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Old 13.07.2011, 22:03
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What is a zeugnis in reference to Kindergarten

As above, i know its a type of reference letter which we asked for as part of our son moving to another kindergarten, however with his there's literally nothing on it except the date/time of his one and only parents evening.

I would have expected to see thing like

what he's good at
where he's not so good at
where he's improved over the year
where he need more work on

Am i expecting too much for Adliswil?
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Old 13.07.2011, 22:35
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Re: What is a zeugnis in reference to Kindergarten

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As above, i know its a type of reference letter which we asked for as part of our son moving to another kindergarten, however with his there's literally nothing on it except the date/time of his one and only parents evening.

I would have expected to see thing like

what he's good at
where he's not so good at
where he's improved over the year
where he need more work on

Am i expecting too much for Adliswil?
Zeugnis in regards to schooling is like a report card, and should contain the points you've outlined above.

However at KG level, this could be considered too judgemental for kiddies only just unleashed from their mummies' apron strings.

Probably just a few words in general terms, written at the end of the school year, is deemed sufficient - but you appear to have missed out on even that ..... I wouldn't worry too much - it will more than likely sort out next year.
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Old 13.07.2011, 23:20
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Re: What is a zeugnis in reference to Kindergarten

I am not sure if you are talking about creche, or enfantine there (I think enfantine is kindy in your lingo), but a kiddo moving up to enfantine from creche has to have a pediatrician checking for speech, motoric, balance, other developements, sealing it and then it gets sent to main enfantine nurse in the area (the enfantine gets a copy). Otherwise, a report car for a child so young (it would be more social skills and cognitive, I suppose), I haven't heard of in our area.
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Old 14.07.2011, 06:30
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Re: What is a zeugnis in reference to Kindergarten

Your child seems to behave well in every aspect and according to the age. If not you had been informed directly by the kindergarten teacher. She probably would have told you that she was going to inform the new kindergarten. "Zeugnisse" are simply not done in kindergarten. So, no news, good news.
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Old 14.07.2011, 06:44
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Re: What is a zeugnis in reference to Kindergarten

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I am not sure if you are talking about creche, or enfantine there (I think enfantine is kindy in your lingo), but a kiddo moving up to enfantine from creche has to have a pediatrician checking for speech, motoric, balance, other developements, sealing it and then it gets sent to main enfantine nurse in the area (the enfantine gets a copy). Otherwise, a report car for a child so young (it would be more social skills and cognitive, I suppose), I haven't heard of in our area.
We've not been asked for that in our current move from daycare to Kindergarten. We just had the usual forms which we are supposed to fill in with contact details of parents, any medications needed and/or allergies, mother-tongue(s), amongst other stuff. The doctor has not been involved at any point. I would be deeply suspicious of any medical notes being transferred by my son's doctor without my knowledge or approval.

My son had his standard 4-year development check but at no point did his doctor tell me he was transferring his notes to anyone but maybe it's worth a phone call this morning to find out for sure.

This may be the case in the French part but even then I would find it on dodgy ground if it's done in such a clandestine way of sealed envelopes and no approval from the parent.

I think the OP is talking about his child transferring from one kindergarten to the next and is therefore wondering why there is so little information on the reference letter after his child has already spent time there.

Last edited by Sandgrounder; 14.07.2011 at 06:57.
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Old 14.07.2011, 07:06
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Re: What is a zeugnis in reference to Kindergarten

I'm not sure that you need one...

I would ask the new kindergarten if they need anything from the old one...otherwise, the new teacher will simply take their own observations, get to know your child and then move on from there...

I know that I have seen 'comprehensive' developmental reports occasionally in the past, and they were generally from kids with developmental problems who had a lot of 'history' (even if they were written in the positive and failed to mention the problems)....for children around age 4.

Kids grow and develop so fast - what you know from last week will be different to what you see next week...most kids are given a 'fresh start' each time they change teacher or classroom...
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Old 14.07.2011, 07:17
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Re: What is a zeugnis in reference to Kindergarten

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I'm not sure that you need one...

