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Old 13.05.2011, 09:39
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alternative med. doc seeking med. space

Serenity and good tidings to all:

I'm a Naturopathic Doctor from the San Francisco Bay Area and I'm seeking employment in a medical office located in canton Zürich. I have a Permit B good until March of 2016. I have a lot to offer in the area of health support, along with experience, with solid German language skills, to boot. If anyone has connections with an MD or DO who I could inquire with, I would be greatly appreciative.

Wishing everyone healthful days ahead, and thank you in advance for suggestions.

Eric
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Old 13.05.2011, 09:45
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Re: alternative med. doc seeking med. space

Welcome to the forum and CH!
It would be good to find out if you are actually allowed to work here as an MD, I am thinking it is not that simple.
Best of luck
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Old 13.05.2011, 10:50
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Re: alternative med. doc seeking med. space

That'd be an ND rather than MD. NDs are, historically, not supporters of evidence based medicine, so there's scope for conflict. Doctor is a protected title - you'd have to check whether you're permitted to call yourself doctor here.
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Old 13.05.2011, 11:16
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Re: alternative med. doc seeking med. space

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That'd be an ND rather than MD. NDs are, historically, not supporters of evidence based medicine, so there's scope for conflict. Doctor is a protected title - you'd have to check whether you're permitted to call yourself doctor here.
no need to check - he isn't (for good reasons). He'll neither be allowed to call himself a "Doktor" (academic degree, PhD), nor an "Arzt" (MD, what americans would call a doctor). The legal term for quacks here is "Heilpraktiker" (alternative practitioner).
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Old 13.05.2011, 12:02
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Re: alternative med. doc seeking med. space

To practice in Switzerland fully qualified and state registered German Heilpraktikers need to take the Swiss qualification exams (usually involving taking some courses as well) and I imagine the same would apply to US qualifications. Maybe things have changed recently for EU citizens, but I suspect not for non-EU nationals. Of course anyone can set themselves up as some kind of unofficial alternative health practitioner, but there would be less possibility of work, as insurance companies wouldn't reimburse treatment fees.
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Old 13.05.2011, 12:18
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Re: alternative med. doc seeking med. space

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To practice in Switzerland fully qualified and state registered German Heilpraktikers need to take the Swiss qualification exams (usually involving taking some courses as well) and I imagine the same would apply to US qualifications. Maybe things have changed recently for EU citizens, but I suspect not for non-EU nationals. Of course anyone can set themselves up as some kind of unofficial alternative health practitioner, but there would be less possibility of work, as insurance companies wouldn't reimburse treatment fees.
I would be fascinated to see exams for Homeopathic Doctors. I imagine you go in, sit down, get a blank sheet of paper put in front of you, look at it for a bit, hand it back in and tell them you've completed the exam and feel much better for it.
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Old 13.05.2011, 12:23
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Re: alternative med. doc seeking med. space

nono, you will have to write down stupid answers (normally cause you to fail the exam). Then you will have to dilute the paper in quadrillions of liters of water. This will turn the effect around, and you'll pass, the more water, the better.
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Old 13.05.2011, 12:40
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Re: alternative med. doc seeking med. space

Oh come on guys even if you (and I will include myself here) do not buy any of the naturopathic thing (cant call it science sorry) there is always someone that might find it helpful. OP was not trying to convince us to go see him...
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Old 13.05.2011, 13:12
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Re: alternative med. doc seeking med. space

Hey, despite my natural antipathy to such things, I did try to be helpful.
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Old 13.05.2011, 13:35
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Oh come on guys even if you (and I will include myself here) do not buy any of the naturopathic thing (cant call it science sorry) there is always someone that might find it helpful. OP was not trying to convince us to go see him...
The doctors wont, nor will you if you choke on a peanut on your next easyjet flight back to the motherland and the tannoy announces to the eager crowd 'IS THERE A DOCTOR ON-BOARD', and this guy stands bolt upright and says 'Hi everybody, I'm a NEURO-INVESTIGATORY-PATHIO-HYPER_GASTRO_üBER DOCTOR, I mostly specialise in crystals and and healing damaged halos and shackras, but I'll give the tracheotomy ago, I need a screw driver and a biro... by the way do you fancy any of my special oil? it comes from snakes y'know, special ones.....
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Old 13.05.2011, 14:02
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Re: alternative med. doc seeking med. space

Thanks everyone for your helpful suggestions and commentary. I am very honored to receive the attention that I have thus far received, and for that, I am thankful. Further, many of the questions/commentary shared I've had to answer in the US as well, so I hope you feel open to being further educated on various matters.

