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  #21  
Old 04.10.2012, 19:36
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Re: Swiss Schooling - Apple Mac Only?

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I agree that the compatibility issue was relevant until a few years ago, but today mac has adapted quite perfectly as far as my experience goes.
Unfortunately, both my Mac and PC are nearly four years old (ancient?) now. They have compatibility issues, which i'm sure you can imagine. My question - will this 'compatibility' (if it exists today - though i do take your word for that) continue?

recent example ios6 maps. The point is there are these two HUGE GLOBAL giants fighting for market share - if it means putting up proprietary (read incompatible) programs / apps - the PERMANENT dominance of any one is doubtfull.

Why not give school kids the choice as well the exposure to both systems. I will go one step further, in fact : why should it not be MANDATORY to have basic exposure to both currently dominant systems?
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  #22  
Old 04.10.2012, 19:37
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Re: Swiss Schooling - Apple Mac Only?

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I agree that the compatibility issue was relevant until a few years ago, but today mac has adapted quite perfectly as far as my experience goes. I haven't had problems with that for ages.
Fonts and styles can be iffy when exchanging files between the Mac and PC versions of Office. No problem if you stick to the classic ones like Arial or Verdana, but some of the less common ones don't seem to have direct equivalents on the other system.

Edit: these issues were between Mac Office 2008 and PC version 2010, both of which were the latest versions available at the time.
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  #23  
Old 04.10.2012, 19:40
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Re: Swiss Schooling - Apple Mac Only?

right, but there are programs that can take care of that. I used to work a lot with fonts and had specialised graphic designers deal with that. not realistic in a school environment, of course.


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Fonts and styles can be iffy when exchanging files between the Mac and PC versions of Office. No problem if you stick to the classic ones like Arial or Verdana, but some of the less common ones don't seem to have direct equivalents on the other system.
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  #24  
Old 04.10.2012, 19:41
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Re: Swiss Schooling - Apple Mac Only?

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sorry, I realise this explanation sounds confusing.

if your daughter can prepare a presentation on the school Mac using not Keynote (ie apple's powerpoint) but Powerpoint for Mac, she shouldn't have any problems converting to her PC at home. hope this was clearer...
she did use the MS Office Power Point for Mac. The problems were still there
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Old 04.10.2012, 19:43
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Re: Swiss Schooling - Apple Mac Only?

well, I'm all for the free market and free choice, but it is more efficient if the brain of an average person is confronted only with one environment. even for digital natives it could be confusing otherwise.
so it's only fair to choose the best system and concentrate on that

seriously, though, I think that yes, in 4 years a lot has improved and yours systems might be outdated as to compatibility


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Unfortunately, both my Mac and PC are nearly four years old (ancient?) now. They have compatibility issues, which i'm sure you can imagine. My question - will this 'compatibility' (if it exists today - though i do take your word for that) continue?

recent example ios6 maps. The point is there are these two HUGE GLOBAL giants fighting for market share - if it means putting up proprietary (read incompatible) programs / apps - the PERMANENT dominance of any one is doubtfull.

Why not give school kids the choice as well the exposure to both systems. I will go one step further, in fact : why should it not be MANDATORY to have basic exposure to both currently dominant systems?
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Old 04.10.2012, 19:45
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Re: Swiss Schooling - Apple Mac Only?

then it could be really due to the "old" systems

maybe someone more expert than me has some enlightening solution?


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she did use the MS Office Power Point for Mac. The problems were still there
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Old 04.10.2012, 19:47
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Re: Swiss Schooling - Apple Mac Only?

When my family got a computer in 1994, it was Windows 3.11/DOS. At school we had similar. By the time I entered the jobs market, the standard in the workplace was Windows XP, and for more heavy duty computing work, Linux. The difference between Windows 3.11 and Windows XP was way bigger than the difference between Windows and Mac in terms of how to use them for basic office type tasks. By the time your kids get to the point of having to use computers for work, I expect the standard office type PC will be as different from current incarnations of either Windows or Mac OS of today as XP is from 3.11. The important thing is that they learn what computers can do and the basic ideas underpinning how to do tasks, and that can be equally well achieved in either OS (or Linux).
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Old 04.10.2012, 19:49
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Re: Swiss Schooling - Apple Mac Only?

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Fonts and styles can be iffy when exchanging files between the Mac and PC versions of Office. No problem if you stick to the classic ones like Arial or Verdana, but some of the less common ones don't seem to have direct equivalents on the other system.

Edit: these issues were between Mac Office 2008 and PC version 2010, both of which were the latest versions available at the time.
I agree that there WERE compatibility issues and that they NOW do not exist. An obvious solution would be to upgrade both systems, and use MS Office for MAC. The question is will this compatibility last? Going by past experience - probably not - blame it on MS or OS, problem remains.

The question is not about which is better, I am only wondering why there are ZERO pcs (by the looks of comments above) in Swiss schools.

Are the school authorities too - like many members here - so absolutely certain that MacOS will continue to increase it's dominance and Widows will become a relic?
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  #29  
Old 04.10.2012, 19:54
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Re: Swiss Schooling - Apple Mac Only?

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When my family got a computer in 1994, it was Windows 3.11/DOS. At school we had similar. By the time I entered the jobs market, the standard in the workplace was Windows XP, and for more heavy duty computing work, Linux. The difference between Windows 3.11 and Windows XP was way bigger than the difference between Windows and Mac in terms of how to use them for basic office type tasks. By the time your kids get to the point of having to use computers for work, I expect the standard office type PC will be as different from current incarnations of either Windows or Mac OS of today as XP is from 3.11. The important thing is that they learn what computers can do and the basic ideas underpinning how to do tasks, and that can be equally well achieved in either OS (or Linux).
More or less the same experience at me end. Basically, I'm just felling a bit put off by the lack of choice, which resulted in my kid literally wasting a few hours. Oh, and BTW - she took the MS font file to school to install on the Mac, but a simple paste into the 'Libraries/Fonts' did not work - the Mac needed a reboot - so she ended up with a presentation with lots of blank space where there should've been text !
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  #30  
Old 04.10.2012, 19:57
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Re: Swiss Schooling - Apple Mac Only?

