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  #41  
Old 03.11.2010, 19:26
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Re: Intermediate Work Certificate - Secret Wording !?

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What is better can anyone advise:

"performed duties to our satisfaction" or complete omission of that satisfaction sentence?

thank you for advise
Your certificate must have
"performed his duties to our complete satisfaction"

anything else is not acceptable, (or you screwed up! )
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  #42  
Old 03.11.2010, 19:31
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Re: Intermediate Work Certificate - Secret Wording !?

My previous two jobs were with investment banks in London, one as a permie, then as a contractor. The best you'll get from one of those places is confirmation of your length of service and what your job title was. Anything else is leaving them open to legal problems.

So . . . when I applied here I was a bit worried about not having proper recommendation letters etc. In the end though, I wasn't even asked.

Perhaps the use of these letters within Switzerland is less prevalent in large multinationals? Or would they have asked for one if I'd come from another job in Switzerland?
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  #43  
Old 03.11.2010, 20:43
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Re: Intermediate Work Certificate - Secret Wording !?

if they refuse me on complete satisfaction - is it something worth going to labour cort?

it is myreputation too so i am in doubts - banking small world on both ends...

appreciate advise

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Your certificate must have
"performed his duties to our complete satisfaction"

anything else is not acceptable, (or you screwed up! )
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  #44  
Old 04.11.2010, 09:56
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Re: Intermediate Work Certificate - Secret Wording !?

As I wrote, anything else is not acceptable unless you deserved it. If you dispute a reference you can go to the RAV / ORP and ask for their help.

On the news today, the Swiss higher court agreed with an employer that any long term active sickness must be stated on the reference. The reference should be useful to any future employers, not a record of attendance at past employment.
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  #45  
Old 16.05.2011, 14:48
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Re: Intermediate Work Certificate - Secret Wording !?

Just caught this thread, interesting.
I do realize how important a Resume is in paper-document-mad countries like our beloved little island of prosperity, some of you may remember that I was happy to leave the last company so happy in fact that I just could not be arsed to demand a good resume, any written comments from them bastwards would be counter-productive indeedy, it works both ways just as we can get red blobbies on the forum so indeed can companies who mistreat their employees.
Here in this new company I told them flatly that I was not interested in anything the last place would have to say.
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  #46  
Old 16.05.2011, 15:24
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Re: Intermediate Work Certificate - Secret Wording !?

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Here in this new company I told them flatly that I was not interested in anything the last place would have to say.
"The gap slammer left behind replaced him to our complete satisfaction...."
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  #47  
Old 16.05.2011, 15:37
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Re: Intermediate Work Certificate - Secret Wording !?

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"The gap slammer left behind replaced him to our complete satisfaction...."
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  #48  
Old 16.05.2011, 15:55
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Re: Intermediate Work Certificate - Secret Wording !?

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Hi Forum,

I am going to leave my job ( or be asked to leave ) in a month or so and have asked my employer for an "intermediate work certificate". I figured it was better to ask now while I am still employed so I can get the right wording before I'm out the door and get issued with the final certificate and have less leverage to revert.

Question is, I heard there is special wording they use to differentiate between "good" and "bad" employees -

Mr X has performed his duties to our satisfaction = BAD
Mr X has performed his duties to our complete satisfaction = GOOD

... and guess what they've put on my certificate!

I was a "B" grade employee until 3 months ago when I was signed off with stress, and I decided not to go back to a negative environment. I asked for my certificate up until the beginning of my absence but I get the feeling they are trying to snipe me for being absent ( a few other reasons too, but that's not the issue for this thread ) - in any case, they are proving themselves less than trustworthy across the board, so I'm being super careful with this certificate, essentially my reference for future employers.

Has anyone heard of this wording thing?

Thanks Forum !

PS - I didn't see any other threads on this, I read the FAQ AND googled it
Well, I'd put you at B grade for using google and/or the search function, as this has been very well discussed here already. Also by googling "Arbeitszeugnis" together with "Geheimcode" or "Geheimsprache" would have landed you lots of information.

Reference Letter Q & A

Reference Letter: What should it contain?

Reference Letter: Can I request a rewrite?

Unfortunately, the document you really want is the one linked in this post , but it doesn't seem to exist anymore, or the server is down. So you can maybe also try this link

Last edited by litespeed; 16.05.2011 at 16:09.
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  #49  
Old 16.05.2011, 18:31
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Re: Intermediate Work Certificate - Secret Wording !?