Regarding calling myself a 'doctor' here, I can not. Instead, Naturarzt, oder Naturheilpraktiker. In the US, I can diagnose and treat diseases, while using imaging and lab diagnostics (blood work) to do so. Here is Swiss, and as it is the same in the US, both titles 'MD' and well as 'ND' are both protected. As for insurance, if you have supplemental insurance that covers alternative healthcare (zusaztversicherung), which some of you do, it can be used to offset the cost of services.

There was a 'question' raised regarding the difference between homeopathy and naturopathy, and this is a common one. Homeopathy is a specific modality, i.e. massage, physiotherapy, cranio-sacral therapy, and uses this modality to treat an individual (not diagnose). Whereas naturopathy, a 4-year, post-graduate didactic study, may use nutriceuticals (diet & nutrition support) and/or phytotherapy and/or homeopathy and/or pharmaceuticals (Class III and V drugs while working with an MD), while also having the legal allowance to diagnose. I hope that explanation provides greater clarity.

With this distinct ability, and in the US, I've been able to work in a hospital, in private practice with an internist and geriatrist, and importantly, being able to combine conventional and complimentary approaches to meet a patient's interest(s) and need(s).

Though, here in canton Zürich, and not being given title 'doctor', I'm currently in discussion with Gov. Administration about treatment and diagnosing options privileges, and should have that ironed out in an apace manner.

There was also a comment on a incongruence of practice between MD and ND. This is a great comment, and I thank him/her for it, but the truth is the following: There has never in the history of man been one modality that has worked well for everyone. In a multi-disciplinary practice, the patient wins, which is the paramount interest for the practitioner of medicine. Hence, and as stated before, I'm seeking employment in a medical practice, knowing from experience how successful this approach has been for patients.

If I don't find a practice with an MD, I will go solo with one, while also networking with MD's, DO's and Chiropractors and other health professionals to best find balance and resolution in your health interest(s).

So, I hope that many of you are well, and if you have the interest to help me find a space in a practice with an MD, I would be grateful. Moreover, if there are any other questions regarding philosophy, practice or differences in clinical acumen between an MD and ND, please don't hesitate to ask. When it comes to health, clarity clarity clarity and more clarity is always the best policy.

And in advance, thank you again.
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Old 13.05.2011, 14:42
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Re: alternative med. doc seeking med. space

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...There was a 'question' raised regarding the difference between homeopathy and naturopathy, and this is a common one. Homeopathy is a specific modality, i.e. massage, physiotherapy, cranio-sacral therapy, and uses this modality to treat an individual (not diagnose). ...
It absolutely certainly is not. Homeopathy (while utter nonsense) has nothing to do with massage, physiotherapy, cranio-sacral therapy. You're thinking of osteopathy, I would imagine.

If that's your level of woo-medical knowledge... (shakes head and wanders off in disbelief).
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Old 13.05.2011, 14:54
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Re: alternative med. doc seeking med. space

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The doctors wont, nor will you if you choke on a peanut on your next easyjet flight back to the motherland and the tannoy announces to the eager crowd 'IS THERE A DOCTOR ON-BOARD', and this guy stands bolt upright and says 'Hi everybody, I'm a NEURO-INVESTIGATORY-PATHIO-HYPER_GASTRO_üBER DOCTOR, I mostly specialise in crystals and and healing damaged halos and shackras, but I'll give the tracheotomy ago, I need a screw driver and a biro... by the way do you fancy any of my special oil? it comes from snakes y'know, special ones.....
I am a doctor MD, PhD, I do not use easyjet and I am Peruvian. Still I do not think there is the need to insult people
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Old 13.05.2011, 15:50
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Re: alternative med. doc seeking med. space

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Homeopathy is a specific modality, i.e. massage, physiotherapy, cranio-sacral therapy, and uses this modality to treat an individual (not diagnose). Whereas naturopathy, a 4-year, post-graduate didactic study, may use nutriceuticals (diet & nutrition support) and/or phytotherapy and/or homeopathy and/or pharmaceuticals (Class III and V drugs while working with an MD), while also having the legal allowance to diagnose. I hope that explanation provides greater clarity.
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It absolutely certainly is not. Homeopathy (while utter nonsense) has nothing to do with massage, physiotherapy, cranio-sacral therapy. You're thinking of osteopathy, I would imagine.

If that's your level of woo-medical knowledge... (shakes head and wanders off in disbelief).
I was just about to post an identical reply earlier, but I realised that he was giving examples of "specific modalit[ies]".

Using "i.e." instead of "e.g." didn't help.
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Old 13.05.2011, 17:45
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Re: alternative med. doc seeking med. space

Could have been - but even with e.g. it implies the homeopathy is defined by the following list.
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