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  #41  
Old 14.11.2011, 14:33
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Re: How much is too much?

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November makes me think of him.
That's a sad story...

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It's when band mates, brothers and guys at work start treating you like a guy that's when you kinda want that little bit of regular man/woman galantry cliche theme into the friendship bonds, somebody to help with a heavy amp, etc etc.
I actually was happy to be treated like a guy by my friends. I developed a special kind of hatred for women as a teenager. Mind you, I grew up meanwhile and changed my views, but what you immediately associate to brainless, stupid, spoilt teenage girls is still very much what I associate to the 7th circle of hell. Being treated like a "boy" was the best therapy.

Does the a-sexual friendship work 100%? No. There will always be a lustful thought escaping once and a while. But as my dear granpa-in-law said: "You should check the menu outside, but you eat at home".
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  #42  
Old 14.11.2011, 15:05
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Re: How much is too much?

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I actually was happy to be treated like a guy by my friends.
Of course, the ultimate tomboy treatment, but I think never really conciously wanted specifically that, it more worked out that way - it's still putting you into a limiting cathegory, though. I understand you. I do think when one leaves stereotypes for whoever wants to play with them (it's that feeling of gossip/assumptions/expectations/other social menace having absolutely zero effect on your life, they wash off yer back), people will most likely not dare stereotype/gossip/assume about you either.
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Old 14.11.2011, 15:13
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Re: How much is too much?

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November makes me think of him.

Attachments are weird, there is no way to describe the nature of it precisely in order to say we are friends on this or this level, me thinks. There are looks and thoughts that can be way dirtier than the out there explicit things. It's when band mates, brothers and guys at work start treating you like a guy that's when you kinda want that little bit of regular man/woman galantry cliche theme into the friendship bonds, somebody to help with a heavy amp, etc etc.
how interesting, I prefer to be treated like one of the guys...I'm not the sort that requires a guy to "place his cape over puddles for me"

Edit: too slow with my response as I just read the above ones. Anyway, I guess we're veering OT again...but as for stereotypes, being an Asian female I don't fit any of the assumed ones...aside fm the fact that I married a white male, apparently for his Swiss passport of course!
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Old 14.11.2011, 15:19
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Re: How much is too much?

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how interesting, I prefer to be treated like one of the guys...I'm not the sort that requires a guy to "place his cape over puddles for me"

Edit: too slow with my response as I just read the above ones. Anyway, I guess we're veering OT again...but as for stereotypes, being an Asian female I don't fit any of the assumed ones...aside fm the fact that I married a white male, apparently for his Swiss passport of course!
Me neither

I usually get picked up and carried over puddles :P
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Old 14.11.2011, 15:20
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Re: How much is too much?

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how interesting, I prefer to be treated like one of the guys...I'm not the sort that requires a guy to "place his cape over puddles for me"
Who do you hang out with that uses capes????
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  #46  
Old 14.11.2011, 15:24
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Re: How much is too much?

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Who do you hang out with that uses capes????
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  #47  
Old 14.11.2011, 15:26
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Re: How much is too much?

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I believe you need to ask yourself the right questions.
I just love your post, Sky. There’s nothing I could add and I really think about these matters a lot.
I’ve been with my OH for four years now, and we’ve been married for a year. We are very much in love and for now we do not even need to ask “how much is too much” because we trust each other 100%.
Yet there are always these thoughts and insecurities that we all have. Will it last until death do us part? How to cherish and preserve what we have?
I love this quote by Jung: “A man who has not passed through the inferno of his passions has never overcome them. They then dwell in the house next door, and at any moment a flame may dart out and set fire to his own house. Whenever we give up, leave behind, and forget too much, there is always the danger that the things we have neglected will return with the added force.” Karl’s thread, which inspired this one, was closed too soon for me to express my appreciation of his honesty. He experienced a passionate moment but caught himself in time, reflected on it, and now tries to undo the damage. It’s easy for us to judge him as cool-headed outsiders, and perhaps he needed to hear a few harsh words, perhaps…
However, we could also face a similar situation in which we will not be able to think clearly because emotions will cloud our reason.
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  #48  
Old 14.11.2011, 15:27
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Re: How much is too much?

I dont go through my husbands emails and have no intention but i sometimes use his skype to call my family abroad with his permission of course and saw that an ex left a message, thats it. I know all about the ex and we agreed theres no reason to get back in touch with her. But the pictures is something i really dont like but if he doesnt wanna get rid of them then i will understand.
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Old 14.11.2011, 15:32
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Re: How much is too much?