I would ask the new kindergarten if they need anything from the old one...otherwise, the new teacher will simply take their own observations, get to know your child and then move on from there...

I know that I have seen 'comprehensive' developmental reports occasionally in the past, and they were generally from kids with developmental problems who had a lot of 'history' (even if they were written in the positive and failed to mention the problems)....for children around age 4.

Kids grow and develop so fast - what you know from last week will be different to what you see next week...most kids are given a 'fresh start' each time they change teacher or classroom...
Keeping all of this in mind, you may also consider that you don't want one. It is sometimes better to let a child be observed in a completely unbiased light.
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Old 14.07.2011, 08:09
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Re: What is a zeugnis in reference to Kindergarten

We had a similar letter sent to every parent. Our letter just stated our son attended a year of KG at a recognised bi-lingual kindergarten. When I asked what it was for his teacher said to keep this letter in a safe place for next year's grade 1 applications.

I moved school at age 16 and I am really glad that there was no report that went with me. Without boundaries or any preconceptions about me meant to could just get on with learning and study and do well at school for once.

Last edited by CH_Me; 14.07.2011 at 08:23.
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Old 14.07.2011, 08:14
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Re: What is a zeugnis in reference to Kindergarten

OK - not really on topic but as follow up to my earlier post and in case any future Kindergarten parents are worried about their child's medical records being sent round all and sundry, I've just come off the phone with the doctor's office and they say "absolutely not". No records, developmental, medical or otherwise are flashed around anybody.

If a child has a medical complaint that would affect them in their schooling, the school is notified but with the full knowledge of the parents and certainly not with any sealed envelopes. This is apparently true across the rest of the country but she couldn't say if there were any minor regional variations.

The only reason they need to know the name and number of the child's doctor is if there is some kind of emergency or some odd event where the doctor would need to be involved.

OK - back to Kindergarten reference letters...

Last edited by Sandgrounder; 14.07.2011 at 08:44.
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Old 14.07.2011, 09:15
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Re: What is a zeugnis in reference to Kindergarten

The Zeugnis is not a reference letter as you would see in application documents. The same word is used for school certificates/ school reports. Since Kindergarden has been more closely integrated to regular school, it is now mandatory to have one of those for each kid (at least in the Zurich canton).

The main use is to confirm the kid has been in kindergarden, so it's ok if there is not much info on it, especially if your kid hasn't been in that particular kindergarden for a whole year. The data you mentioned is sometimes written down, but it's not mandatory. Normally you would have some form used during the parents evening discussion, and that could be attached to the Zeugnis. You might ask for that, it always helps the new place to have some background info.
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Old 14.07.2011, 09:45
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Re: What is a zeugnis in reference to Kindergarten

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"Zeugnisse" are simply not done in kindergarten. So, no news, good news.
Just to add some info to this thread. Here in the french speaking part, swiss private school, we receive two things each year--an 'attestation', which is basically a certificate of attendance or proof that the child attended the school at a certain level, and a 'bulletin' which is basically a detailed report, or report card, as has been said on this thread concerning the performance, abilities, or grades. As I understand, if my children were to leave the country or change school both would be needed. Furthermore, the report card, even at the enfantine level (age 4 and 5 years), yes it exists, I find very useful as a parent to assess their abilities, identify areas of improvement, or just keep on top of their development.

The content of our report card at the enfantine/kindergarten level is not a number or graded report like what you might see for an older child, but is adapted to the skills and level of enfantine. Thus, things like how well they work in a group, participation in class, behavior, writing/drawing skills, cognitive ability, language skills, ability to follow directions, oral comprehension, attention to detail, etc. They are not graded as such, but use a 4 tier colour scale that goes from very good, good, satisfactory, or could be improved. Thus, it is not a critical assessment as such, but I find it a good gauge to determine if my children are comfortble or if there is need for encouragement in certain areas.
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Old 14.07.2011, 10:32
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Re: What is a zeugnis in reference to Kindergarten

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I'm not sure that you need one...

