochenaufenthaltsort
  • Im internationalen Verhältnis
    • Person mit unbeschränkter Steuerpflicht in der Schweiz und Erwerbstätigkeit im Ausland
      • = Person arbeitet in einem andern Staat und kehrt regelmässig an den schweizerischen Wohnort zurück
      • Grundsatz
        • Besteuerung nach dem Arbeitsortsprinzip gemäss OECD-MA
        • = bei unselbständig erwerbender Person hat das Besteuerungsrecht des Wohnsitzstaates hinter jenes des Arbeitsort-Staates zu treten
      • Ausnahme
        • Monteurklausel
        • (kumulative) Voraussetzungen für Besteuerung durch die Schweiz
          • Fortbestand des steuerlichen Wohnsitzes in der Schweiz
          • Person hält sich nicht länger als 183 Tage innerhalb von 12 Monaten während des betreffenden Steuerjahres im Arbeitsort-Staats auf
          • Lohn wird von Arbeitgeber bezahlt, der nicht im Arbeitsort-Staat Sitz hat
          • Lohn wird nicht von Betriebsstätte bezahlt, die der Arbeitgeber im Arbeitsort-Staat hat
http://www.wohn-sitz.ch/steuerdomizil-wochenaufenthalt
That won't prevent the UK liability as the money was earned in the UK, even if not paid in the UK. The UK liability is probably higher in any case.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 09.10.2015, 16:46
newtoswitz's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Rapperswil
Posts: 4,043
Groaned at 84 Times in 79 Posts
Thanked 4,941 Times in 2,249 Posts
newtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Short term contract in the UK - What is the best tax option for me?

Quote:
View Post
If you continue to live in Switzerland, return regularly, work less than 183 days in 12 months abroad and you are not paid by the operation in the UK, the below says that you should be taxed in Switzerland where you are domiciled. If you don't meet these criteria, you should pay taxes where you work, i.e., UK. See this for details:

Wochenaufenthaltsort
  • Im internationalen Verhältnis
    • Person mit unbeschränkter Steuerpflicht in der Schweiz und Erwerbstätigkeit im Ausland
      • = Person arbeitet in einem andern Staat und kehrt regelmässig an den schweizerischen Wohnort zurück
      • Grundsatz
        • Besteuerung nach dem Arbeitsortsprinzip gemäss OECD-MA
        • = bei unselbständig erwerbender Person hat das Besteuerungsrecht des Wohnsitzstaates hinter jenes des Arbeitsort-Staates zu treten
      • Ausnahme
        • Monteurklausel
        • (kumulative) Voraussetzungen für Besteuerung durch die Schweiz
          • Fortbestand des steuerlichen Wohnsitzes in der Schweiz
          • Person hält sich nicht länger als 183 Tage innerhalb von 12 Monaten während des betreffenden Steuerjahres im Arbeitsort-Staats auf
          • Lohn wird von Arbeitgeber bezahlt, der nicht im Arbeitsort-Staat Sitz hat
          • Lohn wird nicht von Betriebsstätte bezahlt, die der Arbeitgeber im Arbeitsort-Staat hat
http://www.wohn-sitz.ch/steuerdomizil-wochenaufenthalt
And also, from the UK side, not replace a UK based employee. So effectively it's relatively easy to do a placement within your own company, or as a consultant as part of a project with a Swiss component, but they may object to simply using a Swiss umbrella company as a contractor.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 09.10.2015, 16:48
newtoswitz's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Rapperswil
Posts: 4,043
Groaned at 84 Times in 79 Posts
Thanked 4,941 Times in 2,249 Posts
newtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond reputenewtoswitz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Short term contract in the UK - What is the best tax option for me?

Quote:
View Post
That won't prevent the UK liability as the money was earned in the UK, even if not paid in the UK. The UK liability is probably higher in any case.
Except for short term (< six months) - otherwise if I went back to the UK with my own company for a couple of weeks I'd be liable!
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 09.10.2015, 16:48
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,365
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Short term contract in the UK - What is the best tax option for me?

Quote:
View Post
You said that "after 7 years you have to pay £30,000 in tax per year, rising to £50,000 in tax per year after 12 years."

So, would one have to pay this tax even if one no-longer works after 7 years and there is no more income from anywhere (say retire and live on savings)?
Only if you still wish to be taxed as a non dom, if you are happy paying tax on your world wide income & capital gains you can switch to normal taxation.

People who pay the £30/50K do so as it's to their advantage, it's a recent change as many extremely wealthy non doms lived in the UK for many years & paid ZERO tax.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 09.10.2015, 16:57
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,365
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Short term contract in the UK - What is the best tax option for me?

Quote:
View Post
Except for short term (< six months) - otherwise if I went back to the UK with my own company for a couple of weeks I'd be liable!
Well if you work for 40 days in the UK, you have accommodation the maximum would be 120 nights at midnight even after being out of the country for 3 years.

If you spent 90 nights in the UK in either of the last 2 tax years, was UK resident in the last 3 years or have family in the UK it will be significantly less than 120 nights in the UK.

As little as 17 nights in the UK, can make you UK tax residence, in the worst scenario.

https://www.gov.uk/government/upload...ted_078500.pdf
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 09.10.2015, 17:03
Newbie 1st class
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Austria
Posts: 11
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Confounded has no particular reputation at present
Re: Short term contract in the UK - What is the best tax option for me?

Quote:
View Post
... but they may object to simply using a Swiss umbrella company as a contractor.

I am not sure I understand your last point. Who are "they"? And how can "they" object to two companies signing a contract, no matter where it is based?
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 09.10.2015, 17:04
Mullhollander's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Aargau
Posts: 2,850
Groaned at 11 Times in 10 Posts
Thanked 4,134 Times in 1,782 Posts
Mullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond reputeMullhollander has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Short term contract in the UK - What is the best tax option for me?

Edit to my comment at 16:42 above (which I am unable to edit.):

The above is relevant for employees, not independent contractors.

The following applies to independent contractors and similar:

http://www.contractoruk.com/overseas...avoid_tax.html
Reply With Quote
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
How to differentiate between a short-term & long-term work permit monkmad Permits/visas/government 8 02.09.2014 08:00
B Permit Form - different for Long term B and Short term B ? samofsydney Permits/visas/government 3 14.02.2010 14:40
Early change of short-term B to long-term B Alirezakarimi Permits/visas/government 12 14.01.2008 00:00
Short-term work in Switzerland; tax requirements billmess Finance/banking/taxation 2 30.07.2007 17:20
Tax position for short term UK contract John Mc Finance/banking/taxation 5 18.07.2007 15:28


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 03:09.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2023, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0