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Just caught this thread, interesting.
I do realize how important a Resume is in paper-document-mad countries like our beloved little island of prosperity, some of you may remember that I was happy to leave the last company so happy in fact that I just could not be arsed to demand a good resume, any written comments from them bastwards would be counter-productive indeedy, it works both ways just as we can get red blobbies on the forum so indeed can companies who mistreat their employees.
Here in this new company I told them flatly that I was not interested in anything the last place would have to say.
I eventually got a good work certificate by writing to the CO in the UK and saying I felt it was disgusting that I should be treated this way after 4 years "loyal" service ... I got what I wanted in the end ( last Dec ) and the issue is now closed for me. But I just learned my friend is now going through the same thing - the bank are trying to right royally screw her - but she was clever enough to fight for an intermediary work certificate before she left, so they can't change anything now.... No more banks for me, evar !
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  #50  
Old 16.07.2011, 02:34
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Re: Intermediate Work Certificate - Secret Wording !?

Would anybody be willing to read the last paragraph of my reference?... It's in German - I don't understand it completely and also after reading this thread, a bit worried. I'd appreciate your "translating/decoding" skills
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  #51  
Old 16.07.2011, 19:05
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Re: Intermediate Work Certificate - Secret Wording !?

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Would anybody be willing to read the last paragraph of my reference?... It's in German - I don't understand it completely and also after reading this thread, a bit worried. I'd appreciate your "translating/decoding" skills
Why not post it? leave out your name if you prefer!
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  #52  
Old 17.07.2011, 11:44
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Re: Intermediate Work Certificate - Secret Wording !?

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Your certificate must have
"performed his duties to our complete satisfaction"

anything else is not acceptable, (or you screwed up! )
Hi,

Could you enlighten me as to the meaning of "you screwed up"? If for example the employee was always given brilliant performance reviews, and the company then decides to write something completely different in the reference letter, can they get away with it?
I mean, if they can write whatever they fancy, then on what grounds can one attempt to negotiate the wording? Can't they just say "no, we already decided we want to write it this way"?

Last edited by oferet; 17.07.2011 at 11:54. Reason: typo
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  #53  
Old 17.07.2011, 12:19
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Re: Intermediate Work Certificate - Secret Wording !?

If you have worked for the company for several years, they must by default be totally satisfied with your performance or they would have terminated the contract.

You MUST obtain a good certificate, by law they can not do anything to harm your future so they have to comply if asked. Switzerland is all about negociating.

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Hi,

Could you enlighten me as to the meaning of "you screwed up"? If for example the employee was always given brilliant performance reviews, and the company then decides to write something completely different in the reference letter, can they get away with it?
I mean, if they can write whatever they fancy, then on what grounds can one attempt to negotiate the wording? Can't they just say "no, we already decided we want to write it this way"?
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  #54  
Old 17.07.2011, 12:53
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Re: Intermediate Work Certificate - Secret Wording !?

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Hi,

Could you enlighten me as to the meaning of "you screwed up"? If for example the employee was always given brilliant performance reviews, and the company then decides to write something completely different in the reference letter, can they get away with it?
I mean, if they can write whatever they fancy, then on what grounds can one attempt to negotiate the wording? Can't they just say "no, we already decided we want to write it this way"?
Make sure you have a copy of your reviews....

You can then write to HR and say "see good reviews were given".

I was with a company for 3.5 years, and I always received stellar
reviews. My last boss and I did not get along so well, and he
wrote a less than stellar work certificate with coded words.

I wrote HR with a copy of my reviews and they gave me a good
work certificate....
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  #55  
Old 18.07.2011, 12:22
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Re: Intermediate Work Certificate - Secret Wording !?

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Would anybody be willing to read the last paragraph of my reference?... It's in German - I don't understand it completely and also after reading this thread, a bit worried. I'd appreciate your "translating/decoding" skills

I've sent you a pm. I can translate it for you.
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  #56  
Old 18.07.2011, 14:15
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Re: Intermediate Work Certificate - Secret Wording !?

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Perhaps the use of these letters within Switzerland is less prevalent in large multinationals? Or would they have asked for one if I'd come from another job in Switzerland?
I have the impression that these letters are very important for junior positions for which they would typically receive a large number of applications with very little possibility to differentiate between candidates on the basis of CV and cover letter alone.

The more senior the position, the more other factors they have to go by and the less this so-called coding matters.
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  #57  
Old 18.07.2011, 15:43
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Re: Intermediate Work Certificate - Secret Wording !?

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Why not post it? leave out your name if you prefer!
If I would want to post it, I would have done so. But thanks for the idea anyway...
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  #58  
Old 15.03.2012, 12:11
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Re: Intermediate Work Certificate - Secret Wording !?

Some experienced members indicate "performed his duties to our complete satisfaction" is a must. Does the following sound similar or do you think it is hiding a negative meaning?:

"performance was exceptional and found our full approval"
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  #59  
Old 15.03.2012, 12:32
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Re: Intermediate Work Certificate - Secret Wording !?

think its fine.
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Old 15.03.2012, 14:10
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Re: Intermediate Work Certificate - Secret Wording !?

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Some experienced members indicate "performed his duties to our complete satisfaction" is a must. Does the following sound similar or do you think it is hiding a negative meaning?:

"performance was exceptional and found our full approval"
The second variant is much better for sure. The first one is a "so-so"
recommendation.
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