I would ask the new kindergarten if they need anything from the old one...otherwise, the new teacher will simply take their own observations, get to know your child and then move on from there...
In Kanton Aargau Kindergarten is not compulsory, though highly recommended. Many children start 1st Grade without ever having attended kindergarten as they may have been in daycare or private schools. The schools do not request any reports. However, as kindergarten is compulsory in the canton of Zürich, it seems logical that you just need to confirm your child attended a kindergarten, which is what the OP has.

At this age, I think the less said about your child, the better. When you first move here, this can be very unsettling for your children (and parents as well ! ) I think many of the local teachers do not understand this. It is all very new and overwhelming and in the first year, not all children thrive. Parents often see their children behave in ways they never imagined. which can be very upsetting to parents. In time most kids at this age make friends and settle in. In fact, many do better than their parents and learn the language very quickly.

Some schools and teachers have more experience with non German speaking children joining their class, and can appreciate that it takes time for these children to adjust to their new surroundings.

Hope your son has a good start in his new school.
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Old 14.07.2011, 15:55
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Re: What is a zeugnis in reference to Kindergarten

Hahaha, ok, so this is not dramatic at all, parents sign. It does sound like a regional thing here, and in public schooling, only. It is a form, parents fill in, then the doc does, the parent has a look, then it gets sealed, off it goes to the main regional nurse appointed that year for collecting info on kindy kids and supervising vax and later screen tests that are done in kindy (hearing, language, sight, if I am not mistaken). If I remember well, it contained info on motoric developement, if the child can follow simple instructions, speech (we are very multilingual, so that makes a point), hearing, language, vision, allergies, special medical needs, if the child is on top of their vx since it is a huge issue, VD school docs require vaccination before letting kids to school, etc. Not much else. Parents have access to this info, in fact it was me who signed, and the doc. Then it gets sealed and shipped off to the main kindy nurse.

No conspiracy or weirdness. If there was some, I would have jumped on it.

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We've not been asked for that in our current move from daycare to Kindergarten. We just had the usual forms which we are supposed to fill in with contact details of parents, any medications needed and/or allergies, mother-tongue(s), amongst other stuff. The doctor has not been involved at any point. I would be deeply suspicious of any medical notes being transferred by my son's doctor without my knowledge or approval.

My son had his standard 4-year development check but at no point did his doctor tell me he was transferring his notes to anyone but maybe it's worth a phone call this morning to find out for sure.

This may be the case in the French part but even then I would find it on dodgy ground if it's done in such a clandestine way of sealed envelopes and no approval from the parent.

I think the OP is talking about his child transferring from one kindergarten to the next and is therefore wondering why there is so little information on the reference letter after his child has already spent time there.
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Old 14.07.2011, 16:14
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Re: What is a zeugnis in reference to Kindergarten

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Hahaha, ok, so this is not dramatic at all, parents sign. It does sound like a regional thing here, and in public schooling, only. It is a form, parents fill in, then the doc does, the parent has a look, then it gets sealed, off it goes to the main regional nurse appointed that year for collecting info on kindy kids and supervising vax and later screen tests that are done in kindy (hearing, language, sight, if I am not mistaken). If I remember well, it contained info on motoric developement, if the child can follow simple instructions, speech (we are very multilingual, so that makes a point), hearing, language, vision, allergies, special medical needs, if the child is on top of their vx since it is a huge issue, VD school docs require vaccination before letting kids to school, etc. Not much else. Parents have access to this info, in fact it was me who signed, and the doc. Then it gets sealed and shipped off to the main kindy nurse.
But that still doesn't make any sense - do the schools over on the French side assume that kids don't have their own paedatrician? All of those checks you mention above are done at the standard developmental stage check ups (most recently for us at four years old) which is not shared with anyone except the parents and, in the case of transference to a specialist, with the relevant people. Certainly not the school system.

It all sounds a bit like school in the UK in my day when nitty-Nora the head explorer used to come round the schools checking for head-lice, impetigo and doing vision and hearing tests every six months.