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...I'm not the sort that requires a guy to "place his cape over puddles for me"
Wow......... the sort of man who wears a cape is more likely to throw YOU in the puddle.

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Old 14.11.2011, 15:35
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Re: How much is too much?

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Going back to the title of the thread, this is too much
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  #51  
Old 14.11.2011, 15:40
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Re: How much is too much?

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where did you find my pic!?!? My ex "said" she destroyed all copies.
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Old 14.11.2011, 15:43
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Re: How much is too much?

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We even went so far as to include in our wedding vows, to honour one another with our eyes. We believe that is important, though each couple has to decide their personal tolerance level.
Just curious - does this mean that everything from looking at someone of the opposite sex to viewing porn is out?
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  #53  
Old 14.11.2011, 15:44
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Re: How much is too much?

I think a deep emotional attachment with an erotic background is the larger betrayal than meaningless sex.
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  #54  
Old 14.11.2011, 17:41
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Re: How much is too much?

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I think a lot depends on the tolerance/jealousy of the partner. For example, on Friday, I had a friend around for dinner but she had to go home and was not 'allowed ' to stay over to avoid problems with her bf.
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Something does bother me in both the threads. It seems that the thought that women and men cannot be friends - only lovers - is still around. In Switzerland. In 2011. ......
Have some rep for a such a sensible and balanced post helm.

I think Phil also hit the nail on the head. It all depends on the tolerance of the partner. Me and the OH have different tolerance levels. I have lots of guy friends - always been a "tom boy" in that aspect - and my OH is very cool about it.

He on the other hand, can be quite flirtatious in my books and he often disagrees with me that he's overstepped the mark simply because I also get jealous much more easily than he does. He doesnt think much of going to a movie with his female classmate from german class whereas I wouldnt have been comfortable when he does that - especially if she is single and I've never met her. He also walks the talk as he doesnt think much of me buying presents for good male mates when we are on holiday.

I think at the end of the day, the question: when is enough, enough is very subjective. Some spouses are cooler customers than others and each relationship's dynamics are different.

The yardstick is simply put yourself in your partner's shoes and ask yourself: would he/she been comfortable with what I am doing now?
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Old 15.11.2011, 17:15
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Re: How much is too much?

My OH and I have been discussing this very thing in depth recently. I was his first - it was his ideal at the time, and we both agreed seeking physical or emotional gratification outside of our relationship was not an option. He's never been jealous or anything and we talk openly about coffee / lunch with colleagues of the opposite sx when it happens (once in a blue moon).

Having kids has meant that sx doesn't happen as often as it used to (atm 2-3 times / wk) and life is generally less spontaneous with all our responsibilities and work issues.

He has recently expressed that a purely physical encounter, if agreed by us both is something he would consider, if I really wanted it myself or agreed to it for him. He compares it to me getting a back massage at the physiotherapist (female, but he wouldn't care if it were a male)... I have been twice...and only because he refuses to massage my back (He hates having his massaged and just can't see how he can massage mine when he himself can't imagine it being good...if that makes sense).

To me this is a bit of a shock, as I have based our relationship on what we agreed. I can accept that people change but this is pretty big, and it brings back extremely painful memories of my ex. One of the main reasons I fell in love with my now hubby was his outlook on marriage. He knows about this, but says 5 years is a long time and people change.

He assures me that he loves me, and wants me and more children together. He also assures me that nothing has happened and nothing would unless it were agreed...neither does he say that it's something he expects...Just that it's something to discuss. I said that physical or emotional outsourcing is still NOT an option. He said he respected that.

Life for me isn't as sweet as it was before either - The emotional warmth and romance is few and far between. But he says he would be more emotionally available and romantic if I were to be as he wants.

If it carries on without me changing, he "doesn't know how things with eventuate".

I love him and am totally devoted to our marriage and family, but feel extremely pressured, and all my skeletons are coming out of the closet to haunt me again. "One thing inevitably leads to another". But his argument is that I imprison him with my clear 'limits'.

Guys, men, blokes, anyone who has experience or an opinion:

Any advice?

Thanks in advance
FF
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  #56  
Old 15.11.2011, 17:25
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Re: How much is too much?