I started with punch cards and batch files, used to have some programs that took up more than one box of cards (the BIG boxes), running on VM/370.

No MACs for me though, in fact, no Apple products at all!

I do run Ubuntu on several computers, mainly my servers and netbook, but I am NOT a unix fan, in fact I've always hated it (this computer is running Ubuntu).

Tom
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  #31  
Old 04.10.2012, 20:09
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Re: Swiss Schooling - Apple Mac Only?

I'm no Apple hater. I think their build quality is much better that many other competitors.

The iPad was a 'revelation' for me - fell from the table a couple of times -still works - plus what a battery life! I have stopped lugging around my laptop everywhere.

Last edited by sva; 04.10.2012 at 20:10. Reason: missed words
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  #32  
Old 04.10.2012, 20:41
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Re: Swiss Schooling - Apple Mac Only?

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Why not give school kids the choice as well the exposure to both systems. I will go one step further, in fact : why should it not be MANDATORY to have basic exposure to both currently dominant systems?
It depends what you mean by "exposure to" exactly. Surely your kids can get exposure to Windows at home (just buy them a laptop to play on if you want) If by exposure you mean in the "home use - desktop" sector then yeah, Windows and Mac OSX, but if you mean more in the sense of learning computer skills for careers in IT or ICT world etc then you need to look at different sectors before considering which are the "both currently dominant systems".

Tablets: ios and android
Phones: android and ios or (symbian?)
Servers: Linux and other unix
Mainframes: z and linux
HPC: linux and other unix
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  #33  
Old 04.10.2012, 21:58
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Re: Swiss Schooling - Apple Mac Only?

I meant home use only, and I don't even know the full form for HPC
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  #34  
Old 04.10.2012, 22:06
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Re: Swiss Schooling - Apple Mac Only?

BTW, would any of you great people be kind enough to suggest a good 'movie maker' for the Mac. - preferably free like the one that comes bundled with windows?

Thanks in advance.
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  #35  
Old 04.10.2012, 22:17
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Re: Swiss Schooling - Apple Mac Only?

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BTW, would any of you great people be kind enough to suggest a good 'movie maker' for the Mac. - preferably free like the one that comes bundled with windows?

Thanks in advance.
I use iMovie. It also comes bundled free.
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  #36  
Old 04.10.2012, 22:31
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Re: Swiss Schooling - Apple Mac Only?

At school I had one lesson a week for two years on Acorn Archimedes computers running RISC OS.

And before anyone says that that must have been ages ago: the years began with 2...

Plenty of my class are now in computing jobs, and as far as I know noone has any trouble using a PC. Anything we needed to know we picked up at home or on the job - the same reason none of us starved, even though we weren't taught to cook at school. No school taught you to use a phone, car, ATM or VCR either.

If anything is to be taught at school, it should be the very basics of programming - and that is (very largely) OS independent. Anything less abstract will more than likely be obsolete before they've picked up their school-leaving certificates.
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  #37  
Old 04.10.2012, 23:11
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Re: Swiss Schooling - Apple Mac Only?

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At school I had one lesson a week for two years on Acorn Archimedes computers running RISC OS.

And before anyone says that that must have been ages ago: the years began with 2...

Plenty of my class are now in computing jobs, and as far as I know noone has any trouble using a PC. Anything we needed to know we picked up at home or on the job - the same reason none of us starved, even though we weren't taught to cook at school. No school taught you to use a phone, car, ATM or VCR either.

If anything is to be taught at school, it should be the very basics of programming - and that is (very largely) OS independent. Anything less abstract will more than likely be obsolete before they've picked up their school-leaving certificates.
Exactly.

Demanding a school teach you different operating systems is a bit like demanding a driving instructor teaches you different car models.
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  #38  
Old 05.10.2012, 00:00
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Re: Swiss Schooling - Apple Mac Only?

Ummm ... I'm not exactly 'demanding' that the schools 'teach' a different OS. All I'm saying is that the school infrastructure should at least provide a choice - the lack of choice can't be blamed on 'resources' - not in CH i'm sure. So the only logical explanation I can think of is that MacOS is the ONLY OS of the future, and MS has already been consigned to the dustbin as far as the schools are concerned - except for a (perhaps grudging) acceptance of MS Office.

Again, it's not about better, it's about choice - that also between 2, not multiple.
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  #39  
Old 05.10.2012, 00:20
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Re: Swiss Schooling - Apple Mac Only?

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So the only logical explanation I can think of is that MacOS is the ONLY OS of the future,
Nope. It's more that the touchy-feely-artsy crowd (and they're plenty in the school system IME) seems to have a strong affinity to Apple computers.
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Old 05.10.2012, 12:03
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Re: Swiss Schooling - Apple Mac Only?

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Ummm ... I'm not exactly 'demanding' that the schools 'teach' a different OS. All I'm saying is that the school infrastructure should at least provide a choice -.

Giving more "choice" would make things more difficult for the school (different suppliers, different support structures) while delivering virtually no added value for pupils. It's almost like demanding they be given the "choice" of different models of desk to sit at. It sounds very much like a rich person's problem to me.

Macs are much cheaper and easier to support than Windows machines, and in a school environment with lots of budding smart brains constantly finding ways of "customizing" their system, being able to deliver efficient and painless support is primordial.
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