Is your child in the public Kindergarten/Enfantine system or is it a private school? My son was in a private daycare and they had a health form that would have been more appropriate for a NASA candidate than a pre-schooler. The (public) Kindergarten had a more general "Is he breathing, has he got all four limbs and is he allergic to anything?" approach.
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Old 14.07.2011, 16:48
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Re: What is a zeugnis in reference to Kindergarten

With regard to health checks, we had to go visit either my daughter's doctor or the school appointed doctor (same person in our case) and get a check-up. He then signed a form to say it had happened and I sent it back to the school. There were no health details regarding my daughter on the form at all.

With regard to a progress report, I did get one at the last parent/teacher interview. It had a few statements about development over the last six months, and some recommendations for the new teacher in first class to consider. It seemed to me to be a very considered process with considered outcomes, both of which were explained clearly to me and with which I agreed.

I signed it, she gave me a copy and I guess sent one on to the new teacher at the 'big' school.

But my daughter spent the whole two years in a local kindergarten in Meilen so maybe it's different here, I don't know.

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Old 14.07.2011, 16:53
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Re: What is a zeugnis in reference to Kindergarten

The info is private, basically another form done at the 4yr check (we did it later), that is pawned over to the main school nurse who is making sure kids without vax, for example, do not get into the class. The language issue monitored by a school nurse is great, since she will oversee our kiddo has another check, and probably supplementary classes provided, that nurse is in closer touch with early intervention folks, logopedy wise, or other minor issue wise, it is not only medical, but more social and integrative outlook.

I see zero problem with another medical authority having overlook over vaxing and other tests, another screening for hearing (we had the lovely ocassion to score 5 ear inf), and other mild issues that are easier to screen through classroom setting than pushing parents to cooperate with peds and then having scheduled checks and keeping tracks of those checks, it is not practical. Massive screening through classes are more efficient, all takes a second and it's done. Kids with problems don't fall through the cracks, and the system does not have to rely on parents noticinig something is wrong.

Everyone has their own ped and scheduled check ups, but on top, the school gets to provide supplementary care, belt and suspenders. I like it, since I grew up in the same system, it is thorough, or at least meant to be. Trusting parents to secure vax, for example, would be tricky, since, we have a huge percentage of foreigners here, kids come and go, the mobility must be one of the highest here at la Cote region. This is not private schooling, it's public, but I am not sure something tells me in our area the private sector might be also having similar stuff, school nurse, collecting info on vax, etc. maybe not the screening tests offered.
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Old 14.07.2011, 17:05
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Re: What is a zeugnis in reference to Kindergarten

A vaccination check box was also on our form but that was for us to sign and wasn't countersigned or even checked by our doctor.

"Mass screening" sounds a bit draconian but I agree that anything like dodgy eyesight or hearing is more likely to be picked up in class purely by the child struggling with stuff.

Zurich is also pretty transient in so far as the amount of foreigners coming and going, some of whose kids will filter through the public school system but I still don't think the rules sound quite so dramatic as they do over on the French side.
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Old 14.07.2011, 17:19
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Re: What is a zeugnis in reference to Kindergarten

It's the German side that has very poor vax rates, if I remember the figures well. The school taking over certain control here probably does have a role in this. It's not dramatic, again, a doc signs, parent signs, then it goes sealed by mail to a nurse who has this info on hand in case something happens, parents aren't reachable, ped is on hols..I do like the skill charting, hearing, motoric, speaking, cooperation, the doc had a discussion with my child, gave her some instructions, watched her closely if she understands, how her responses were...the regular check up, with a difference the school nurse gets certain portion of info on her desk should school need it. (I grew up in the same system, though, even the yearly doc check ups were done with school ped in nearby clinic, the entire class, vaxing, checking)..
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Old 14.07.2011, 17:32
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Re: What is a zeugnis in reference to Kindergarten

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It's the German side that has very poor vax rates, if I remember the figures well.
Current figures show national averages of being over 90%. Can't be that much of an issue...
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Old 14.07.2011, 17:37
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Re: What is a zeugnis in reference to Kindergarten

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Current figures show national averages of being over 90%. Can't be that much of an issue...
I think it depends on what, the articles on CH having one of the poor vax stats in Europe are still all over. WHO gave CH a slap, to wake them up a tad, not so long ago.

Media smeared low vax rates on measels last time we had an outbreak, a few months back.
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