Well, I am the manual one in the house, I repair, fix, paint and do much more stuff than a typical girl will do. So if a guy wants to hold the door for me, help carrying my bags etc, please, go ahead...
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Old 15.11.2011, 17:41
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Re: How much is too much?

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Guys, men, blokes, anyone who has experience or an opinion:
FF
Sorry to hear that as it sounds as if he wants something different to you.

I would have a long hard talk with him and try and get to the bottom of where he sees you both being in the future.

Wish you all the luck in the world.
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Old 15.11.2011, 18:14
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Re: How much is too much?

If my husband tells me that, i will be very much hurt and suspicious that there´s already someone else. My husband just recently changed his stand on this subject (how much is too much). Before me, he didnt give much importance to monogamy but he is a nerd anyway and was obsessed with his hobby more than his ex girlfriends. He changed after finding out that his ex from a long distance relationship (of 6 yrs) was cheating on him. He had a major breakdown where he couldnt work/leave the house for weeks.
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Old 15.11.2011, 18:24
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Re: How much is too much?

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My OH and I have been discussing this very thing in depth recently. I was his first - it was his ideal at the time, and we both agreed seeking physical or emotional gratification outside of our relationship was not an option. He's never been jealous or anything and we talk openly about coffee / lunch with colleagues of the opposite sx when it happens (once in a blue moon).

Having kids has meant that sx doesn't happen as often as it used to (atm 2-3 times / wk) and life is generally less spontaneous with all our responsibilities and work issues.

He has recently expressed that a purely physical encounter, if agreed by us both is something he would consider, if I really wanted it myself or agreed to it for him. He compares it to me getting a back massage at the physiotherapist (female, but he wouldn't care if it were a male)... I have been twice...and only because he refuses to massage my back (He hates having his massaged and just can't see how he can massage mine when he himself can't imagine it being good...if that makes sense).

To me this is a bit of a shock, as I have based our relationship on what we agreed. I can accept that people change but this is pretty big, and it brings back extremely painful memories of my ex. One of the main reasons I fell in love with my now hubby was his outlook on marriage. He knows about this, but says 5 years is a long time and people change.

He assures me that he loves me, and wants me and more children together. He also assures me that nothing has happened and nothing would unless it were agreed...neither does he say that it's something he expects...Just that it's something to discuss. I said that physical or emotional outsourcing is still NOT an option. He said he respected that.

Life for me isn't as sweet as it was before either - The emotional warmth and romance is few and far between. But he says he would be more emotionally available and romantic if I were to be as he wants.

If it carries on without me changing, he "doesn't know how things with eventuate".

I love him and am totally devoted to our marriage and family, but feel extremely pressured, and all my skeletons are coming out of the closet to haunt me again. "One thing inevitably leads to another". But his argument is that I imprison him with my clear 'limits'.

Guys, men, blokes, anyone who has experience or an opinion:

Any advice?

Thanks in advance
FF
i would advise you to go to couples counseling, i think this is an issue between the two of you that is not necessarily your problem and something that has changed the dynamics of your relationship. maybe he can't grasp the result in your feelings after his "honesty" and maybe you can't grasp his feelings either- who knows, but either way if you leave it like that i'm sure nothing good can come of it other than suspicion, resentment or other muddy waters.

i'm a firm believer in finding someone to mediate and help two people find a way to work things thru when feelings get to much to deal with...

all the best of luck...
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Old 15.11.2011, 20:08
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Re: How much is too much?

Flyingfox,

I feel for you as you are in a difficult position, what with trying to keep everything on an even keel for your children's sake while faced with this huge emotional burden.

Please follow the advice that amaraya gave to you and plan to see a counselor as soon as you can. If you cannot get your OH to go with you, go alone.

While you asked for opinions of men (which I am not), I will say as a woman that I do not believe that your OH's contention that a massage is akin to a one-time sexual encounter could be construed as reasonable in any way.

Your feelings of shock are valid as you entered your relationship under a set of parameters that your OH now desires to change. This might seem to you like a bit of a betrayal in and of itself. It is of utmost importance that you sort out these issues prior to the decision to have more children. You both need to explore what he means by you being "as he wants," and whether you are able or are willing to be that person.

Careers, children and the busy-ness of day-to-day life can snuff the passion from a long-term relationship very quickly! It is important that you and your partner work together and put in the effort required to keep your relationship healthy. A counselor could help you discover the love and passion that seem to be missing in your relationship.

All the best of luck to you and yours.
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